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Serj Darek
Posted - 2009.09.16 03:43:00 - [181]
 

Originally by: jeffb
Hard to see how a dread fleet will perform against a titan + carrier fleet with these changes. Will siege mode also have its duration/fuel use halved (or more)?

Will I be able to dock a supercap come Dominion?


The sad part is I doubt anything is set in concrete at this point, until after the ever important SISI testing. In my opinion most of the comments made by CCP at this point I'm taking with a grain of salt until Dominion goes live.

I surely can't be the only person ****ed off by a good portion of these changes.

Yaay
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Posted - 2009.09.16 03:44:00 - [182]
 

Edited by: Yaay on 16/09/2009 03:44:46
Originally by: DigitalCommunist




Digi and I agree totally on the concept of these ships. I will point out that I aimed to fix the problems with titans via my DD proposal here:

http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1014819

and further emphasized here:

http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1052103

These changes do nothing to make titans more than giant dreads. We saw how dreads proliferated after time, I expect the same of titans in the future.

I tend to like some of the change to motherships, but I agree totally that it seems uninspired. Motherships should be able to repair ships. Not heal their hulls, or do other stupid stuff, but repair damaged ships modules for resource cost.

It would add another dimension to heat, and the proposed DD changes and give both ships more unique roles on combat and use. I like Digi's idea of a DOT weapon as well, which could be another part of the arsinal of titans if done correctly.

Neither of these ships should be direct projections of power the way devs have tried, and are trying to do in an optimal environment. They should be 2ndary projectors that have huge implications in fights without actually deciding the fights simply by show of force.

Disv
Posted - 2009.09.16 03:45:00 - [183]
 

All i can say is that the changed do not seem to be thought through. You appear to have had a brainstorming session thought "Ooo that sounds alright, lets do it and to hell with the implications" and are screwing things up. Your killing a game your supposed to be doctoring and while you sit at your bloody desks getting paid to make stupid decisions, were all reading your crap and getting very annoyed at you.

Your Killing the Gallente Dreadnaught, Damage is quite obviously not even on capital weapon level. Hybrids are weak compared to the rest and you want to "Spend the next couple of weeks checking the damages on all Dreads"?? Im not being funny here, but you have to be pretty bloody stupid if your gonna nerf something you havnt already tested and confirmed. You should have the numbers, you should know what ships are capable of what, HELL a lot of people outside of CCP run the numbers for you! Buff the Guns, Ditch the Drone Bonus, Everyone is Happy! Dont for the love of god mess up again.

Titans.... touchy subject, i actually like Doomsday, and i think you only want to change it because it lags your server. The doomsday is fine as it is except for one thing 3-4 x DD in short periods, Prevent this by BS'ing, a residual effect of the First DD or some crap.

Serj Darek
Posted - 2009.09.16 03:53:00 - [184]
 

Originally by: Disv
All i can say is that the changed do not seem to be thought through. You appear to have had a brainstorming session thought "Ooo that sounds alright, lets do it and to hell with the implications" and are screwing things up. Your killing a game your supposed to be doctoring and while you sit at your bloody desks getting paid to make stupid decisions, were all reading your crap and getting very annoyed at you.

Your Killing the Gallente Dreadnaught, Damage is quite obviously not even on capital weapon level. Hybrids are weak compared to the rest and you want to "Spend the next couple of weeks checking the damages on all Dreads"?? Im not being funny here, but you have to be pretty bloody stupid if your gonna nerf something you havnt already tested and confirmed. You should have the numbers, you should know what ships are capable of what, HELL a lot of people outside of CCP run the numbers for you! Buff the Guns, Ditch the Drone Bonus, Everyone is Happy! Dont for the love of god mess up again.

Titans.... touchy subject, i actually like Doomsday, and i think you only want to change it because it lags your server. The doomsday is fine as it is except for one thing 3-4 x DD in short periods, Prevent this by BS'ing, a residual effect of the First DD or some crap.


The Gallente dread is fine the way it is now, the only dread that can kill sub-caps.

The Titan fix has been spewed on forums the last couple of years, a single dd per grid per hour. I would add a damage over time to the grid for ships only.



