open All Channels
seplocked EVE Information Portal
blankseplocked New Dev Blog: Adding flavor to your faction meal
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6

Author Topic

Flamewave
Crimson Moon Society
Posted - 2009.10.19 20:55:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: Cornette
Sucks boatloads really but I'm not surprised in the slightest that they ignoring us. Its CCP thinking with their wallet firsthand. They got a load of unsold salad issue mega models so forcing us to suck it down is easier then scrap the models.

My most beautiful ship will now be a space forest. Woopidoo Mad

The space-forest camo is the reason I didn't buy the model and the reason I'm going to sell my navythron. At least I can put the isk towards something else, like more faction cruisers or something. ugh

Kashimir
Otoko no Baito
Posted - 2009.10.19 21:43:00 - [62]
 

Yes.
It's about time these get some love :)



I don't get it how come this camoskin have suddenly made up to be such a big cause of flame.
I mean Navy Vexor have always been with that skin and everyone loved it. :)

(Correct me if I'm wrong)

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:03:00 - [63]
 

i threw up in my mouth a little when you suggested that a pirate faction battleship be passive tanked

Sad

Kaalen
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:03:00 - [64]
 

Quote:
* Q: Why having camouflage skins on navy battleships? o A: The black and white skin you were used to on the Megathron Navy Issue has never been the proper Gallente Navy version paintjob and this is why it was changed. As some of you guessed, the correct one was already used on the EVE store Megathron Navy miniature. We are deeply sorry you may not like the new skins, however this unfortunately remains a matter of taste. But if you ask me, my preference would be that dreadnoughts in siege mode should transform into huge space robots with vacuum cleaners.


I feel that a lot of the new faction skins look lazily done and could have been done better/differently but I suppose I can live with it; but there's something about this answer which really irks me.

Saying "it's a matter of taste" doesn't really cut it in this situation. The taste that matters is that of your paying customers. I couldn't care less if your art department love the green camouflage, if enough of your player base dislikes it to warrant responding to them in an FAQ then you should consider that it needs changing.

Ariane VoxDei
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:14:00 - [65]
 

Would it really have hurt or been too much work to have provided 2 clean, up to date, posts with the changes in one place? Surely (i fervently hope) you have compiled such for internal use already.

I know that you know that the threads are not putting all the info straight into the first few official posts, so why didn't you?
You know how people are about not digging through the threads to compile a full list themselves. 30+ page threads at that.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:34:00 - [66]
 

Quote:
Q: Why does the Machariel not have a 8/7/5 layout?
A: This is quite a dilemma. While shield tanking would definitely help to keep the ship nimble by fitting low slots with appropriate modules, it would still conflict with PvP tackling equipment, which defeats the intended role of that vessel. Furthermore, it will keep a speed advantage even if armor plating a ship is your hobby.


actually that would be pretty awesome, the only midslot tackle it really needs is a point (30km preferably) Nightmare has similar slots and does fine, and almost every caldari ship has 6 or less midslots, they seem to work.

I dunno but I would love a 8/7/5 nano*** battleship Twisted Evil
+over 9000 internets if it can speed tank cruise missiles with an afterburner YARRRR!!

T'san Manaan
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:40:00 - [67]
 

Originally by: Abrazzar
Edited by: Abrazzar on 19/10/2009 17:04:08
Well, on the navy salad camo, I made a proposition adding to the others:

Navy ships in brushed steel, coal and cobalt lights:

Dominix
Vexor




Sexy

Zaknussem
Everybody Loves Donuts
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:43:00 - [68]
 

Quote:
Q: Why having camouflage skins on navy battleships?
A: The black and white skin you were used to on the Megathron Navy Issue has never been the proper Gallente Navy version paintjob and this is why it was changed. As some of you guessed, the correct one was already used on the EVE store Megathron Navy miniature. We are deeply sorry you may not like the new skins, however this unfortunately remains a matter of taste. But if you ask me, my preference would be that dreadnoughts in siege mode should transform into huge space robots with vacuum cleaners.


