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Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.10.31 15:01:00 - [31]
 

Supported, small blasters are somewhat ok (mostly due to some great hulls to slap them on) but med and large blasters do need loving, or their bonused ships *or* the metagame.

I never went with the Amarr bandwagon yet but incidentally I started to go for med projectile spec just as the boost was announced and can quite fast crosstrain lasers after that...

Nick Bison
Gallente
Bison Industrial Inc

Posted - 2009.11.01 05:46:00 - [32]
 

Edited by: Nick Bison on 01/11/2009 05:46:04
Med & Large Blasters need some assist.
Either that or the Deimos needs a + to PG and Speed

Spugg Galdon
Posted - 2009.11.01 16:19:00 - [33]
 

i agree that blasters need fixing. At the minute they are horrifying. They are the close range extreme damage weapon that can't hit a space station if you have any transversel. I mean what is going on there? Blasters should be terrifying. Your counter is simple. Stay out of thier range. However if you slip into optimal it should pretty much be game over. A tracking bonused ship ie megathron, should never miss when in fall off and rarely miss in optimal with max skills vs similar sized target with average speed unless you are being td.

To summerise,
Blasters need a huge boost to tracking
Blasters need a slight boost to base damage
Leave webs alone. Pirates are getting them to go with blaster boats so i worry that they will become super powerful, which they should be anyway with these fixes.
Leave blaster range as is. Its perfect if blasters had these fixes
For the love of eve. Fix t2 heavy damage ammo. The draw backs vs benefits are terrible.

Thank you and goodnight

nafiy gnaw
Posted - 2009.11.01 17:46:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Spugg Galdon
i agree that blasters need fixing. At the minute they are horrifying. They are the close range extreme damage weapon that can't hit a space station if you have any transversel. I mean what is going on there? Blasters should be terrifying. Your counter is simple. Stay out of thier range. However if you slip into optimal it should pretty much be game over. A tracking bonused ship ie megathron, should never miss when in fall off and rarely miss in optimal with max skills vs similar sized target with average speed unless you are being td.

To summerise,
Blasters need a huge boost to tracking
Blasters need a slight boost to base damage
Leave webs alone. Pirates are getting them to go with blaster boats so i worry that they will become super powerful, which they should be anyway with these fixes.
Leave blaster range as is. Its perfect if blasters had these fixes
For the love of eve. Fix t2 heavy damage ammo. The draw backs vs benefits are terrible.

Thank you and goodnight


Remove the -50% tracking penalty of void ammo, should work?

Xahara
StarFleet Enterprises
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.01 18:12:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: nafiy gnaw
Originally by: Spugg Galdon
i agree that blasters need fixing. At the minute they are horrifying. They are the close range extreme damage weapon that can't hit a space station if you have any transversel. I mean what is going on there? Blasters should be terrifying. Your counter is simple. Stay out of thier range. However if you slip into optimal it should pretty much be game over. A tracking bonused ship ie megathron, should never miss when in fall off and rarely miss in optimal with max skills vs similar sized target with average speed unless you are being td.

To summerise,
Blasters need a huge boost to tracking
Blasters need a slight boost to base damage
Leave webs alone. Pirates are getting them to go with blaster boats so i worry that they will become super powerful, which they should be anyway with these fixes.
Leave blaster range as is. Its perfect if blasters had these fixes
For the love of eve. Fix t2 heavy damage ammo. The draw backs vs benefits are terrible.

Thank you and goodnight


Remove the -50% tracking penalty of void ammo, should work?


Still, Void damage is not enough. But that's a good thought, maybe boost Hybrid ammo, especifically Void and Null, and definitely way more tracking.

Maxsim Goratiev
Gallente
Imperial Tau Syndicate
POD-SQUAD
Posted - 2009.11.02 12:11:00 - [36]
 

void reduces range and tracking, from that i conclude that it is designed to be used against larger tangets, e.g. frigs against bs, of bs against caps.
Currently there damage is too low.

Spugg Galdon
Posted - 2009.11.03 00:26:00 - [37]
 

Yes. If they keep the draw back of -%50 tracking and up the damage ALOT it would work well.