Letifer Deus
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:03:00 - [185]
 

Edited by: Letifer Deus on 16/09/2009 06:38:25
Quote:
The simple fact is that this class of ship now stays mostly parked on trained alts and is rarely used as they are nothing more than expensive targets for hungry legions of Dread pilots.


I hope this major problem is addressed and I really hope the HP increase is a truly significant amount. This will also need to be addressed with titans given their role being changed from "drive by DD" to something staying on the field longer. Also, I hope multiple focused DD effectiveness against other titans/moms will be kept in mind. I'd hate to have moms get to where they should be just to see 2-3 titans instamelt them.

Originally by: Tarron Sarek
Anyway, regarding the naming, I like 'supercarrier'. Guess I'm the only one Neutral
Nobody complained about 'super capital'. Why the hate for supercarrier?


I dont see why anyone really cares. "Oh no my Nyx's class has been changed from mothership to supercarrier." It's still a Nyx. Hell they can say they are "super pink pony class" and I don't care as long as moms (er, SPPs) get a much needed boost.


P.S. WTH is with the Moros nerf? If Moros doesn't get drone damage bonus out of siege, every other dread should not get 1 of their turret/launcher bonuses out of siege. Moros should still be losing the most DPS out of siege, so should be fair.

P.S.S. I don't fly Moros, I fly rev.

Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:28:00 - [186]
 

Edited by: Rakshasa Taisab on 16/09/2009 04:30:25
Originally by: Darth Sith
My case in point, the PL / Goon titan conga line. For giggles they line up over 20 titans and DD a carrier to death simply because they can. Now we are introducing a superweapon that can inflict capital killing damage on a target. What is to stop the same thing where someone comes in with 10+ titans, lock a tower , all fire their siege weapons and reinforce it in 1 shot. The tower would be reinforced and the titans gone before someone sees the first mail from the tower.

So a 5 min window to get a hictor or 5 ready? Sounds good.

Originally by: Serj Darek
The Gallente dread is fine the way it is now, the only dread that can kill sub-caps.

Yes, that's sounds _SO_ fine and not in any way counter to the supposed roles dreads have.

FelixDerGrieche
Gallente
Ascent Network
Sev3rance
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:37:00 - [187]
 

Sry for Capslock but....

JUMP PORTAL GENERATOR FOR MOTHERSHIPS/SUPERCARRIERS LOL

DigitalCommunist
November Corporation
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:43:00 - [188]
 

I don't understand this obsession of pretending we are getting closer to the mark based on how long a Titan has to stay on the field.

The value of the Titan concept in EVE is based on how utterly, ridiculously overpowered they can be without ruining the game completely.

You can balance them such that ~300 in existence doesn't kill the game, but why would you ever want that? If a real implementation were ever developed, the current ones should be stripped and reduced to capital components.

Fearless M0F0
Incursion PWNAGE Asc
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:47:00 - [189]
 

So another expansion, yet another nerf to gallente Rolling Eyes

Why don't you wipe out the whole damn race, make us all Amarr and be done with it Evil or Very Mad

Zex Maxwell
Caldari
Posted - 2009.09.16 04:58:00 - [190]
 

Edited by: Zex Maxwell on 16/09/2009 05:03:05
Here is a Q for you CCP:

Will you make the mother... I mean Suppercarriers transform? or other capital ships?

Or will the Rorqual be the only cap ship that can transform.

FelixDerGrieche
Gallente
Ascent Network
Sev3rance
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:01:00 - [191]
 

Edited by: FelixDerGrieche on 16/09/2009 05:13:17
Edited by: FelixDerGrieche on 16/09/2009 05:08:35
Originally by: something somethingdark
Titans :

Dreads :
What i find currious is that there is so much goon whineage about the moros nerf Confused
Are there so many goons using the Moros to stationcamp ?

Are people(not just goons) complaining that the dps is so low without drones because they only field sniping dreads ?


Personaly i welcome the change (and no i havent been violenced by a stationcamping moros and nor has my sister Razz )



omg i wrote too much and the post got mixed^^ well gallente weapons dont work. Thats it it was always drohnes + hybrid dmg while drohnes where primary so if you take the drone bonuses away pimp hybnrid weapons. otherwise do something usefull like "repair" gallente ships since all nerfs Gallente got hit everytime and now it has like 5 of like 30 ships for pvp. I can say gallente pvp is Megathron or astarte thats all -.- and the moros needs the drone bonuses to balance to the other races otherwise its no dmg dealer^^ How about "Can Deploy only fighters"?

