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Meridius
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.20 22:49:00 - [1]
 

Well here is my take on what would be better instead of disabling it all together.

Make it so that putting on a 2nd MWD disables all of your high slots. No high slots, no offense.

The first MWD is so resource intensive it digs into your shields and capacitor, a 2nd would reroute power from your high slots as well as digging further into your shields and capactitor.

I don't see a problem with this, bs will still be able to travel decently, indies can move relatively quickly, frigs can still scout.


Harry MacDougal
Posted - 2004.10.20 22:55:00 - [2]
 

rather than removing all high slots, how about a second one takes away power? That way, people could still fit mining lasers, but no weapons?

Weirda
Minmatar
Queens of the Stone Age
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2004.10.20 22:55:00 - [3]
 

Scorpion would still be irritatating as hell... Shocked

Will be interested in seeing how the current change affects certain "playstyles" though... Twisted Evil

Shamis Orzoz
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2004.10.20 23:18:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 20/10/2004 23:21:03
The best way to handle this problem in my opinion is to just increase cap usage. The signature radius increase needs to be removed too, it just doesn't make any sense that it is easier to hit something that is moving faster. If they take more cap then nobody would be able to run them long enough for combat situations so people would only use them for traveling.


Maya Rkell
Third Grade Ergonomics
Posted - 2004.10.20 23:26:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Maya Rkell on 21/10/2004 01:38:59

No, the best idea is to ADD speed for the MWD, not multiply it.

Look...

BS with 150m/s base speed, AT PRESENT

1 MWD = 150+(150*5) = 900 m/s
2 MWD = (150+(150*5))*5 = 4500 m/s


BS with 150m/s base speed, WITH ADDING

1 MWD = 150+(150*5) = 900 m/s
2 MWD = 150+(150*5)+(150*5) = 1650 m/s

BIG difference, neh?

And it works without changing the fitting system which works EXTREMELY WELL (you can fiy ANYTHING your slot types, cap and power grid allow), AT ALL.

You may wish to make AB's add as well to "nerf" dual-oversized AB-using ships.
(This hurts indys, but not THAT much)

Darkwolf
Caldari
TOG Empire
Combat Mining and Logistics
Posted - 2004.10.21 00:55:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Maya Rkell
1 MWD = 150+(150*5) = 600 m/s
2 MWD = (150+(150*5))*5 = 3600 m/s


Umm. 150+(150*5) = 900, not 600. The calculation is easier if you look at it as a 500% boost multiplies your current speed by 6.

So, two MWD's are 150*6*6 = 5.4km/s

Anyway, I agree with the sentiment - the issue here is that stacking in EVE works multiplicatively, which is frankly ridiculous. It leads to such madness as the dual MWD problem, and hideous stacking bonuses from damage mods and such forth. It's because of multiplicative stacking that we needed to resort to the stacking penalty tomfoolery in the first place.

Where it could have ALL been resolved in the first place by having everything stack ADDITIVELY. Such that putting on two MWD's would set your speed as follows:

150 + 150*5 + 150*5 = 150 * (1+5+5) = 1650 m/s

Each unit gives you your 500% bonus on top of your base peak speed, not your current peak speed.

The entire mischief with the weird stacking formula, dual MWD's, etc could be dispensed with by changing stacking to be additive, not multiplicative. Oh, and industrials will need a bit of boosting, because otherwise their cargo capacity is gonna blow Wink

Spanker
Bermuda Syndrome Industries
Posted - 2004.10.21 01:30:00 - [7]
 


Maya Rkell
Third Grade Ergonomics
Posted - 2004.10.21 01:38:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Maya Rkell on 21/10/2004 01:41:41
Darkwolf, thanks, fixed the base figure.

(Mine are right now - I don't know where you get the second as *6 rather than *5 from...)


And Spanker? That thread's for whining (yes, I'm wining about this Nerf Sad). This thread's for soloutions.

Maya Rkell
Third Grade Ergonomics
Posted - 2004.10.21 10:16:00 - [9]
 

Bump for Joshua...

Joshua Calvert
Caldari
Rule One
Posted - 2004.10.21 10:19:00 - [10]
 

My very own bump \o/

Sounds ideal to me, Maya.

Grim Vandal
Burn Proof
Posted - 2004.10.21 10:24:00 - [11]
 

Maya very nice this would work. Apply the same for AB's but give them +100% speed boost! but after that, nerf oversized AB's =) but again not before a missile change.


just think what would happen to your cruiser if you would have to outrun missiles with a mwd ... you would even die to 1400mm guns Laughing, so currently the cruiser needs the oversized AB to have a role in a battle but dont forget that exactly this role takes away the usefullness of an assault ships.

Cool

Toran Mehtar
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2004.10.21 10:41:00 - [12]
 

I also agree with the additive stacking solution, and have posted so previously. This would also make it very easy for CCP to make abs useful (i.e. boost them) without the risk of multiple abs being overpowered.

Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2004.10.21 13:45:00 - [13]
 

Also agree. The way stacking works in Eve results in a lot of breakage, multiple MWDs are just the most visibile result. Changing the stacking rules would be good...

... but it would mean a total rebalance of just about everything, and with Shiva etc around the corner I really don't think the devs even want to think about something like that right now Cool

Maya Rkell
Third Grade Ergonomics
Posted - 2004.10.21 14:31:00 - [14]
 

well my way they'd need to change 6 modules and rare versions thereof.

fras
Amarr
Posted - 2004.10.21 14:47:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Maya Rkell
Edited by: Maya Rkell on 21/10/2004 01:38:59

No, the best idea is to ADD speed for the MWD, not multiply it.

Look...

BS with 150m/s base speed, AT PRESENT

1 MWD = 150+(150*5) = 900 m/s
2 MWD = (150+(150*5))*5 = 4500 m/s


BS with 150m/s base speed, WITH ADDING

1 MWD = 150+(150*5) = 900 m/s
2 MWD = 150+(150*5)+(150*5) = 1650 m/s

BIG difference, neh?

And it works without changing the fitting system which works EXTREMELY WELL (you can fiy ANYTHING your slot types, cap and power grid allow), AT ALL.

You may wish to make AB's add as well to "nerf" dual-oversized AB-using ships.
(This hurts indys, but not THAT much)


I still think that with overdrives this would mean too fast a speed

Personally I'd prefer no dual mwd, no AB/mwd mix, no oversizes AB's and only allow stacking of your ship class' AB's.

If you want to travel fit overdrives and an mwd. The difference in time would be a few seconds per system compared to dual mwd.

Atm in a BS you have to be extremely unlucky to get stopped at a gate camp if you are packing just 1 mwd. Ships packing more than 1 are virtually indestructable bar pilot error.

The change isn't about travelling, most ppl use BM's anyway - it's about dual mwd ravens, stupidly fast cruisers and silly pvp.

I can't wait until it all gets patched out(hopefully).

Zarks
Corente Empire
Posted - 2004.10.21 15:45:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Zarks on 21/10/2004 15:49:27
If you are gonna take away all offensive capabilities then its better to take away targeting capacity. Then no scramble/web either if you got dual mwd fitted.
Only thing this could be used as then in combat would as a warp-in point or to find safespots.

-edit- maybe ravens could fins a weird FoF setup together witch a tackler but seems complicated.


 

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