Aah, I missed that bit in the explanation (stupid me). Then the answer is obvious; the modellers screwed up when making the Navythron model, and CCP are trying to cover up the mistake by (gasp!) pretending it was to be that way all along.

Not a big issue in and of itself, but it seems to solidify the trend that October is the month when CCP act extra jerky. Wonder what the connection is to that?

Myheart Aflame
Posted - 2009.10.19 22:46:00 - [69]
 

The Hookbill is looking really bad at the moment, having 5 mids but not having enough cpu to fit any shield mods kinda kills it, it ends up being a slow crow.

Either rockets need to become a viable weapon system (some hope) to free up at least some fittings, or its need enough cpu to at least fit some kind of tank, currently its a struggle to fit it with more than just a small shield extender and a sensor booster even with all L5 fitting skills.

Nikita Alterana
Kumiho's Smile
Posted - 2009.10.20 00:06:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: CCP Ytterbium
Faction ships obtainable through low/null-security space criminal organizations (Angel Cartel, Blood Raiders, Guristas, Sansha's Nation and Guristas) are sorted as pirate ships.

don't forget the guristas!

Ghoest
Posted - 2009.10.20 00:23:00 - [71]
 

1 Make a new list of the changes that linked thread is a useless mess of convoluted updates.

2 The new Navy tempest is worse than the old Navy Tempest. And the old Navy Tempest sucked.

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2009.10.20 00:44:00 - [72]
 

Obviously, the new camo paint jobs are to keep enemy fleets from spotting you as you loom ominously over the Dusties in low orbit. Laughing

Cyzlak
Karkand Kampa
Posted - 2009.10.20 00:57:00 - [73]
 

Originally by: Reten Kip
Edited by: Reten Kip on 19/10/2009 16:30:40
Quote:
* Q: Why having camouflage skins on navy battleships? o A: The black and white skin you were used to on the Megathron Navy Issue has never been the proper Gallente Navy version paintjob and this is why it was changed. As some of you guessed, the correct one was already used on the EVE store Megathron Navy miniature. We are deeply sorry you may not like the new skins, however this unfortunately remains a matter of taste. But if you ask me, my preference would be that dreadnoughts in siege mode should transform into huge space robots with vacuum cleaners.


MAY not like the new skins? 90% of the responses to those skins say they're JUNK. Why not just make it hot pink, at least then it wouldn't be trying to be legitimate. Better yet, just take the damn ship out of the game entirely.

You guys used the same excuse when you knocked the Helios out of the park with the ugly stick. You could have swapped Imicus/Maulus/Keres/Helios around since nobody flies the Maulus/Keres, but NO. You decided it would be better to kick all the Gallente pilots in the nuts and to hell with what your PAYING CUSTOMERS thought about it.

Now, you're going to do it AGAIN. Do you guys not understand that the camo skin is horrid? Whatever artist thought it looked good doesn't deserve the title and should be demoted.

You've been given many suggestions that DON'T SUCK. Allow me to reiterate a few:

* Leave the damn thing alone. <-- BEST SUGGESTION
* Roden style paint scheme <-- SECOND BEST SUGGESTION
* Naval camo that DOESN'T SUCK
Examples of Naval Camo that doesn't suck, pick one and use it:
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/3995/50819321pv1.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/USS_Louisville_CA-28-600px.JPG
http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/military-camouflage-6.jpg
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/images/h92000/h92362.jpg

As it stands now I'm either going to sell my salad issue Megathron, or just trash it. I'm leaning toward trashing it.





A+++++++ post. Would read again.




Out loud.





To an audience.


Laughing

Jei'son Bladesmith
The Storm Knights
The Cool Kids Club
Posted - 2009.10.20 01:41:00 - [74]
 

My machariels a ****ing hot rod with guns

I endorse this product and/or service

Kaito Haakkainen
Posted - 2009.10.20 03:05:00 - [75]
 

Succubus is not as good as the Slicer, Retribution, Crusader in their respective roles while having no distinct role of it's own such as the Cruor and Sentinel.

