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Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.22 17:39:00 - [1]
 

Hi there, today I was hoping to transport a ship from one part of the galaxy to another, it became apparent to me that I would have to "Travel fit" it, Ergo putting no mods on it apart from Inertia stabilizers ( This allows you to warp in a cruiser-class ship before the police lock you down )
So I did that, and as usual went on my way. Until I suddenly got a criminal status put upon me by powers unknown in a 0.8 system.
It's worth to note that I am only -3.1 so I'm far from being "criminal" still, but 0.8 systems still don't like me it seems and I realize this, which is why I fit to just swoop through them in the first place.

The issue here is that CCP seem to be adding more features to stop piracy, which makes no sense whatsoever - This game is supposed to be the "sandbox" that they brag about so happily where you can do whatever you want, But apparently if you do whatever you want, you can not warp through highsec systems. Because you know.. Scares the carebears?
- It makes no sense, suicideganks are commonplace, people know it can happen, and I suppose this is a "feature" they snuck in to counter it, but it's bloody annoying to now not be able to even travel through the systems because If I do enter it, that's apparently a criminal act in itself. Seems logical that if It's so criminal and if the gate can stop me from leaving the system I enter, why can I even enter in the first place? And why can my pod go through gates, but not my ship?

I'm asking for support for a fix, The gate locked out my Ship, but not my pod when I was later killed off by the police ( I ejected to see if I could leave the ship in space - They still shot it )
Fellow pirates, or even those who just enjoy the odd Lowsec killing, who sustain themselves by carebearing; Surely this is pretty ****** up?

Xikorita
Gallente
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
Posted - 2009.09.22 17:46:00 - [2]
 

If it doesnt lock the pods, the friendly orca can still bring the ships to high sec and the pods get those and suicide anyway.

Mithfindel
Zenko Incorporated
Posted - 2009.09.22 17:55:00 - [3]
 

It is noteworthy that as a blinky red you cannot enter hisec at all. Then, going to more and more secure space, the threshold of attack gets lower and lower. For 1.0, it is -2.0. It would be helpful if this game had a manual, then could just say RTFM, but since there's no manual, we have to trust that in the worst case, people will learn by trial and error.

You did not fly what you could not afford to lose, right?

Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.22 18:20:00 - [4]
 

Well no, of course not. I wouldn't emo out about losing a ship anyway, the point is more that they've been bragging the game up to be such a sandbox where players decide what they want to do, and now they're adding even more annoying little secret changes that make life way more laborious and annoying for Pirates or even just people who kill others now and then on whims.

Mithfindel
Zenko Incorporated
Posted - 2009.09.23 05:53:00 - [5]
 

At least this thing wasn't secret, and was no change - it has been ingame since forever or so. And anyway, even sandboxes may have rules. The grey army men with grenades can 'splode things. The green army men with rifles pew pew things. Not the other way, or not mixed.

Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2009.09.23 06:17:00 - [6]
 

Your ship was too slow. You can fight them and run away, avoiding police is not an exploit, avoiding Concord is. Just don't shoot the customs agents, they have the WTF ecm, scram, web on god mode.

steave435
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.09.23 06:49:00 - [7]
 

If you got a yellow aggro timer, stop whining. Sandbox does not mean no consequences. If you got a real red criminal timer, gcc, you probably went to a system where concord is the faction police, if you get shot by them you get a gcc, but it's petitionable.

Washell Olivaw
Posted - 2009.09.23 06:50:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
It's worth to note that I am only -3.1 so I'm far from being "criminal" still, but 0.8 systems still don't like me it seems and I realize this, which is why I fit to just swoop through them in the first place.


Incorrect assumption. From the piracy section in the player guide. This system has been in place pretty much since the launch of the game.

Quote:
Security Lockout

It's a good idea to know where the cut-off points are for access to solar systems with any given security status. A character will have to possess a security status equal to or greater than the following levels:

-1.99 for access to 1.0 security level systems -2.49 for access to 0.9 security level systems -2.99 for access to 0.8 security level systems -3.49 for access to 0.7 security level systems -3.99 for access to 0.6 security level systems -4.99 for access to 0.5 security level systems

As you can see, it will only take a couple of pod kills to render your ships and equipment in 0.7 or higher security space useless and you will have to gain the assistance of a friend to move it to a lower security rated system for pick up.