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:09:00 - [192]
 

Originally by: Jordan Musgrat
Actually now that I think of it, you're very unlikely to change any of this, aren't you CCP? These apparently are your finalized products, and once again, you've waited until you already put all these plans in motion to get our feedback.

The other reaon you won't change your mind is because Seleene is a new dev, and half of the other CCP people will feel sorry for him when people who know their **** tell him the titan change is ******ed, and the other half won't want to invalidate everything he's done since becoming a dev, because I'm guessing this is the bulk of his work. I'm sorry, but Seleene hasn't been able to wrap his mind around this game for a while. He never got over the MC sadly, or not really the alliance, rather the vision for that kind of gameplay, and the mechanics that would be needed to support it.

Once again, do NOT screw up titans now just so you can fix them later. They are too big of a resource for you to make them useless for 6 months or however long it takes to get some decent ideas. It's hilarious that we get CCP devs asking for our input on foucking ECM drones, and all you say about the most important ship in the game is "titan nerf incoming" until you actually tell us what the nerf is, which happens to be an actual removal of the titan role from the game, until you can figure out what to do with it.


Your previous post was good and had some relevance, you should have left it at that and passed on posting this drivel. Apparently you have bone to pick with Seleene, but the only thing you did with this pointless personal attack was abandon your fairly reasonable points for mud slinging. Kindly restrict that crap to CAOD.

My opinion on these changes is mixed, I think I'll wait until I have some numbers to crunch before I get too carried away either pro or con. The new "Super Weapon" makes me nervous, but then again so did the traditional doomsday. The full potential of this new path will very probably depend on what the "other" options Titans will eventually be able to implement turn out to be.

One thing I am leaning favorably toward is the fighter/bomber concept for Super Carriers. This has great potential depending on the actual effectiveness and survivability the fighter/bomber ends up with (and yes, that may depend heavily on what range they can engage from).

However, I think it is important that the concept of a "Mother Ship" not be lost completely. A mobile base of operations is an excellent concept that should be realized sooner rather than later in a new (and hopefully last) Super Capital ship, one designed from the ground up specifically for that purpose. Preferably one that transforms in "Siege Mode" and has lots of spiny, wingy bits (I like spiny wingy bits). Very Happy


Alekanderu
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:27:00 - [193]
 

Originally by: something somethingdark

Dreads :
What i find currious is that there is so much goon whineage about the moros nerf Confused
Are there so many goons using the Moros to stationcamp ?

Are people(not just goons) complaining that the dps is so low without drones because they only field sniping dreads ?


Personaly i welcome the change (and no i havent been violenced by a stationcamping moros and nor has my sister Razz )
maybe a token boost to something useless like cap or so would help in making people accept the change more easily


have you ever even flown a dreadnaught in 0.0? because it sure seems like you have no idea what you're talking about at all

Jordan Musgrat
Convergent
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:39:00 - [194]
 

Originally by: Ranger 1

Your previous post was good and had some relevance, you should have left it at that and passed on posting this drivel. Apparently you have bone to pick with Seleene, but the only thing you did with this pointless personal attack was abandon your fairly reasonable points for mud slinging. Kindly restrict that crap to CAOD.

My opinion on these changes is mixed, I think I'll wait until I have some numbers to crunch before I get too carried away either pro or con. The new "Super Weapon" makes me nervous, but then again so did the traditional doomsday. The full potential of this new path will very probably depend on what the "other" options Titans will eventually be able to implement turn out to be.

One thing I am leaning favorably toward is the fighter/bomber concept for Super Carriers. This has great potential depending on the actual effectiveness and survivability the fighter/bomber ends up with (and yes, that may depend heavily on what range they can engage from).