CCP have a month to implement changes and test them before dominion is deployed. I know there is alot happening this expansion but this is a simple fix that can be heavily tested and deployed within this time frame.... Come CCP... give us our blasters back!

Shawn Dikarri
Limited Liability Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.03 03:28:00 - [38]
 

/support

Think of the blasters in Eve as a shotgun in Counter Strike or Halo. You gotta move fast or blind side someone to really poon them. Aside the KDR being negative, it sure is funny!

In eve, I do not feel this way with the blasters' properties. Its either tank or gank of course, you cant do both I know this but there could be an upper with tracking (better hits).


I dont know how to fix it, but Im sure y'all can figure something out.

My 2cents

Dors Venabily
Posted - 2009.11.03 11:29:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Stil Harkonnen
Originally by: Gypsio III
Oh noes my short-range weapon is short-ranged!
The problem is lasers, and Scorch in particular.

It's always better to nerf than to boost, it avoids power creep and creates entertaining whine threads.



oh noes my short ranged weapon is in many cases out damaged by long range weapons which are supposed to be short range weapons.

of course we're whining to get boosted....


Worked for AmarrRolling Eyes

Morar Santee
Posted - 2009.11.03 17:36:00 - [40]
 

Blasters do really need some fixing.

- a tiny bit more damage
- a lot better tracking
- make Gallente blaster ships the most agile (will be relativated by plates/trimarks anyway)

Makes for nicely working blaster-boats. In their current state, I just stopped flying them.

Spugg Galdon
Posted - 2009.11.03 20:02:00 - [41]
 

Yes yes yes.
Exactly what blasters need. Don't nerf lasers... they work very well (aprt from scorch ammo, I mean WTF??)

Blasters need much much better tracking.
Blasters need a slight boost to damage so that they ARE the heavy damage weapon
Blaster boats shouldn't have very high agility, just slightly better base speed to close range. Seems as blaster boats usually are plated which slows them right down and just not fast enough to be nano'd (even though being very fast in a blaster boat makes you useless)

C'MON CCP... Get this fixed for dominion. PLEEEEEAAAASE!!!

Alfons Richthofen
Posted - 2009.11.04 08:19:00 - [42]
 

Uh no way.
Lasers take a **** bag of cap to fire. Most Amarr ships aren't even cap stable ONLY firing their guns. The Hybrid capacitor usage is just too small for it to be able to focus energy that far (or in this case launch something). Increasing their damage or range will make the already-overpowered Gallente battleships even more overpowered.

Ivanna Nukya
Gallente
The Black Legionnares
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2009.11.04 08:45:00 - [43]
 

I agree blasters need a boost, either more range or more punch. medium blasters need more range for sure.

Alfons Richthofen
Posted - 2009.11.04 11:39:00 - [44]
 

You're all forgetting that blaster gunships usually have a superior drone bay. For example the Zealot's 0 drone bay, the sacrilege's 15(15 band) drone bay VS the Ishtar's 125+250(125band) and the Deimos' 50.

If Gallente weapons were just as versatile as lasers what would the Amarr have?

nafiy gnaw
Posted - 2009.11.04 12:32:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Alfons Richthofen
You're all forgetting that blaster gunships usually have a superior drone bay. For example the Zealot's 0 drone bay, the sacrilege's 15(15 band) drone bay VS the Ishtar's 125+250(125band) and the Deimos' 50.

If Gallente weapons were just as versatile as lasers what would the Amarr have?


And the Ishtar has more or less 0 guns and the deimos is just pure broken whether used with blaster or railguns?

OzDeaDMeaT
Gallente
StarForged Universal Assembly

Posted - 2009.11.04 16:11:00 - [46]
 

Agreed. Im tired of seeing PvP noobs flyin around in Caldari ships with FoF missiles and do AFK PvP cause my Deimos can't lay down damage from even abit of range. (Especially with T2 Blaster Ammo).

