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Kendrix Arathan
Minmatar
wiggle Tech.
Posted - 2009.09.05 19:26:00 - [31]
 

Quote:
John Logie Baird (August 13, 1888 - June 14, 1946) was a Scottish engineer and inventor of the world's first working television system in Hastings, England in 1923. An official blue plaque marks the house where this took place.


regular broadcasts started in 1927

also, I do enjoy being anal, ty for noticing



and if your point was what is widely available(which it wasn't), radio is VERY widely available at present day and covers most major sporting events.



My point which you neatly dodged, was not the how wide the usage, but the cost involved.

As you pointed out, you are paying for an Internet game, not an Internet broadcast of the tourney. The tourney is a free bonus.
So i guess your suggesting that we should be paying for the tourney feed? I'm sure they could broadcast video then.

PingKiller
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.09.05 19:26:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Tyzzara
What about an option for spectators at the tourny 'in game'?

Obviously local lag and such would have to be considered. But perhaps CCP could make it so people were not actually in system but simply an option to view the tourny matches? Minimal readout on ship specifics and details would be fine, even a global static overlay that no one has the ability to customize might work.

Just an idea. Would be cool to watch the tourny in game even if it was not like flying to a system and warping to the beacon to watch. Just a 'view only' option to allow me access to a camera drone or something would be sweet.
Cool

i like your camera idea, well, why not give player a "link" to one of those drone cameras which moderators use now also?

we just could click and view a bit...

or give a 3d model map with 10 numbers for every team and then we can see where they fly and shoot...

just an idea for future tournaments...

Steelzen
Posted - 2009.09.05 19:44:00 - [33]
 

Are trying to hide that you are a CCP employee? You must be since you are defending them at every little turn aren't you.

As for as dodging issues. You seem to be indenial that prior to AT6 the matches where broadcast live not just the final.

Which is my point we have taken a giant step backward not forward. Is that clear enough for you to understand?

Kendrix Arathan
Minmatar
wiggle Tech.
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:00:00 - [34]
 

Edited by: Kendrix Arathan on 05/09/2009 20:02:07
Originally by: Steelzen
Are trying to hide that you are a CCP employee? You must be since you are defending them at every little turn aren't you.

As for as dodging issues. You seem to be indenial that prior to AT6 the matches where broadcast live not just the final.

Which is my point we have taken a giant step backward not forward. Is that clear enough for you to understand?


ah the last play in the interweb war book of the troll, "you don't agree with me, so you must be working for them"

and your right, EVERYTHING about the internets, the economy, eve and the world in general is exactly like it was during at5 and prior. and the fact that they shut down eve tv and stopped video feed of the tourney can't possibly mean they were bleeding money from it like a gushing artery.

I would LOVE to see the whole tourney live on video, but I would rather CCP spend the bulk of it's money on game development, rather than pretty pictures.

More to the point, we're arguing over, 24-48 hours, as it will all be on youtube in the next day or so.

I'll take watching it a day later on youtube for free, rather than paying extra for it.

to quote the rolling stones: "you can't always get what you want..."

CCP Atropos

Posted - 2009.09.05 20:04:00 - [35]
 

The previous Tournament format was 2 weekends of 3 days (Friday, Saturday and Sunday) of live broadcast. This required us to have a filming location (either internal or rented externally) for in excess of 2 weeks (often closer to 3) for setup, production and the teardown, as well as requiring all staff and volunteers to be present for 6 solid days of filming and production work (the time on site was a lot longer since commentators would have to fly from their locations to Iceland, arrive, get over jetlag then prep for the Tournament, do the 3 days of broadcast, wait 4 days until the next weekend, do a further 3 days of broadcast, before being flown back to their origin which would involve anywhere between the absolute minimum of 11/12 days upto 20 days for production staff not part of CCP, which was most of the team for the early Tournaments).

Teams also found it difficult to take time off, should their matches fall on the Friday since you would have to either play from work (lucky) or book holiday and play from home.

By moving to the current format of 3 (real) weekends (Saturday and Sunday) of broadcast, we get the benefit of not requiring people to be onsite for the studio broadcast allowing the commentators to commentate from a location of their own choosing (naked in bed/lounging on sofas) as well as drastically reducing the disruption, work required, cost and overall anger levels of the staff. The fact it also has a knock on to the teams, allowing them to play in what is almost assuredly their days off is an excellent benefit.