However, I think it is important that the concept of a "Mother Ship" not be lost completely. A mobile base of operations is an excellent concept that should be realized sooner rather than later in a new (and hopefully last) Super Capital ship, one designed from the ground up specifically for that purpose. Preferably one that transforms in "Siege Mode" and has lots of spiny, wingy bits (I like spiny wingy bits). Very Happy



You're prolly right tbh, it was just me being bitter about seeing ccp have a good idea then implement it poorly, before we have a chance to give them any input. But coming from seleene, this kind of a change does make sense. It just isn't the direction that eve needs to go in, and rather than reduce titan blobbing, this will make it necessary, along with blobbing carriers along with them since you'll have a huge window of time to tackle them.

Also, someone somewhere else said something about a new class of true motherships, I think that would be great. If they give supercarriers this role, then give us motherships with working clone vats and huge smas with less offensive capabilities, it would be awesome.

Lena Planeswalker
Blend.
Nulli Tertius
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:45:00 - [195]
 

Originally by: FelixDerGrieche

the moros needs the drone bonuses to balance to the other races otherwise its no dmg dealer^^


I fully agree, but you should only get access to that damage when your in siege like all the other dreads, and that is exactly what they have done. Good job CCP.

It will still effectively be the only dread that has a chance at killing subcaps, you just need to be in siege now, oh noes...Rolling Eyes

AbudSeab
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:50:00 - [196]
 

didn't read all thread but didn't see anyone asking, so:

What will be done to prevent a Titan blob ?

People will reach skill to fly one with time, and material/money do not appears to be a problem for large alliances. So a Blob of Titans and interdictors sounds nice Twisted Evil

stop/paint target, turns it in smoke,
stop/paint target, turns it in smoke,
stop/paint target, turns it in smoke,
...

And by what I see any kind of remote assistance (RR) will be useless if target dies in one single shot ! ! ! There's nothing to repair Confused

In other worlds: Will a titan new weapon be able to smoke a cruiser or a BS heavy painted/webfied ?


Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:50:00 - [197]
 

Supercarriers?? Arrrrrrg. HORRIBLE NAME!!!

Also I dont understand why the clone bay is removed.

What exactly is the role of those new supercarriers? Just a bit bigger carrier which can deal more dps and tank a bit better?

What was wrong with the clone bay? Why wasn't it used? Why isn't CCP analysing that? Why are they throwing away some good potential without need?

Why not make the clone bay BETTER instead of just taking it away?

Here my suggestions:

  • Keep the name 'mothership'

  • Improve the clone bay

  • Make motherships be able to jump to covert ops cynos


Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.09.16 05:55:00 - [198]
 

Originally by: Lena Planeswalker

It will still effectively be the only dread that has a chance at killing subcaps, you just need to be in siege now, oh noes...Rolling Eyes


That would almost make sense if subcapital target management was feasible while in siege mode.

Forgive people for getting ****ed that the one advantage of having 1/4 to 1/3 of your damage tied up in destroyable, bump-off-able, (relatively) short-range weapons systems is being torn from them.

evs
Paladin Order
Tread Alliance
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:00:00 - [199]
 

Originally by: Lena Planeswalker

I fully agree, but you should only get access to that damage when your in siege like all the other dreads, and that is exactly what they have done. Good job CCP.

It will still effectively be the only dread that has a chance at killing subcaps, you just need to be in siege now, oh noes...Rolling Eyes


if you shoot poses you need to use sentries, and good luck getting them back into your drone bay after they get spit out anywhere from 2km-11km away (especially in laggy situations), or you get bumped...Rolling Eyes
and its no use trying to kill subcaps with drones while sieged, 2 locked targets and abysmal locking time...Rolling Eyes
o and dont forget the maximum 60km rangeRolling Eyes

if they are serious about this, it needs some other bonuses, specifically and especially to drone control range, and sentry optimal range, as well as sentry speed (100m/s maybe?) when you recall them, all only in siege of course

AbudSeab
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:00:00 - [200]
 

By the way, supercarries aren't a nice name ugh

BS could be supercruisers, or cruisers could be superfrigs.

Hope you guys will find a better name, or at least just call then tier 2 carries. We have three tier for BS, and four tiers of cruisers. What's wrong with two tiers of carries ?