Tip #1: It's a good idea to move all your ships and equipment to a quiet 0.4 security level system before you start to pirate, to avoid being unable to access them in the future



Do your homework, or learn the hard way but don't blame the game.

Hallan Turrek
Caldari
The Outlaws.
Split Infinity.
Posted - 2009.09.23 08:50:00 - [9]
 

Also, if you went into Concord Sov High Sec and got tagged even once, you get a GCC and are going to die(or you'll just warp back and forth for hours until you die). Little known fact there.

Just be careful.

Jake McCord
Minmatar
McCord Industries
Terran Commonwealth
Posted - 2009.09.23 10:30:00 - [10]
 

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away, I once got a red timer on me, on purpose. I wanted to drive my sec rating down. I managed to evade Concorde for about 5 minutes. I might have done it longer if I had planned properly and put more safe places in the system, but I didn't, I ran out, and Concorde was waiting for me when I returned to one of my previous places.

Crap happens. But it's no change in the rules.

Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.23 12:14:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Washell Olivaw
Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
It's worth to note that I am only -3.1 so I'm far from being "criminal" still, but 0.8 systems still don't like me it seems and I realize this, which is why I fit to just swoop through them in the first place.


Incorrect assumption. From the piracy section in the player guide. This system has been in place pretty much since the launch of the game.

Quote:
Security Lockout

It's a good idea to know where the cut-off points are for access to solar systems with any given security status. A character will have to possess a security status equal to or greater than the following levels:

-1.99 for access to 1.0 security level systems -2.49 for access to 0.9 security level systems -2.99 for access to 0.8 security level systems -3.49 for access to 0.7 security level systems -3.99 for access to 0.6 security level systems -4.99 for access to 0.5 security level systems

As you can see, it will only take a couple of pod kills to render your ships and equipment in 0.7 or higher security space useless and you will have to gain the assistance of a friend to move it to a lower security rated system for pick up.

Tip #1: It's a good idea to move all your ships and equipment to a quiet 0.4 security level system before you start to pirate, to avoid being unable to access them in the future



Do your homework, or learn the hard way but don't blame the game.


Right... you just quoted and acted zealous about something I already said I knew Very Happy

Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.23 12:21:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Hallan Turrek
Also, if you went into Concord Sov High Sec and got tagged even once, you get a GCC and are going to die(or you'll just warp back and forth for hours until you die). Little known fact there.

Just be careful.


So I guess what happens is that at any random moment in any random system concord will pop up instead of faction navy, and that will make you dead no matter what?
Seems a bit solly to me really, this was a gallente system so I'm sure I wasn't in any other sov, but darn, first time I encounter in three years of hopping highsec.

Carmizan
DOCS RUFF RIDERS
Vanguard Imperium
Posted - 2009.09.23 12:34:00 - [13]
 

Tsumei also check your faction standing. For example i have a positive standing overall, but i can not enter caldari space due to my minus faction standing with them. So hopping accorss the galaxy for me means going around caldari when i am in a slow ship.

General Paul
Atomic Heroes
The G0dfathers
Posted - 2009.09.23 12:36:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: General Paul on 23/09/2009 12:36:44
No, what that chap is referring to is the Concord owned space where they lock the gates, disable your cloak and scan you down if you log.

Its up near genesis way (I think Tarr is one of them) and its basically instant death if you get hit even once.

This is almost certainly what the OP got copped by, its just worth checking your route and avoiding concord sov space really (its definately not broken or in need of a fix)

edit:sp

Brackman
Ex-Mortis
Posted - 2009.09.23 12:37:00 - [15]
 

You entered 0.9 or higher sec space and got shot by faction police, got aggression and were no longer safe anywhere in said faction's high sec systems as long as you still had said timer. Next time this happens: go to lowsec or dock, wait 15-20 minutes and enjoy. You may or may not need to relog after waiting the timer out in order for this to work.

Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.23 21:03:00 - [16]
 

Lots of theorycrafting going on here, which I understand - But I did report this by a petition, and the GM asked me to file a bugreport, so I'm assuming it's not really "game mechanics" as much

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2009.09.23 21:18:00 - [17]
 

Quote:
The issue here is that CCP seem to be adding more features to stop piracy, which makes no sense whatsoever - This game is supposed to be the "sandbox"


Correction - a sandbox where your actions have consequences.
You attacked and killed people in lowsec. Now you face those consequences. Deal with it.

Rusty Sprocket
Posted - 2009.09.23 22:34:00 - [18]
 

It is illegal for you to fly a ship in a 0.8 system with a security status of -3.0 or worse. All Amarr/Caldari/Gallente/Minmatar space is Empire space and under the jurisdiction of CONCORD. Systems .5 and above have CONCORD presence. By flying a ship in the 0.8 system you were flagged for this criminal act. As far as I know, this isn't some newly added covert change by CCP to stop piracy.

It is a sandbox game. You can do whatever you want, but you should, as a player, be aware of the consequences of your actions. You are aware that there is completely lawless space, are you not? Go take a trip out to lawless space and see if you can do whatever you want without consequences.

Learn to contract your ships out to space you are able to fly in, stupidity gets no sympathy.

Etho Demerzel
Gallente
Holy Clan of the Cone
Posted - 2009.09.23 22:41:00 - [19]
 

Personally I think you should only take security hits if you engage in criminal activity in HIGH SEC. Low sec should be as free for all as 0.0.

Fullmetal Jackass
Posted - 2009.09.24 08:00:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Fullmetal Jackass on 24/09/2009 08:17:36
Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
Hi there, today I was hoping to transport a ship from one part of the galaxy to another, it became apparent to me that I would have to "Travel fit" it, Ergo putting no mods on it apart from Inertia stabilizers ( This allows you to warp in a cruiser-class ship before the police lock you down )
So I did that, and as usual went on my way. Until I suddenly got a criminal status put upon me by powers unknown in a 0.8 system.
It's worth to note that I am only -3.1 so I'm far from being "criminal" still, but 0.8 systems still don't like me it seems and I realize this, which is why I fit to just swoop through them in the first place.

The issue here is that CCP seem to be adding more features to stop piracy, which makes no sense whatsoever - This game is supposed to be the "sandbox" that they brag about so happily where you can do whatever you want, But apparently if you do whatever you want, you can not warp through highsec systems. Because you know.. Scares the carebears?
- It makes no sense, suicideganks are commonplace, people know it can happen, and I suppose this is a "feature" they snuck in to counter it, but it's bloody annoying to now not be able to even travel through the systems because If I do enter it, that's apparently a criminal act in itself. Seems logical that if It's so criminal and if the gate can stop me from leaving the system I enter, why can I even enter in the first place? And why can my pod go through gates, but not my ship?

I'm asking for support for a fix, The gate locked out my Ship, but not my pod when I was later killed off by the police ( I ejected to see if I could leave the ship in space - They still shot it )
Fellow pirates, or even those who just enjoy the odd Lowsec killing, who sustain themselves by carebearing; Surely this is pretty ****** up?


You flew through a concord system. One they own rather then one of the empires. There's a chance of being criminal flagged if you enter one of these. Someone told me he got flagged mid warp in one of these systems after getting away from the gate cleanly. Buh bye ship. You were unlucky. Right now I have a -6.2 sec status. I fly cruisers though empire all the time with no inertia mods what-so-ever. Even 1.0 systems. Sure my shields get scorched once in a while, but I've yet to lose a ship traveling though high sec. Even undocking, if you do it right is no big deal.

I haven't tried anything bigger, but I'm thinking a BC is doable. Maybe a BS with I-Stabs but I doubt it. I know if you wait around too long you get webbed and scrambled by empire security forces. It is possible to tank for a little while, but they neut you all to hell and damp you down to about 5k lock range. It's really not that hard for criminals to get around high sec. You just flew through the wrong system and got unlucky.

