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blankseplocked Truth about EVE's "great" GFX's?
 
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Zan Valis
Posted - 2009.10.23 16:45:00 - [61]
 

Edited by: Zan Valis on 23/10/2009 16:46:42
EVE is beautifull, probably one of the prettiest games Ive ever played and to boot its the most in-depth game Ive ever played. Having both of those in one game is rare, and thats what makes EVE so great. I agree with most others here, I could care less how the graphics are actually done, if it looks good then great, thats what graphics are.. looks.

I find that persons comments extremely unprofessional to say the least, its one thing from a fan, its another from a Dev. Further to that, if you need to slag a game thats been around for 7 years to make yours (which hasent even been released yet) look good then you're off to a very bad start...


DigitalCommunist
November Corporation
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:09:00 - [62]
 

A lot of models in EVE have crappy textures and jaggies, but not because of the model mesh. Their normal maps are just really low resolution. I think they fixed most of the problems with Apocrypha though.

EVE's biggest graphical issue is the wide spectrum of quality stuff falls onto. You have assets that look as good as any modern game, and assets that should go back to the decade they belong to.

However, JGE isn't really the game to criticize EVE for graphics. Black Prophecy is the game that make EVE look grey and old.

Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:11:00 - [63]
 

Is there a way to stop the sun from blinding the view whenever you are looking at something infront of it?

Illwill Bill
Svea Crusaders
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:17:00 - [64]
 

EVE uses crappy models, shoddy textures, short-cuts, and cheats to produce a good visual experience. The result is frackin' awesome!


Julien Olivier
The Society for Creative Euthanasia
Posted - 2009.10.23 17:46:00 - [65]
 

nit·pick·ing (ntpkng)
n.
Minute, trivial, unnecessary, and unjustified criticism or faultfinding.

-x-

Eve looks gorgeous. Ask me if i care how they accomplish it.

Catherine Frasier
Posted - 2009.10.23 18:17:00 - [66]
 

Originally by: Skippermonkey
Is there a way to stop the sun from blinding the view whenever you are looking at something infront of it?
I do agree that certain aspect of Eve's graphics are, well, damned annoying. Suns and nebulae make swaths of space so bright that you can't see some of the UI elements. You'd think that if I was going to have a computer pump visual information directly into my brain somewhere in the system there would be control. If not content control (as in a turn-off-those-nebulae switch) then at least a brightness control. It's a bit silly that I would ever have to turn the camera away, looking for an angle that would let me find some button or read something.

Jekyl Eraser
Posted - 2009.10.23 18:19:00 - [67]
 

Edited by: Jekyl Eraser on 23/10/2009 18:27:50
Yeah agree EVE graphics are kinda messed up and low quality. Not as messed up as the sounds, but the worst is user friendliness in every aspect from graphics to sounds to the UI.

I don't think focusing into graphics is the way to go if you plan on making a good game as a long term plan. You need to update the graphics every 3 years to keep players happy. You won't even see the ships that much for the graphics to matter.

I'm guessing Dust 514 took the eve graphics team for 3 years. Think they took 75% of our monthly payments too to develop a console game.

What seems kinda weird to me, it looks like EVE team is focusing VERY much on trying to keep the client as small as possible. Textures are very low detailed, the effects are copies of eachother, ships use same hulls with tiny chnages, sounds have no variation... looping and repeating everywhere, asteroids have 1 model that is just resized, rotated and lighted differently, one is huge as a carrier while another is smaller than my rifter but yet it uses same heavy polygon model as the carrier size. I'm guessing carrier and frigate both use as much resources when it comes to graphics.

Zahidra
Caldari
Ancient Silence
Posted - 2009.10.23 18:51:00 - [68]
 

Im no 3d expert in the sense of knowing a good mesh when i look at one, but i do think the result is what counts and eve has very nice results considering the rather low system reqs.
Im always in favor of cooler looking graphics, but for a game like eve there needs to be a good balance between performance and bling.
I currently run 3 clients with everything but shadows turned on at full HD res (granted, only 2 clients are being rendered at any given time due to 2 monitor limit) on a 4830 card that cost me about 100€ 8 months ago.
Id say thats a pretty good accomplishment considering the low budget card and how good the game looks.

Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.10.23 20:14:00 - [69]
 

Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 23/10/2009 20:20:08
Eve is laden with crappy textures, seams, spots of blurriness, jagged bump maps, lazy artistry, and flat-out errors. Just look at the front or side of a standard Dominix, the back end of a Falcon, just about any ship with symmetry (the front of the Erebus is a good example, and so's the Hyperion), turret placement on many ships, etc.