The change is better for almost everyone with the only downside being that it's not possible to stream the fights live via video.

Steelzen
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:24:00 - [36]
 

Troll? Coming from you that is amusing.
Apparently our definitions of what a troll is must vary greatly. You have nothing to say other than to try and find the most minuscule error with what other people post. Not to mention your failure to comprehend what you read. In my opinion that makes you a pathetic little troll.

However that fact remains the matches where and still should be broadcast live.

Have you not noticed that most of the EVE community feels the same way? Of course you haven't.

DJ FunkyBacon
Eve Radio Corporation
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:31:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Steelzen
Troll? Coming from you that is amusing.
Apparently our definitions of what a troll is must vary greatly. You have nothing to say other than to try and find the most minuscule error with what other people post. Not to mention your failure to comprehend what you read. In my opinion that makes you a pathetic little troll.

However that fact remains the matches where and still should be broadcast live.

Have you not noticed that most of the EVE community feels the same way? Of course you haven't.



Obviously we would all like to watch matches live on a video feed like we used to, however, throwing a temper tantrum about it doesn't change the way things are, and also serves to make you look the ass.

The people who are crying the loudest seem to have the least actual understanding of what goes into these things. A video stream is several times larger than an audio stream, and bandwidth costs money. Aside from the bandwidth, as CCP Atropos mentioned, you might not also realize the costs of flying everyone to Iceland, plus housing and feeding them, nor the 3 weeks off work those volunteers would need to take.

The AT isn't all about CCP, it's about the eve community, and Eve, and if at some point you would like to contribute in some way that's more constructive than throwing a tantrum, I'm sure those involved would be willing to listen.

SSteejans
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:34:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: CCP Atropos
The previous Tournament format was 2 weekends of 3 days (Friday, Saturday and Sunday) of live broadcast. This required us to have a filming location (either internal or rented externally) for in excess of 2 weeks (often closer to 3) for setup, production and the teardown, as well as requiring all staff and volunteers to be present for 6 solid days of filming and production work (the time on site was a lot longer since commentators would have to fly from their locations to Iceland, arrive, get over jetlag then prep for the Tournament, do the 3 days of broadcast, wait 4 days until the next weekend, do a further 3 days of broadcast, before being flown back to their origin which would involve anywhere between the absolute minimum of 11/12 days upto 20 days for production staff not part of CCP, which was most of the team for the early Tournaments).

Teams also found it difficult to take time off, should their matches fall on the Friday since you would have to either play from work (lucky) or book holiday and play from home.

By moving to the current format of 3 (real) weekends (Saturday and Sunday) of broadcast, we get the benefit of not requiring people to be onsite for the studio broadcast allowing the commentators to commentate from a location of their own choosing (naked in bed/lounging on sofas) as well as drastically reducing the disruption, work required, cost and overall anger levels of the staff. The fact it also has a knock on to the teams, allowing them to play in what is almost assuredly their days off is an excellent benefit.

The change is better for almost everyone with the only downside being that it's not possible to stream the fights live via video.


most people dont care about seeing people in a studio, etc. all we want is to see the footage of the fights live. all the rest could be done with just audio.
hell, use webcams if you insist on seeing the commentators.. all i want to see is the pewpew
if it were live fights and then audio with a spinning CCP logo for the rest of the time i would be stoked. im sure 99% of everyone else would be too.

we want live fights, not all the studio bullsht.

Lance Dragmire
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:34:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: CCP Atropos


The change is better for almost everyone with the only downside being that it's not possible to stream the fights live via video.


Maybe I'm completely clueless, but would it not be possible to still stream the video, and just provide the commentary over EVE Radio as normal. Obviously the commentators are watching something remotely, why can't we watch it as well? Even a relatively low-res stream would make a lot of people stop *****ing. I'd be perfectly happy to watch a low-res stream plus listen to the commentary on EVE-Radio, even if it is a little out of sync or something.