Concord only shows up if you are flagged red. If you just have a low sec status in high security empire space, then it's the empire security forces shooting at you.

BTW, dodging concord (if you even can anymore) is considered an exploit. AKA cheating and you can get banned for it. If you criminal flag in high sec, it's death to your ship.

Oh, and one more thing: if you criminal flag in low sec and then jump into high sec, the gates lock you in. I did this by mistake once, and only once. I don't recall if concord showed up or if it was just security forces, but I lost my ship when I warped back to the gate and found it locked.

Fullmetal Jackass
Posted - 2009.09.24 08:20:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Etho Demerzel
Personally I think you should only take security hits if you engage in criminal activity in HIGH SEC. Low sec should be as free for all as 0.0.


Crime is crime. You do take less of a sec status hit if you flag in a .1 then in a .4 though. I personally thing there should be no sec status gains in null sec. If there's no penalty, there should be no reward.

Washell Olivaw
Posted - 2009.09.24 08:49:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
Right... you just quoted and acted zealous about something I already said I knew Very Happy


I apologise. Should have thought of the concord owned systems being different. Guess I have some homework to do too. Wink

Hallan Turrek
Caldari
The Outlaws.
Split Infinity.
Posted - 2009.09.24 09:01:00 - [23]
 

Honestly this doesn't seem like the place to be discussing this thing, but beyond the fact that you likely got tagged in Concord sov space, intertia stabs aren't the best idea for avoiding things. You turn faster yes, but you also get an increased sig radius. That means things lock you faster. Use Nano's.

Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.24 13:46:00 - [24]
 

System where I was given the criminal status was "Ourapheh" - I just checked it's sov, and it's The Interbus ( which I have 2.22 standing with I might add, all you people saying it's faction hating me - No. Just no. - and please don't try to argue that it's one of the major factions either, I know how standings work thankyouverymuch. )

And then all the people saying stuff about consequences and blahblah - That's not what this is about at all, that's clearly talking about morality in a topic that wishes to explore mechanics.

And yeah, it sounds like what should have happened is me getting flagged in Concord space, but I got the flag in an Interbus System, and was killed off by concord SWAT, which is a bit weird ugh

Lyn Kishin
Posted - 2009.09.24 16:10:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
System where I was given the criminal status was "Ourapheh" - I just checked it's sov, and it's The Interbus ( which I have 2.22 standing with I might add, all you people saying it's faction hating me - No. Just no. - and please don't try to argue that it's one of the major factions either, I know how standings work thankyouverymuch. )

And then all the people saying stuff about consequences and blahblah - That's not what this is about at all, that's clearly talking about morality in a topic that wishes to explore mechanics.

And yeah, it sounds like what should have happened is me getting flagged in Concord space, but I got the flag in an Interbus System, and was killed off by concord SWAT, which is a bit weird ugh


Interbus don't have their own faction navy so they contract system policing to..(concord)


Bunzan Cardinal
Ascendent.
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2009.09.24 16:21:00 - [26]
 

.... you cant enter certain systems with certain security status.... Also the higher the sec status of a system, the quicker reaction times of police and concord.

-2.0 you cant enter 1.0 systems
-2.5 you cant enter .9 systems
-3.0 you cant enter .8 systems <------ this is why you got a message you were a pirate.
-3.5 you cant enter .7 systems
-4.0 you cant enter .6 systems
-5.0 you cant enter .5 systems

(or something like that)


its hard to understand what you're trying to say in the OP. You said you cant go through a gate in your ship? That doesnt make any sense....

Tiel Enim
Posted - 2009.09.24 18:01:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
Hi there, today I was hoping to transport a ship from one part of the galaxy to another, it became apparent to me that I would have to "Travel fit" it, Ergo putting no mods on it apart from Inertia stabilizers ( This allows you to warp in a cruiser-class ship before the police lock you down )
So I did that, and as usual went on my way. Until I suddenly got a criminal status put upon me by powers unknown in a 0.8 system.
It's worth to note that I am only -3.1 so I'm far from being "criminal" still, but 0.8 systems still don't like me it seems and I realize this, which is why I fit to just swoop through them in the first place.