It's massively annoying, especially when they were at one point given awards for how good their stuff looked. Maybe once Dust is done they can bring back their good artists.

(EDIT: Oh yeah, how could I forget sprite effects? Stuff like ECCM and certain gas clouds being a sprite that always faces you got old with DOOM! Why the heck is it still being used close to 2010?!)

Verone
Gallente
Veto Corp
Posted - 2009.10.23 21:02:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Seriah Rezin
Originally by: Verone
I'm sorry, what?

I can't...

...hear his whining...

...over the sound...

...of how ****ing awesome...

...and visually stunning...

...Eve Online...

...happens to be...

...with a good...

...set of hardware.

I also challenge him to do better...


My only critique of this - and this is a great post - is that the '...set of hardware' link should've led to a picture of a nice computer rig. Otherwise? Beautiful.


lol sure... although I'm ashamed to say...

I have...

...the world's...

...most tidy...

...computer desk.

Laughing


ceaon
Posted - 2009.10.23 22:14:00 - [71]
 

Originally by: ShadowMaster
stuff

you should really press ALT when you make a screen capture just saying

Ferdio Ricotez
Gallente
Posted - 2009.10.23 22:50:00 - [72]
 

Being a frequent miner, I often find myself staring at my Hulk for extensive periods of time. And dang, I have taken some beautiful screenshots.

You can say what you want about the mirror polish, but it's really what sets the graphics of EVE apart from other MMOs out there. I for one think it's gorgeous, my screenshots of EVE have a level of beauty I haven't seen in many screenshots of other games.

SEN 5243
Posted - 2009.10.23 22:51:00 - [73]
 


fuze
Gallente
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2009.10.23 23:11:00 - [74]
 

Even if Eve would be just wireframes it would look good enough to me.

Computer GFX got way to fancy after Amiga's bouncing ball anyway.

Pudnucker
Exploratory Technologies
Posted - 2009.10.23 23:30:00 - [75]
 

I see a lot of "I know exactly what the graphics should look like and they are FAIL since I once sat next to a guy who used MAYA and therefore I know this" type comments but little practical knowledge on the way that game designers are forced to operate.

I have practical knowledge on the way that game designers operate and will most graciously share it with you.

Arrow Practical PC Requirements:

If you're making a game, starting today, you would go out and buy the best PC available and use it as the basis for your minimum system requirements.

Why? Because when your game is finished three years later the system that was once top notch is now the average system of the majority of the market that you're aiming at.

What does this mean? It means that the graphics you're seeing are, with few exceptions, the best visuals available at a reasonable frame rate on the highest end system available three years ago. What, you thought that it only took them two months to code the shiny new DX9 Engine and subsequent shiny new Engine improvements?

Arrow The Lowest Common Denominator.

If you're cheap, like me, and only spend money on PC gear when it's absolutely necessary then you'll certainly appreciate the fact that each ship model doesn't have 150,000 polygons AFTER normal mapping has been applied. When I earned my Degree in Visual Arts and Multimedia, it was in the first week that we learned that yes, prettier is better but it sure as hell isn't super-duper applicable to the very people you want to sell your game to.

Thus spake the majority of people who play games.

Arrow The Modelling Maxim

Make the prettiest looking models possible with the highest resolution textures possible and ensure that it runs at the highest frame rate possible on the 'oldest' equipment possible.

Total and utter Epic Fail for those who thought otherwise in re the three points outlined here.

Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
Posted - 2009.10.24 00:01:00 - [76]
 

Edited by: Zeba on 24/10/2009 00:02:54


The 'problem' with eves textures is not really the quality of the texture but the fact the zoom level is faaar too close for the majority of ships making even a very nice resolution texture look blurry and jaggy. Poor QA on the part of the graphics dept really though to be fair thats a crapload of ships to go though to test the up close view distances. Bad side effect of using sprints for developing nearly everything maybe?

Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.10.24 00:51:00 - [77]
 

Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 24/10/2009 00:51:46
Originally by: Pudnucker
I see a lot of "I know exactly what the graphics should look like and they are FAIL since I once sat next to a guy who used MAYA and therefore I know this" type comments but little practical knowledge on the way that game designers are forced to operate.

...

Total and utter Epic Fail for those who thought otherwise in re the three points outlined here.


The problem with Eve's graphics, despite your points, is that they are absolutely riddled with quality control issues regardless of what target hardware they use.