Kendrix Arathan
Minmatar
wiggle Tech.
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:35:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: Kendrix Arathan on 05/09/2009 20:37:51
Originally by: Steelzen

Have you not noticed that most of the EVE community feels the same way? Of course you haven't.



i haven't noticed because it isn't there to notice. you can feel free to notice things that arn't there if you would like.

A loud vocal minority =/= a majority, you need to take a stats class lol

"OEMMGEE I SEE'S PEOPLES SAWIN STUFFS, TAT MEANS EVERYONE SAYS IT"

I'm not going to bother with the details, but rest assured this forum is a lousy cross section of the eve pop, and certainly not an accurate or large one.

Also, since you "flame the Dev's" and are a truth speaking rebel, there's a CCP employee above you, with a reasonable explanation (which you ignored). So feel free to yell at them like you do Rolling Eyes


more to the point, I reference my rolling stones quote. I bet you could take a poll and find out the majority of people would like a free million dollars. that doesn't mean they could or should get it.

Lord Gunny
Posted - 2009.09.05 20:57:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: Lord Gunny on 05/09/2009 20:59:04
I beg to differ.
I haven't been playing that long.
I did some homework and yes the previous ones where live.
I do believe that those that are interested in seeing them live are probably the majority.
I also disagree with the nonsense about sending people to Iceland.
I believe in a K.I.S.S. principle (Keep It Simple Stupid)
I don't believe all the bells and whistles are needed.
If the commentary for the current tourny is anything like for the live broadcasts you can do with out it.
I can see the game as I play it live my screen, there for logic dictates the same for broadcasting the game via the net live. (Yes I am aware that its a bit more complicated than that)
Still I would prefer to see it live.
Otherwise I honestly am not that interested in seeing the Final whether its live or not.


Iorya Dragon
Whale Riders
Posted - 2009.09.05 21:01:00 - [42]
 

"We also got big in the last 3 years, so we becomed very greedy. You want live stream for tourny? Give them a radio feed, that will be enough for now, will keep the money for the pub:))"

Sad CCP, u are getting greedier every year. At least u keept free expansions, for now. And consoles? MMO? U want to be EA sooon?

nom, nom, nom!

Originally by: CCP Atropos
The previous Tournament format was 2 weekends of 3 days (Friday, Saturday and Sunday) of live broadcast. This required us to have a filming location (either internal or rented externally) for in excess of 2 weeks (often closer to 3) for setup, production and the teardown, as well as requiring all staff and volunteers to be present for 6 solid days of filming and production work (the time on site was a lot longer since commentators would have to fly from their locations to Iceland, arrive, get over jetlag then prep for the Tournament, do the 3 days of broadcast, wait 4 days until the next weekend, do a further 3 days of broadcast, before being flown back to their origin which would involve anywhere between the absolute minimum of 11/12 days upto 20 days for production staff not part of CCP, which was most of the team for the early Tournaments).

Teams also found it difficult to take time off, should their matches fall on the Friday since you would have to either play from work (lucky) or book holiday and play from home.

By moving to the current format of 3 (real) weekends (Saturday and Sunday) of broadcast, we get the benefit of not requiring people to be onsite for the studio broadcast allowing the commentators to commentate from a location of their own choosing (naked in bed/lounging on sofas) as well as drastically reducing the disruption, work required, cost and overall anger levels of the staff. The fact it also has a knock on to the teams, allowing them to play in what is almost assuredly their days off is an excellent benefit.

The change is better for almost everyone with the only downside being that it's not possible to stream the fights live via video.

Kendrix Arathan
Minmatar
wiggle Tech.
Posted - 2009.09.05 21:04:00 - [43]
 

Edited by: Kendrix Arathan on 05/09/2009 21:06:47
Originally by: Lord Gunny


I can see the game as I play it live my screen, there for logic dictates the same for broadcasting the game via the net live. (Yes I am aware that its a bit more complicated than that)


understatement of the year, and it reinforces what funky said..

so gunny

You have no idea what your talking about
other than you think your right
under the current conditions it just isn't possible
regrettably it's true

Don't get you panties in a bunch but
ur doin it wrong
more than most do
but thanks for trying.

Si'ren
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.09.05 21:05:00 - [44]
 

Is the radio broadcast saved so people can go back and listen to the commentary? I was a player in one of the matches this morning and would like to hear the stuff they said.