The issue here is that CCP seem to be adding more features to stop piracy, which makes no sense whatsoever - This game is supposed to be the "sandbox" that they brag about so happily where you can do whatever you want, But apparently if you do whatever you want, you can not warp through highsec systems. Because you know.. Scares the carebears?
- It makes no sense, suicideganks are commonplace, people know it can happen, and I suppose this is a "feature" they snuck in to counter it, but it's bloody annoying to now not be able to even travel through the systems because If I do enter it, that's apparently a criminal act in itself. Seems logical that if It's so criminal and if the gate can stop me from leaving the system I enter, why can I even enter in the first place? And why can my pod go through gates, but not my ship?

I'm asking for support for a fix, The gate locked out my Ship, but not my pod when I was later killed off by the police ( I ejected to see if I could leave the ship in space - They still shot it )
Fellow pirates, or even those who just enjoy the odd Lowsec killing, who sustain themselves by carebearing; Surely this is pretty ****** up?


You must be joking?
Your a piwate and want free access and/or passage in high sec?
Isnt free rewards with no risk enough for you ******s?

If i **** your wife, can i get the key to your daughters room?
Please?

Tsumei Meyren
Creative Cookie Procuring
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2009.09.25 07:57:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Lyn Kishin
Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
System where I was given the criminal status was "Ourapheh" - I just checked it's sov, and it's The Interbus ( which I have 2.22 standing with I might add, all you people saying it's faction hating me - No. Just no. - and please don't try to argue that it's one of the major factions either, I know how standings work thankyouverymuch. )

And then all the people saying stuff about consequences and blahblah - That's not what this is about at all, that's clearly talking about morality in a topic that wishes to explore mechanics.

And yeah, it sounds like what should have happened is me getting flagged in Concord space, but I got the flag in an Interbus System, and was killed off by concord SWAT, which is a bit weird ugh


Interbus don't have their own faction navy so they contract system policing to..(concord)





Really? Hmm, well that changes things a bit doesn't it, since that would mean we've got potentially far more systems than the "few" owned by concord to be careful with.

Also, the two other replies; You Assume I'm dumber than I am, and I'm not whether you think so or not, so just stop with the useless replies, Thanks. Very Happy

Fullmetal Jackass
Posted - 2009.09.26 00:48:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
Originally by: Lyn Kishin
Interbus don't have their own faction navy so they contract system policing to..(concord)


Really? Hmm, well that changes things a bit doesn't it, since that would mean we've got potentially far more systems than the "few" owned by concord to be careful with.

Also, the two other replies; You Assume I'm dumber than I am, and I'm not whether you think so or not, so just stop with the useless replies, Thanks. Very Happy


It makes sence, but it's news to me. Live and learn I guess. CCP has always been terrible about mechanic documentation. They like us to learn the hard way.

There are some seriously ignorant people posting in here btw.

Admiral Eos
Gallente
Supercarrier Aggression
Posted - 2009.09.26 05:35:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Fullmetal Jackass
Originally by: Tsumei Meyren
Originally by: Lyn Kishin
Interbus don't have their own faction navy so they contract system policing to..(concord)


Really? Hmm, well that changes things a bit doesn't it, since that would mean we've got potentially far more systems than the "few" owned by concord to be careful with.

Also, the two other replies; You Assume I'm dumber than I am, and I'm not whether you think so or not, so just stop with the useless replies, Thanks. Very Happy


It makes sence, but it's news to me. Live and learn I guess. CCP has always been terrible about mechanic documentation. They like us to learn the hard way.

There are some seriously ignorant people posting in here btw.


Reiterating that this mechanic is in fact done in the CONCORD-related systems methinks. Happened to a mate of mine in his Ishtar; though he somehow managed to escape. Hopefully you get reimbursed in your own situation since this may have been a bug.

Also in agreement that most here are acting pretty silly/ignorant.

"Suffer the consequences for killing us!"

This person is just running into a mechanic that even I was unaware of and I'm -9.9 and have been for three years.


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