I shouldn't see bumpmapped seams in ships, nor should I see obvious crappy mirror-imaging (just about anything symmetric). Textures shouldn't have random blurry spots or screwy parallel lines that aren't (Dominix). Engine trails should match the engines they go with (just about anything). Circular objects should be circular (Providence). Color schemes that are supposed to the same should be the same (Navy Vexor vs new Navy Mega). Bumpmapping details should line up with what they're trying to complement (Blackbird). Bumpmapping details shouldn't be variably jaggy (Megathron). Turrets should be placed where 90% of their firing arc isn't blocked by protrusions (Megathron, etc). See where I'm going with this?

I'd complain less but I've seen free OSS projects get it right - or at the very least not so glaringly bad - not to mention most other games these days. It's the stupid little errors like that which build up and make what could have been good looking graphics with small overhead mediocre.

Jenni Falorgen
Nemissaries of Vengeance
Posted - 2009.10.24 02:16:00 - [78]
 

anyone remember that the Abaddon used to have a gaping hole on one of it's belly fins. you could see right through the ship.

they eventually replaced the fins with mini wings/nacelles and it was good.

the GFX on some of the new stuff (orca, T3s) is simply amazing. top notch!

I believe they stated during FF2009 that they will be going back and updating all the GFXs so as to be of similar quality of the new T3s.

Aeroxe
Minmatar
AWE Corporation
Posted - 2009.10.24 02:27:00 - [79]
 

Ok, I believe that I am an average gamer with little to no knowledge of this crap. I will tell you one thing,

WHO CARES! IT LOOKS GOOD! IT'S FUN!

For that matter lets take CCP under a fine tooth, criticize their program endlessly. Then do nothing about it (because we can't) because 90% of us wouldn't qualify for a janitor's job over there. Then let's not at all talk about how we like to criticize a game that we continually pay for month after month.

This is the thread that started this discussion!

A comment was made on the other forum calling it "cheap tricks so the game will also work on older computers". Seems to me that's a good idea. But that's just me looking at it from a marketing POV. More players = more money = longer life span = more depth = more fun...

Sit back and enjoy peeps! There's no other game that can compete with this one.


Aralieus
Amarr
Shadowbane Syndicate
Posted - 2009.10.24 03:07:00 - [80]
 

I have looked at JGE with a neutral outlook and I must say with all honesty....its crap! It lacks everything that Eve excells at tbh. Yes the graphics of eve could use some tweaking however given the depth of the content compared to JGE it kind of evens out as someone stated in a previous post. I am by no means a wizkid when it comes to graphics or all the technicalities that goes into it, but at no point do I remeber a time that I seen a image in-game and said 'wow, that looks so horrible I'm going to stop playing this fail". JGE has its role in the mmorpg community but from my perspective I would have to say its not in the same leauge or prerogative if you will as eve. Its rather twitchy and looks like it could get very boring very quickly, unlike Eve where it takes smarts and cunning to be succesful or even get recognition. I mean for christs sakes we have mercs Twisted Evil. As far as the graphics go, hmm. Well you decide....

JGE

Eve

I for one am going for the one that doesnt just look pretty but has actual meaning and content behind it.

BigBank Hank
Posted - 2009.10.24 03:26:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: Kuolematon
Hello,

Is this true? c/d


GBS^H^H^HGD demands that CCP defend it's honor by immediately implementing AA (in game).

harogen
Debitum Naturae
Posted - 2009.10.24 04:00:00 - [82]
 

Originally by: Verone
I'm sorry, what?

I can't...

...hear his whining...

...over the sound...

...of how ****ing awesome...

...and visually stunning...

...Eve Online...

...happens to be...

...with a good...

...set of hardware.

I also challenge him to do better...





erm, are those the best you have 0_o

I think eve looks great, but to their semi defense, a dev said that the eve models are heavily layered. That isn't a bad thing.

Sader Rykane
Amarr
The Dark Space Initiative
Revival Of The Talocan Empire
Posted - 2009.10.24 04:48:00 - [83]
 

You guys complain a lot.

Typhado3
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.10.24 05:32:00 - [84]
 

Originally by: Chribba
imo doesn't matter if it's true or not, it looks good in the end and that's all that matters to me, if they bloom the crap outta missing textures and sharp edges they got my approval as long as the end result is good.


this.

Eve needs to be able to show a lot more spaceships on the screen than most games so they can't just stick a million poligons into everything to make it look good the normal way. They have to come up with their own ways that let them do some pretty god damn amazing things while still looking sexy.


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