OwlManAtt
Gallente
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2009.09.05 21:09:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: OwlManAtt on 05/09/2009 21:09:11
Originally by: CCP Atropos
stuff
I completely understand the logistical trainwreck of having your commentators on-site for several weeks so they can sit in the studio. But I'd be perfectly happy with no studio/remote commentators for the first two weeks - the only video we see is from the battlefield for the entire time. That's absolutely fine.

If the video is a cost thing (somebody on reddit said it was), maybe you could look in to using Octoshape for the next AT? Part of their distribution is done P2P, so maybe it'll be cheaper than whatever you're doing now?

Lord Gunny
Posted - 2009.09.05 21:18:00 - [46]
 

Edited by: Lord Gunny on 05/09/2009 21:19:04
Edited by: Lord Gunny on 05/09/2009 21:18:41
So what you are saying to me is the only opinion that matters is yours?
You must think quite highly of yourself.
If you do, trust me you are probably the only one.
I stand by what I said regardless of my experience in this game.
Broadcasting this tournament live is not the logistics issue that the Devs and others try and make it out to be. Get rid of the bells and whistles and you can cut the cost required to broadcast.

chiyo chan
Posted - 2009.09.05 21:24:00 - [47]
 

how about streamtorrent or alike?
should do HD easily with so many viewers, is ok to use and free.

Kendrix Arathan
Minmatar
wiggle Tech.
Posted - 2009.09.05 22:22:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Lord Gunny
Edited by: Lord Gunny on 05/09/2009 21:19:04
Edited by: Lord Gunny on 05/09/2009 21:18:41
So what you are saying to me is the only opinion that matters is yours?
You must think quite highly of yourself.
If you do, trust me you are probably the only one.
I stand by what I said regardless of my experience in this game.
Broadcasting this tournament live is not the logistics issue that the Devs and others try and make it out to be. Get rid of the bells and whistles and you can cut the cost required to broadcast.



We're all just random idiots posting on teh interwebs, outside of content, my posts matter no more than yours

your the only one bringing up your time playing.. you don't have to play for years to know things..

I've been more arguing bandwidth cost, not logistics, though your free to insist CCP is lieing to everyone (though if you realy belive that, why keep giving them money?)

Witless
The Scope
Posted - 2009.09.05 22:31:00 - [49]
 

How about this... Eve does a live stream a'la Pey Per View. Those who want to see it live then put up or shut up.

???

Krasavitca
Posted - 2009.09.05 22:42:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Dutschetss Vilhelmena
Best damn game in the world, but we can not see the tournament???

FAIL!Evil or Very Mad


+1

Unexpected nonsense from CCP Sad

Mkiaki
Gallente
Progressive Business Solutions
Posted - 2009.09.05 23:00:00 - [51]
 

Your whine and tears fuels my ships

Cadde
Gallente
221st Century Warfare
Posted - 2009.09.05 23:09:00 - [52]
 

How about this idea then?

Allow the client to record and play replay files!
That is, whenever the record button is pressed, every items location/action/health/YouNameIt is streamed into a file. (possibly with an .rpl extension like every other game)

That file can then be opened in the client using a special command, such as "/replay [filename]" and the client loads all the necessary models and effects and plays the action on screen.
Such replay files can be put up anywhere and depending on their length and accuracy (frames per second) will be anywhere from a mere 100 kb to possibly 100 MB for an hour of intense fleet fighting.
Very easily distributed over both the eveonline.com site and as torrent files. If players wanna have commentary to those files they simply download the appropriate radio/CCP commentary file.

For the last weekend in the tournament you (CCP) can then bring out all that shiny stuff in a studio if you like. I am only, like so many others, only interested in seeing the fight. Preferably from the angle i wanna see it. Which is perfectly possible in a replay file where you can move your camera around.

---

One could say having a replay function will make it too easy to follow what your enemy does and counter/copy his moves. In some ways that is true but lets not forget, EvE is enough of a sandbox that no matter how much you copy others you will still lose if you cannot adapt to new situations. In the same way one will lose if he never changes his approach in combat.
Also, currently there's plenty of copycats in eve, they copy your fitting, your methods and even your preferred prey. But when all comes around, you will defeat them in a one on one simply because you know why it works as opposed to them who simply know it should work and fly stupidly.