Phantasm is not as good as the Navy Omen or Zealot in their respective roles while having no distinct role of it's own such as the Ashimmu, Pilgrim, Curse, Devoter, and Guardian.

Nightmare in PvE offers slightly greater DPS for slightly less tank compared with the Paladin while losing the tractor bonus and cargo hold. This is with a Gistii C-Type XL booster fitted which isn't particularly viable outside of hi-sec. In PvP where a Gistii tank isn't really sensible and mids are sacrificed for tackle, EWAR, or ECCM the Paladin wins out. The Navy 'Geddon offers significantly more damage than either while sporting an impressive tank and room left over for RR. The Bhaalgorn and Navy Apoc have distinctive roles that set them apart.

On a basic level the Blooder ships have -25% tracking and -25% damage, with bonused webs that make tracking far easier and bonused neuts which work wonders vs active tanks and the hardeners on typical passive shield tanks. Both these bonuses apply to everyone shooting the target, with the latter possibly leaving the target unable to shoot back, tackle, speedtank, RR, EW, or withdraw. All this with better cap stability and while fitting a superior tank when tackling mods are considered.

The problem isn't the Navy, t2 or Blood Raider ships, it's the Sansha ships complete lack of anything special that sets them apart like the Blooder nuet and webs, the Gurista cap/ewar resistance, the Serpentis falloff and web bonuses, and the Angels speed, agility and falloff. They're effectively tech 1.2 with little to justify their cost vs t1 and nothing to set them apart from other faction and t2 ships. The only thing they have going for them is the fact that they look fantastic.

[There's also the less balance oriented issue of Sansha hardning, energized resistance, resistance, and armour rep modules alongside the armour hit-point boosting Slave implant set for a faction that now shield tanks.]

Other than that, and the atrocious Navy Mega and Fleet 'Phoon paint jobs, the changes look excellent with everything but the Vindicator and Sansha ships looking like very worthwhile additions to any hangar.

Doc Brown
Gallente
Capital Construction Research
Pioneer Alliance
Posted - 2009.10.20 03:30:00 - [76]
 

Originally by: Bellum Eternus

<snip>

The Vindicator? It can't do any more peak gun DPS than the Kronos or Hyperiorn. Once you consider the rep bonuses of both those ships, and the numerous advantages of the Kronos over the Vindi, there is really little reason to choose the Vindi over either the Hype or the Kronos.

All of the reasons you list as an advantage for the Vindicator: speed, agility, sensor strength- none of those are worth anything. Your guns will miss 100% of the time if you're moving even the smallest amount, so speed and agility don't count for anything. Sensor strength? You'll still be jammed solid by a Falcon even if you have two ECCM fit, so what is the point in calling slightly higher sensor strength an advantage?

I don't even know why I bother posting however. Nothing will be changed.



Total Truth.

I wish the CCP dev's would take the blinders off and listen to the accurate criticism.


Yon Krum
The Knights Templar
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2009.10.20 04:17:00 - [77]
 

Originally by: Namtar
I read this:

Q: Can we have ships from mini-factions like the Equilibrium of Mankind?
A: Offering EoM ships to players would either mean having them drop through loot somehow, which is not really acceptable, or require them to be a fully fledged pirate organization, with territory, asteroid belt infestation, LP stores, agents and complexes. Doing so is a tremendous task which is not planned or even considered at the time being.


But what about Khanid Kingdom? They are a fully fledged organization with agents and such.


Khanid are an obvious hole, as are Ammatar. (Waiting for Ammatar Fleet Abbadon, thanks.)

Also, Interbus, Intaki, Mordus, SoE, and/or Syndicate ships. Really, here's how you do these "smaller" faction ships: seed their LP stores. Done!

For Drone, EoM, and etc, you do this: seed some hacking/combat sites with the chance to drop BP. The EoM don't have their own space, so you make a (very low) chance that the specific site spawns in some other faction's space (like Blood Raiders, perhaps).

In general, if you don't have the tech to mix faction site spawns in a given region of space, this is a hole that needs filling--even the missions highlight how the pirate factions frequently come into conflict by intruding on each other's operations!