Or turn them faction carries Shocked... Ok, not a amazing idea, but yet better than supercarries ! ! !

jeffb
GoonFleet
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:03:00 - [201]
 

You might also want to look at some form of diminishing returns on these new titan weapons now too, if your ship is hit and survives the next dd will do less damage. I'm sure you can come up with some roleplaying bull****.

Dri Kulsane
Amarr
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:04:00 - [202]
 

Good blog, just don't feel warm to the idea of Mom's being re-defined as another type now.

PMolkenthin
TunDraGon
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:06:00 - [203]
 

Fokkin' awesome!!! There might be some Titan pilot tears, but good news for everyone else. Also the Mothership changes are spot on. Lets hope they drop to like 4bil, then I might buy one. Could still do with being able to dock though :) Good job Abathur Wink

Sunsets
Habitual Euthanasia
Dystopia Alliance
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:13:00 - [204]
 

Hey CCP Abathur can you elaborate on your thinking behind the Moros change, especially compared to the other race dreadnoughts?

Lena Planeswalker
Blend.
Nulli Tertius
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:18:00 - [205]
 

Originally by: evs
Originally by: Lena Planeswalker



if you shoot poses you need to use sentries, and good luck getting them back into your drone bay after they get spit out anywhere from 2km-11km away (especially in laggy situations), or you get bumped...Rolling Eyes


and how is this different from now?, or are you saying you don't siege your dread when you bashing a pos?

Originally by: evs

and its no use trying to kill subcaps with drones while sieged, 2 locked targets and abysmal locking time...Rolling Eyes
o and dont forget the maximum 60km rangeRolling Eyes


Well i was only implying you actually still have a chance, my chance was taken away in QR and the missile nerf

Originally by: evs

if they are serious about this, it needs some other bonuses, specifically and especially to drone control range, and sentry optimal range, as well as sentry speed (100m/s maybe?) when you recall them, all only in siege of course


only if i can recall my sentries in the phoenix in the same way...Very Happy

Trevarre Schuldig
Caldari
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:21:00 - [206]
 

motherships as they are now does around 1/2 sieged dread damage 2000-2500 dps, with fighter bombers your looking at sieged dread damage or 4000-5000 dps any less and it's not better than normal fighters. bring 8-10 of these your gonna have something like a 40k-50k tank and doing 40-50k dps out of triage mode, huge plus btw meaning they can warpout as long as they're not constantly bubbled.

i'm thinking a cap gang of 10 super carriers 3-4 titans 20 carriers and the rest in dreads totally owning any traditional cap fleet 80% dreads 20% carriers of equal numbers. i'm also seeing without DD, support will play a bigger role in cap slug fests.

also titans need enough tank to survive at least 30 seiged dreads pounding on it for 5 minutes. so around 36 million ehp roughly 5-6x of the current amount. any less and you'll have 1 dead titan every time it shoots it's new death ray. or maybe 2.5-3x the current ehp, so with the support of 10 carriers 1 titan can last 5 minutes of 30 seiged dreads shooting at it.

so now the moros is on par with all other dreads out of siege. in siege nothing has changed. it's not like moros is the worst dread in siege. that's reserved for phoenix.

Herschel Yamamoto
Agent-Orange
Nabaal Syndicate
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:22:00 - [207]
 

DC, you're insane if you think that any worthwhile object in the game will ever be limited to a handful. Any game that's afflicted by Serious Business Syndrome has to be designed with one central rule in mind - hardcore players will do anything it takes to win. Spend 23 hours a day onlining POSes? Sure, I can sleep over downtime. Spend 4000 man-hours mining minerals for a Titan? Why not? If it helps someone win at Eve, they'll do it, and be damned to their social life, sleep habits, or overall sanity. Not everyone will, but you have to balance the game for those who do. Any proposal that makes Titans worthwhile is going to guarantee that they're common after enough time, no matter what they cost, what skills they require, how much effort they take, or what sort of obscene restrictions you place on them. For that matter, even if they aren't worthwhile, they'll still be common - look at Moms. Expecting rarity is fundamentally stupid design.