Supported

The Djego
Minmatar
Hellequin Inc.
Posted - 2009.11.04 18:17:00 - [47]
 

Edited by: The Djego on 04/11/2009 18:18:04
In general throw a role bonus(37.5% web strength increase, what makes 60% webs 75% webs) on dedicated blaster ships(thorax, diemos, brutix, Astarte, Mega, Hype) and balance from there(what only leaves minor things). You will end up with good solo ships, deadly close range PVP machines and make them own at short range again instead of being only handy caped with range. Simply the same thing you had pre QR.

Nick Bison
Gallente
Bison Industrial Inc
Posted - 2009.11.04 20:17:00 - [48]
 

Edited by: Nick Bison on 04/11/2009 20:18:42
Originally by: Maxsim Goratiev
void reduces range and tracking, from that i conclude that it is designed to be used against larger tangets, e.g. frigs against bs, of bs against caps.
Currently there damage is too low.


Let's see: Void -25% range, -50% tracking speed, -50% falloff, +25% cap and IIRC also slows the boats overall speed when loaded.
Great formula for disaster when flying a blaster boat.

Nick Bison
Gallente
Bison Industrial Inc
Posted - 2009.11.04 20:57:00 - [49]
 

Hey CSM members.
Where do you all stand on this one?
Curious as to wether or not this will make it to your recommendations section.

Any info is appreciated

EdvensoR
Gallente
Preeternal Spark
SOLAR FLEET
Posted - 2009.11.05 04:26:00 - [50]
 

Just replace these bonuses:
Deimos - stupid mwd-cap-penalty bonuses (and increase capacitor capacity)
Brutix/Eos/Astarte/Hyperion - armor rep bonus

for

Stasis web bonus like Kronos?

Blastil
Posted - 2009.11.05 15:18:00 - [51]
 

Edited by: Blastil on 05/11/2009 15:18:23
I would like to point out a few different problems with blasters. Blaster tracking is fine, I have no problems hitting targets, however these must be addressed.

1.) all ships which deploy them do not receive the bonuses required to make them work. the Deimos can't fit an effective buffer tank without gimping its speed, and can't fit an active tank at all. Additionally it lacks the cost effectiveness to fit a glass cannon setup like a Thorax. this is a problem with some other blaster boats, but the Deimos shows it the worst. so revist the bonuses and ship designs for gallente.

2.) Give me like 3KM more to play in optimal? FFS, if i orbit at 2500 M I hit at optimal, but if I orbit at 4000 M I hit for **** all. that's just not right. (level 4 and 5 skills...) basically a slight buff to optimals. this could even be handled with gallente ships.

Vestus Regula
The Black Dawn Gang
High Treason Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.05 18:14:00 - [52]
 

More damage, more tracking, more range on medium / small variants.

Gary Goat
Yakuza Corp

Posted - 2009.11.05 19:14:00 - [53]
 

Yes i agree 100% with the OP.

In regards to the deimos i'd like to see the following changes:

Switch the MWD bonus for an AB speed bonus like the AFs on sisi have
Switch the falloff bonus for a tracking bonus

It will give the deimos a unique role and allow it complete range control within scrambler range. You'd also have the option to try to disengage if things go bad.

You might even be able to fit somthing in that utility hi slot with the lower fitting cost of the AB Smile

Xahara
StarFleet Enterprises
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2009.11.05 21:46:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Gary Goat
Yes i agree 100% with the OP.

In regards to the deimos i'd like to see the following changes:

Switch the MWD bonus for an AB speed bonus like the AFs on sisi have
Switch the falloff bonus for a tracking bonus

It will give the deimos a unique role and allow it complete range control within scrambler range. You'd also have the option to try to disengage if things go bad.

You might even be able to fit somthing in that utility hi slot with the lower fitting cost of the AB Smile




You know what, I love this idea. I would actually fly a Deimos if it had such bonuses :)

Banlish
Gallente
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas.
Posted - 2009.11.06 17:25:00 - [55]
 


When the speed changes hit the server and everything slowed down and webbers were changed I said "okay what's a reasonable amount of time for CCP to realize that my gallente bs's are screwed over and I'll give em that time to 'fix' the problem before I do something drastic." The goal was 60 days. **I will now make fun of the ammar race for the rest of this post.**

60 days hit and nothing, so I said "well, I hate missiles, and I don't want to fly duct tape into battle so that leaves ammar and their L4Z0Rz of death..."