Your excuses for not doing Rogue Drone ships is feeble: the RD make ships out of materials like anyone else does--they just have their own AI and other bizarre tech that's used in the process of controlling them. As demonstrated in chronicles, that AI can be reprogrammed back into a more "normal" form. It could also be wiped clean and replaced with something more suitable to pod-pilot interfacing.

Just do the RD ships, and stop making excuses. We want our tentacle battleships!

--Krum

Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.10.20 04:25:00 - [78]
 

Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 20/10/2009 04:27:08
Originally by: Kashimir
Yes.
It's about time these get some love :)



I don't get it how come this camoskin have suddenly made up to be such a big cause of flame.
I mean Navy Vexor have always been with that skin and everyone loved it. :)

(Correct me if I'm wrong)


A few did complain (I for one thought the old black-and-gold Navy Vexor looked far better, especially with the wide range of colors brought on by the system lighting differences), but:

  1. The amount of people who fly or even look at navy cruisers is FAR lower than the amount of people who fly navy battleships (because for the most part faction cruisers are not worth the resources compared to HACs ...) thereby reducing the people who would post about it.

  2. Unlike the Navy Dominix especially, the Navy Vexor/Deimos (and Mega, to be fair) camouflage somehow avoided the typical "Let's Make Everything Symmetric Even If It Looks Like Crap Because We're A Bunch Of Lazy Sods" mode. But then, the totality of THAT mode is best left for its own thread ...

  3. The new Navy BS camo schemes aren't even the same colors as the navy cruiser schemes. (slow clap for CCP here!) The Navy BS paint looks like Day-Glo compared to the Navy Cruiser paint, and it's not a good effect. Given their love of inappropriate copying and pasting, you'd figure they'd be all over the eyedropper tool! Rolling Eyes

  4. It doesn't take an art critic to figure out that the black-and-white effect, the evolution of the originally-all-black Navy Mega, looks orders of magnitude better than the current poorly-executed camouflage and was indeed the intended paint until CCP's physical modeling team screwed up somewhere along the line. I'm surprised it's still being kept for the Navy Comet, if it's not the intended Gallente color



I guess it's all a moot point since CCP has stated their view and it's all about the performance of the ships anyways, but why they feel the need to crap all over the visuals of something at least partially intended as a cool looking status symbol is beyond me, especially when the previous iteration was much more liked. At the very least they should redo the damn skins properly.

Ryunosuke Kusanagi
Posted - 2009.10.20 04:40:00 - [79]
 

Edited by: Ryunosuke Kusanagi on 20/10/2009 04:41:47
Quote:
But if you ask me, my preference would be that dreadnoughts in siege mode should transform into huge space robots with vacuum cleaners.



Actually I was wondering when we would get the Spaceball 1/ Mega Maid combo.... somehow always wanted to suck all the air off of planet Drui... I mean Rens, and Selling it to Planet Spaceball/Moron (depending on if it's the animated version or not), or just Oursuleart :)

Unfortunately, I'd have to change the combination on my luggage :(

A Ingus
Posted - 2009.10.20 04:43:00 - [80]
 

Edited by: A Ingus on 20/10/2009 13:39:22
Originally by: Vyktor Abyss
I hate the idea of Guristas being the new drone experts. Gallente are now kinda "defunct", especially since blaster tracking just gets worse and worse relative to other offensive weapons from various factors every patch, while other races get more buffs.

I despise the Navy Megathron skin change. You've made possibly the prettiest looking ship, one of the ugliest. What next? Baby-blue Nyx? Oh and I love the way you dont listen to your players telling you it looks crap and not to change it, for the sake of the 20 or so people that bought desk models.

With the exception of the new tier of Navy ships I dont see these changes improving Eve at all.


Agreed. I hate the new Gurista ships. But CCP thanks for admitting they are drone boats (with a little missile on top). Yep that's the Guristas we experince all the time spamming missiles and ecm.

Anyway, in general it appears CCP you didn't want the feedback on any of these ships. Why did you bother eliciting feedback if you're not going to adequately consider and address it. Your justifications are weak.