So, in simple terms... NO, replays won't make it so everyone flies ship A with fitting B using tactic C anytime soon! As it simply doesn't work that way in EvE!


Just my thoughts though...

Pater Peccavi
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
Posted - 2009.09.05 23:16:00 - [53]
 

AT7 IS TERRIBLE!!!!!!!11111

FAIL ALLIANCES THAT NOBODY WANTS TO WATCH GET IN VIA RANDOM DRAW!!!!!11111

I'M UNABLE TO WATCH(edit: live) THESE FAIL ALLIANCES I DON'T WANT TO WATCH BECAUSE CCP IS CHEAP/TERRIBLE/FAIL!!!!!111111

COMMENTATORS THAT I DON'T WANT TO LISTEN TO THAT ARE COMMENTING ON THE MATCHES I CAN'T WATCH(edit:live) FILLED WITH ALLIANCES I DON'T WANT TO WATCH ARE TERRIBLE!!!!!1111111111111111111

THE FAIL ALLIANCE THAT WINS THIS FAIL TOURNAMENT THAT I DON'T WANT TO WATCH BUT I'M STILL COMPLAINING ABOUT BEING UNABLE TO WATCH(edit:live) ONLY GETS SPECIAL FRIGATES, NOT SPECIAL BATTLESHIPS!!!!!!!111111111111111111111111111111111111ONEONEONE

Chelou
Gallente
SEX WITH PENYS
Posted - 2009.09.05 23:17:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: CCP Atropos
The previous Tournament format was 2 weekends of 3 days (Friday, Saturday and Sunday) of live broadcast. This required us to have a filming location (either internal or rented externally) for in excess of 2 weeks (often closer to 3) for setup, production and the teardown, as well as requiring all staff and volunteers to be present for 6 solid days of filming and production work (the time on site was a lot longer since commentators would have to fly from their locations to Iceland, arrive, get over jetlag then prep for the Tournament, do the 3 days of broadcast, wait 4 days until the next weekend, do a further 3 days of broadcast, before being flown back to their origin which would involve anywhere between the absolute minimum of 11/12 days upto 20 days for production staff not part of CCP, which was most of the team for the early Tournaments).
Teams also found it difficult to take time off, should their matches fall on the Friday since you would have to either play from work (lucky) or book holiday and play from home.

By moving to the current format of 3 (real) weekends (Saturday and Sunday) of broadcast, we get the benefit of not requiring people to be onsite for the studio broadcast allowing the commentators to commentate from a location of their own choosing (naked in bed/lounging on sofas) as well as drastically reducing the disruption, work required, cost and overall anger levels of the staff. The fact it also has a knock on to the teams, allowing them to play in what is almost assuredly their days off is an excellent benefit.

The change is better for almost everyone with the only downside being that it's not possible to stream the fights live via video.


Get professional ffs

Jason Edwards
Internet Tough Guy
Spreadsheets Online
Posted - 2009.09.05 23:31:00 - [55]
 

What gets me...

Isnt there a live video feed of the CCP fishtank?

How about panning that feed over so we can see a monitor?

How much bandwidth does ccp really have? Feeding out just the monitor of 1 of the commentators at meh resolution would do the job. You guys have some serious bandwidth to run the game, website, and others. We dont need to see you sitting around talking. We can leave that to utube videos.

Hell. You can even run one of the softwares which uses the upload of users to get the video out to each other. aka Bittorrent.


Essentially the buffer is fairly large. 5-10 mins. The upload of the swarm gets everyone going.

Our upload then serves to cover bandwidth costs.

YunFu Yan
Yan Enterprises
Posted - 2009.09.06 00:21:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Jason Edwards
How much bandwidth does ccp really have? Feeding out just the monitor of 1 of the commentators at meh resolution would do the job. You guys have some serious bandwidth to run the game, website, and others.


You realize, that the game servers are not located in island do you? The CCP headquarters might be running on as little as a 2Mbit/s ADSL line for all we know.

I sure know my company's office does and we run web applications for global concerns. Our servers are in a completely different location and use a completely different infrastructure than our office.


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