</rantmode>

Overall, supercapital design has to hit two goals. A supercap has to have a reason to be on the battlefield, and it has to be able to survive there well enough to be usable. The doom cannon does the first well enough, though I'll have to see stats on bomber drones, but the second you're still not selling me on. These are fleet ships, and they have to be designed for use in fleet. If I can't put a Titan into the middle of my 200-man blob and crash it into the other guy's 200-man blob with the expectation that it being there will gain me more than it loses me, the titan is a failure as a fleet ship. Making it survivable by active tank is bad, because then it just becomes invincible solo against smaller groups, while giving it pure HP just means placing an upper limit on how big of a fight it can go into(and that upper limit I can guarantee will be too low - a 100-man dread fleet can easily pump out a quarter million DPS, meaning that if you want it to last 5 minutes on an average battlefield, you'll need to give it 75 million EHP).

I think the solution to survivability is either to give supercaps a massive resistance bonus or a massive bonus to the effectiveness of inbound remote reps, probably on the order of making the tank 2x-4x as good. A naked Titan will still drop, but one in combat with a proper support fleet will have a decent chance of surviving massed dreadnought fire.

The other concern is ensuring that doomsdays don't destroy your entire supercap combat model. I don't have numbers on your changes, but if you do it the simple way, then the first thing that happens when a pair of titan gangs run into each other will be two dead titans, one on each side. Bang, bang, 150 bil up in smoke. That's not fleet combat, that's the masochist's tango. The simplest solution to this would be to declare doom cannons to be "electronic warfare" effects, of the kind that supercaps are naturally immune to, though other solutions may also exist(explicitly prevent multiples on a single target within 5 mins?). However, make sure that you do something in this vein, or else you destroy any possibility of them being usable in fleet combat, because all you'll do is create titan MAD.

All that said, I'm cautiously optimistic about most of these changes. ****ed about the Moros nerf, at least partially because I'm training for one, but this seems like it will remove the absurdity that is the modern Titan from the game once and for all, and because if we're all very good children, Santa might even bring us a usable Mothership for Christmas. Will be looking forward to eating a doom cannon or two on Sisi.

Ker HarSol
Minmatar
Zip - I
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:24:00 - [208]
 

What will be done against titan blobbing?

Already the larger alliances can field 10 titans without much of a problem.

In the not to distant future they can field 20,30,50.

What are you going to do then? Another change?

I am afraid, as good as all the changes might sound and as much work was there invested already, they just seem to be a quick hack and patch to fix a momentarily situation.

Only the most biggest alliances can afford to field that many titans. Smaller alliances won't have much of a chance (even less than now) to kill a titan. And the imbalance only becomes bigger.

I like DigitalCommunists ideas about something radical news. Titans/Moms as something in between a ship and a station.

The doomsday is not really that bad! The only problem is the cyno jammer and a DD in a cyno jammed system. But those jammers will be gone for most of the systems after Dominion anyway.

I am sorry to say, but these new changes lack vision.

Varrakk
Menace ll Society
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:34:00 - [209]
 

Originally by: CCP Abathur

The current RoF on the super weapons is five minutes. This is because we plan to let everyone do a lot of testing on SiSi over the next several weeks. We will continue to balance based upon the results of public testing and feedback. Firing the weapon has the current effects:

  • Immobility for 30 seconds.

  • Jump drive non-operational for five minutes.



A Titan immobile for 30 seconds infront a dread fleet wont survive.
It will be bubbled and gunned down as soon as the dreads lock it.
Trading a 60b ship for a common 1.5b Dread will make Titans the new POS hugger.

The only use Titans will see with its new super weapon, will be station or cyno gen ganking.
Which is the role moms currently have.

Darkdood
Posted - 2009.09.16 06:36:00 - [210]
 

The one thing that concerns me about the Titan being made a beam weapon is how it can be used on other targets. I mean a POS only has 30-60 mil shields. If you can dump 3-4 mil in one hit you can seriously hammer a POS just by having what 8+ titans DD it and then warp away. Then its reinforced in like 30 secs flat. No fight no defense no warning. Its over before the eve mail even hits your mailbox.

Obviously not everyone has 8+ Titans, but still.

With POS's not being part of sov maybe it won't matter but my assumption is other hard targets will replace them in the new mechanic. Sort of hard to keep a 20 mil health sov flag planted if a pack of titans can warp in blast it from 150 km out and warp away before anyone even really knows its happening.


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