For Gallente, ugly Camo paint, dronebays obsoleted and by Caldari imbalanced unkillable passive tanks, and still 5% ew bonuses that aren't ecm that's for sure. What does Gallente have to look forward to in this game anymore, just replace them with the new Gallente- Guristas (the mainly Caldari pirate faction ffs). And your justification is bull****, show us the pirate faction blasterboat that actually is better, show us the pirate missileboat that is better. And for all those that complain they don't need another shield and missile ship, what do you say to Amarr pilots with 6 laser and armor battleships.Laughing

I will be able to fly the stupid Garista ships, but i refuse to. And I will relish their demise when oportunity presents itself. You may have created unkillable ships that prevail in one-on-one (because while giving them the unkillable tank you also gave them enough damage to take down any other ship in their calss), but they won't survive the blob.YARRRR!!

Isaac Starstriker
Amarr
Frontier Venture
Posted - 2009.10.20 04:54:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: Reten Kip
Originally by: Abrazzar
Well, on the navy salad camo, I made a proposition adding to the others:

Navy ships in brushed steel and coal:

Dominix
Vexor




Hot. CCP, fire your artists and do this.


Looks like an Amarr Gallente combo. No thank you.

--Isaac

Terranid Meester
Tactical Assault and Recon Unit
Posted - 2009.10.20 05:11:00 - [82]
 

I like the Navy Vexor in its current colours. Its probably one of the best looking ships in the game.

Ku'Nari Skywall
Posted - 2009.10.20 05:17:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Yon Krum
Just do the RD ships, and stop making excuses. We want our tentacle battleships!


Careful what you ask for, they'll just put some crappy camo-skin on it.

Ku'Nari Skywall
Posted - 2009.10.20 06:24:00 - [84]
 

Edited by: Ku''Nari Skywall on 20/10/2009 06:34:15
Edited by: Ku''Nari Skywall on 20/10/2009 06:30:13
Edited by: Ku''Nari Skywall on 20/10/2009 06:25:34
Originally by: Zaknussem
Quote:
Q: Why having camouflage skins on navy battleships?
A: The black and white skin you were used to on the Megathron Navy Issue has never been the proper Gallente Navy version paintjob and this is why it was changed. As some of you guessed, the correct one was already used on the EVE store Megathron Navy miniature...


Aah, I missed that bit in the explanation (stupid me). Then the answer is obvious; the modellers screwed up when making the Navythron model, and CCP are trying to cover up the mistake by (gasp!) pretending it was to be that way all along.

Not a big issue in and of itself, but it seems to solidify the trend that October is the month when CCP act extra jerky. Wonder what the connection is to that?


Agreed. Checking the EVE Store I see Navy Mega miniature: Navy Mega and the in-game version. Similar but not the same, though I'm not sure which one is worse...

Perhaps it's the lighting, but looking at the other Navy ships none of them seem to have such a stark looking Camo paint job:

Apoc What camo? No see camo. Be consistent CCP. Rolling Eyes

Raven Angle is bad to really tell us anything useful.

Phoon I can see the camo pattern but more subtle.

All 4 at once

EveFairy0
Posted - 2009.10.20 07:30:00 - [85]
 

Sorry if i recap the obvious but how i see it:

Shield tanking makes a compromise between tank and tackle while having low slots available for damage mods. (No tackle? -> bring a friend. Ship needs a role.)

Armor tanking is about finding the balance between tank and damage mods while having mids fully dedicated for tackle.

That leaves us with propulsion mods, cap boosters and ewar which are considered mandatory on some applications.

The comments that shield tanking wouldn't work for Fleet Tempest or Machariel sound surprising to me. It also kind of hints that all the shield tanking ships ingame are bad atm (Raven, Maelstrom, ...). Ok, maybe not as most of the (faction ship) changes seem to be geared towards solo pvp - which sounds fun but obviously makes ships look the same slot-wise (not so fun). 8/7/5 on either of these ships would give some nice diversity between them. On Mach a shield tank would even be logical, iirc Angels tend to tank with their shields also. Long term it would be nice to see the tanking types balanced (boost/hp bonis?) so you don't need to make design decisions based on them.