So I started training ammar, with the notion that by the time I could fly ALL ammmmarr ships with level 4 skills they would fix gallente and I can keep flying the ships I've known and loved for the last 3+ years till the nerf. But no, months have ticked by and I looked up today.

I can fly every single amaaaaaaaaaaaaaar ship in the game except capitals and I can use full tech 2 on both. But still not even a peep about 'fixing' gallente....

k...

So here I am, I LOVE my blaster boats. Charge up to an enemy, double web them to gumby in winter mode and lay down some JUSTICE!!!!. Yeah that's how it used to be. Now it's charge up to enemy slowly (MWD nerf) but fleets are still the same distance apart it seems! Oh noes! So more of my precious capacitor is gone. Finally get in range and 'HA HA!' I exclaim as I fire my web on that damn other bs going 800m/s he'll slow to 100 m/s like before! nope. He's still going 400 m/s. (webber nerf) So obviously I need a second web to get the same effect, np *opens EFT and has 4 mids to work with* k, webber check, cap injector check, scram check, mwd 100mn check. "hrm, seems I don't have enough slots." And can't take anything off, interesting."

Well I could work with the tacklers but warping around even once messes up any plan. I could take off my scram, but then he could just warp off. I can't take off my capa injector or I won't last more then 2 minutes in combat, of which 4 to 5 mintues will be spent mwding into the super close range. Well I can throw that idea out the window :) Even with 3 CCC rigs this thing gets a tad expensive whether hyper or mega. And when people see you going that close in, your going to get primaried into the stone age.

I don't want this to come off as whiny, it's more of a 'well, I hope they take a look at it at least!' Many people have brought this issue up before and it hasn't been addressed. Hopefully with enough 'supports' CSM will at least address the issue many of us seem to be having.

As for me?

I'm flying aaammmarr till it's fixed. Do I like aarrmammar? Not really, lasers are cool and all but I love the thump of a railgun tearing the air (that doesn't exist) in space like a giant... air.. ripping... device. ugh With laz0rs I get to hit from 30km, and usually tear apart the megat's trying to close the gap long before they arrive. Even with our similar 'close range fits'. So my ammamaamrmrrrr*hickup*rrars battleships, and such have my attention. I hope CCP will at least 'consider' fixing the gallente issues atm. And I hope the my beloved blaster boats get some loving :)

Till then tho...

-AMARARRARRRAAAAAAAR Victor!

*laugh damn you, LAUGH!*


Dograzor
The Black Rabbits
The Gurlstas Associates
Posted - 2009.11.06 20:37:00 - [56]
 

/signed

Fix blasters soon please.

Spugg Galdon
Posted - 2009.11.06 22:46:00 - [57]
 

Quote:
Uh no way.
Lasers take a **** bag of cap to fire. Most Amarr ships aren't even cap stable ONLY firing their guns. The Hybrid capacitor usage is just too small for it to be able to focus energy that far (or in this case launch something). Increasing their damage or range will make the already-overpowered Gallente battleships even more overpowered.


Yes Lasers are cap dependent. However they do not require ammo. Hybrids require both
Yes Amarr ships are cap stable. L3rn2fit
We don't want extra range as a whole.... we want better tracking with a bit more damage
Gallante battleships are not overpowered. They used to be a bit nasty but are now hopeless. If you need evidence of this... Megathrons are now so cheap if you buy one undock and blow it up with full insurance you make a profit

Quote:
You're all forgetting that blaster gunships usually have a superior drone bay. For example the Zealot's 0 drone bay, the sacrilege's 15(15 band) drone bay VS the Ishtar's 125+250(125band) and the Deimos' 50.

If Gallente weapons were just as versatile as lasers what would the Amarr have?


Gallante weapons will not be as versatile as lasers... They will still have next to no range. Drones can be easily destroyed and then you lose your dps in drones.
At the minute, lasers can do almost the same ammount of damage as blasters but and epic range. Blasters can't even hit their target at their optimal range and only slightly outdo lasers in damage.

Please... just better tracking and a smidge more DPS... its an easy fix... get it into sisi for testing please!!