All in all the changes are lookin nice and I'm looking forward to Dominion how ever the stats turn out. So far it seems to be a nice rebalancing patch. Smile

Reten Kip
Everset Dropbears
Posted - 2009.10.20 07:41:00 - [86]
 

Edited by: Reten Kip on 20/10/2009 08:01:09
Edited by: Reten Kip on 20/10/2009 07:43:10
Originally by: Zaknussem
The hull changes for the Cov. Ops were needed to correct an older error regarding T2 hull assignments. The Helios was never supposed to have any other hull than the Imicus. Compare the Gallente frigate lineups with the lineups of the other races, and it will be clear as day to you. It has nothing to do with appearance or popularity of hulls. It sucks, but there you go. I'm not saying that the skin changes were necessary and or justifiable, but comparing them to the hull changes is comparing apples and oranges.


The Imicus was not always the scanning frigate. The only thing that prevented them from giving the scanning/covops ships the Maulus hull was their own stubborn stupidity.

Originally by: Zaknussem
And regarding the "PAYING CUSTOMERS!!!" comment, I suggest you read the EULA again. This is CCP's game, not yours. You're only paying to be allowed to use it. IIRC the EULA does not state that CCP has to listen to their customers, so be grateful that they do.


No company has to listen to their customers, and yes, we ARE customers, but the ones that don't listen generally don't do very well.

Mr Opinions
Posted - 2009.10.20 08:36:00 - [87]
 

Edited by: Mr Opinions on 20/10/2009 08:36:06
A lot of the changes are good, and the changes to the fleet (and normal) phoon were sorely needed.

But the new slot layout for the fleet tempest is a step in the wrong direction, imho. 8/7/5, as a shield tanker would better fit the role/philosophy of the tempest as a BS with mobility and also balance out the heavy bias toward armor tanking in larger ships.

I mean if you put the RP hat on for laughs for a sec, you can imagine a scimitar pilot in a minmatar navy fleet asking himself, "Who was it we were supposed to rep again?" Neutral




Nofonno
Amarr
Posted - 2009.10.20 08:52:00 - [88]
 

Nice input, though I'm siding with no camo on space ships Laughing

Most of all, I would like to thank CCP for finally openly admitting they fail-design Amarr ships on purpose - Imperial Slicer is the only ship that mentions it has problems and does not excell at anything.

Please rename to Imperial Navy Butter Knife.


Abrazzar
Posted - 2009.10.20 09:24:00 - [89]
 

Originally by: Isaac Starstriker
Originally by: Reten Kip
Originally by: Abrazzar
Well, on the navy salad camo, I made a proposition adding to the others:

Navy ships in brushed steel and coal:

Dominix
Vexor




Hot. CCP, fire your artists and do this.


Looks like an Amarr Gallente combo. No thank you.

--Isaac

For Amarr I actually made this paint. IMHO, Amarr Navy should be bright and glorious. They see themselves as the saviors of the universe and not as something dark and ominous. Smile


I did a bit of playing around with photoshop and found out what is making the camo on gallente so sub-par: It covers the whole ship, obfuscating the details on the model design.

This makes the ship look spray painted, botchy and boring. I'd propose, if you have to stick with camo, add areas of solid color and use more colors on details.

For example using the template from above links, make everything in coal black camouflage and everything steel a solid color, even if it's just another shade of green and small mechanical details in steel or grey. This way it'd retain the level of detail of the original ship.

Caldor Mansi
Posted - 2009.10.20 09:26:00 - [90]
 

Originally by: Bellum Eternus

The Vindicator? It can't do any more peak gun DPS than the Kronos or Hyperiorn. Once you consider the rep bonuses of both those ships, and the numerous advantages of the Kronos over the Vindi, there is really little reason to choose the Vindi over either the Hype or the Kronos.


Oh...there is 1 ship balanced correctly so it does not outperform player produced ships? Awesome!

Now there is only needed a nerf that would bring the other faction ships to the same level.


Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only