Alfons Richthofen
Posted - 2009.11.07 09:42:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: nafiy gnaw
Originally by: Alfons Richthofen
You're all forgetting that blaster gunships usually have a superior drone bay. For example the Zealot's 0 drone bay, the sacrilege's 15(15 band) drone bay VS the Ishtar's 125+250(125band) and the Deimos' 50.

If Gallente weapons were just as versatile as lasers what would the Amarr have?


And the Ishtar has more or less 0 guns and the deimos is just pure broken whether used with blaster or railguns?


Lv5 skills used:
Zealot has 0 drones and 5 guns (276 dps, scorch, 1039.5pg/5 slots used, 34+5 range)
Ishtar has 5 drones and 3 guns (475 dps no guns, 0pg/slots used, 85km drone range, sentries do similar damage)

Quit crying you sack of sh*t, till heavy drones take power grid and slots, your argument is completely stupid. The Ishtar doesn't have to fit a single thing to worry about damage while the Zealot needs to sacrifice 3 low slots to compare to the Ishtar's damage. Also gunboats have to worry about tracking when something gets too close too, the Zealot can't track any kind of frigate that tackles it up close while the Ishtar can neut the **** out of it and sic drones on it.

The only change that should be done to the Deimos is another medium slot for a web and maybe one less high slot in exchange.

Walmatar
Posted - 2009.11.07 15:54:00 - [59]
 

Buff tracking, and what the hell, give them a sig res boost as well.

nafiy gnaw
Posted - 2009.11.07 17:38:00 - [60]
 

Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 07/11/2009 17:42:03
Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 07/11/2009 17:41:10
Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 07/11/2009 17:40:57
Edited by: nafiy gnaw on 07/11/2009 17:38:32
Originally by: Alfons Richthofen
Originally by: nafiy gnaw
Originally by: Alfons Richthofen
You're all forgetting that blaster gunships usually have a superior drone bay. For example the Zealot's 0 drone bay, the sacrilege's 15(15 band) drone bay VS the Ishtar's 125+250(125band) and the Deimos' 50.

If Gallente weapons were just as versatile as lasers what would the Amarr have?


And the Ishtar has more or less 0 guns and the deimos is just pure broken whether used with blaster or railguns?


Lv5 skills used:
Zealot has 0 drones and 5 guns (276 dps, scorch, 1039.5pg/5 slots used, 34+5 range)
Ishtar has 5 drones and 3 guns (475 dps no guns, 0pg/slots used, 85km drone range, sentries do similar damage)

Quit crying you sack of sh*t, till heavy drones take power grid and slots, your argument is completely stupid. The Ishtar doesn't have to fit a single thing to worry about damage while the Zealot needs to sacrifice 3 low slots to compare to the Ishtar's damage. Also gunboats have to worry about tracking when something gets too close too, the Zealot can't track any kind of frigate that tackles it up close while the Ishtar can neut the **** out of it and sic drones on it.

The only change that should be done to the Deimos is another medium slot for a web and maybe one less high slot in exchange.


Hail, EFT warrior for the win.

You DO realise that what looks good in EFT dont necessarily mean its gonna be useful in battle?

1: Heavy drones require 80-100 seconds (and that is with drone navigation lvl5) to travel 85km to target. I can align and escape in a Frieghter 5 times in 100 seconds. A sniper that actually requires 80 seconds to touch its target? lol.

2: Sentry drone is instant but only Curator hits to 70km and its the worst damage Sentry,a sniper HAC can easily hit 100km and laugh at the sentry as a stationary sentry is just completely incapable of chasing down any thing.

3. Same old argument: You can destroy drones(easily), you cannot destroy someone's turrent.

4. A drone boat cannot agro anyone at station or Gate in low-sec otherwise its byebye omfpwned drones. And that is 95% of the battle in low-sec cannot be fought in a Ishtar.

And, your argument just fails: A 85KM sniper is never a good sniper, let alone it rely on drones to "snipe", lol.

Neither is calling someone a bag of whatever add any weight to your argument, if you have any sort of argument in the first place. Which is, a big fat NO.

-nafiy


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