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Athre
Minmatar
The Higher Standard
Posted - 2009.08.29 01:18:00 - [151]
 

Poison, would you like to help EBANK liquidate? I know you often push your 20% limit on MinMa shares, we have plenty.

Companion Qube
Minmatar
Electron Conservation Inc
SRS.
Posted - 2009.08.29 01:20:00 - [152]
 

Originally by: Ray McCormack

Page six?


Exactly 29 posts per page brah.

Kitchie
Gallente
Vikramaditya
Posted - 2009.08.29 01:22:00 - [153]
 

Would somebody please shoot Ji Sama!

Every other post in every thread is some comment from Ji with no content or value.

Is this in some belief that quantity will lead to fame/respect over quality?

Ok, it worked for Paris Hilton....


Ji Sama
Caldari
Tash-Murkon Prime Industries
Posted - 2009.08.29 01:27:00 - [154]
 

Edited by: Ji Sama on 29/08/2009 01:30:07
Originally by: Kitchie
Would somebody please shoot Ji Sama!

Every other post in every thread is some comment from Ji with no content or value.

Is this in some belief that quantity will lead to fame/respect over quality?

Ok, it worked for Paris Hilton....




that is not true, i post meaningful stuff, in meaningful threads.
if the thread itself has no meaning, how am i supposed to be meaningful?
i cant create something out of nothing.

why dont you ***** about some of the other spammers, this isnt the first time you have been butthurt by my posting habbits!

Pick Ray for instance, the lynch mob is already out to get him, you would just have to join the chorus!


edit: if you look in the fist official announcement thread, i have posted what i had to say there, im merely using my free speech, to show you how much i care for all the other REDUNDANT ebank threads!

HawkBlade
Posted - 2009.08.29 01:59:00 - [155]
 

Originally by: Athre
Poison, would you like to help EBANK liquidate? I know you often push your 20% limit on MinMa shares, we have plenty.
This is the hidden point behind Block's activities. Some of eBank's remaining equity is invested in Block. If eBank was to liquidate Block would get his own debt back at a greatly reduced rate. In essence, Block is drumming up drama so that he can specifically rip off eBank customers.

My personal annoyance revolves around two points:

First, by naming myself, and few faultless others, you destroy any credibility in this action. Furthermore our statements of defense will create cover for those much more culpable. Simply put, you intentionally muddied the waters.

Secondly, it was bad enough that I was ridiculed, trolled, flamed, crucified, and finally relegated as "disgruntled" when I tried warning you and the rest of the public here about the failings I saw. Now your dumb ass wants to do it to me a second time.

Screw you, jenius.

PS: See, that's why this is going to go nowhere. You say your are roleplaying and that you are deadly serious. All I see is a serious jackass in deadly levels of denial.

HawkBlade
Posted - 2009.08.29 02:02:00 - [156]
 

Might I add that you also forgot to charge the public as part of this law suit. My moral outrage is greatly diminished from the efforts I made to warn them. The public saw fit to make a comedy show out of my warnings and the production cost was a whopping 1.4 trillion isk.

Tough **** if they are not happy with what they bought.

Thoraemond
Minmatar
Far Ranger
Posted - 2009.08.29 02:06:00 - [157]
 

What could a judicial panel say about criminal charges here (or a civil suit seeking financial redress) that amounts to something sufficiently different from moral censure to warrant the effort required to constitute and operate the panel?

As I've written before, this lack of criminal or civil sanction is a central and limiting problem of player-operated justice in New Eden. Where in the real world, the legal system is commonly granted a monopoly on the punishment of certain societal norms (laws), in New Eden there is no meaningful way for players to take on the role of 'imposer of sanctions', or to conduct basic information-gathering (e.g., identification of alts), so the tools are simply not available to players to create something like what might be called a 'municipal legal system' in the real world.

Like it or not, a (non-corrupt) legal system often serves as an underlying infrastructure that enables many of the more complex endeavours undertaken in a society. Leaving a player-run legal system out of New Eden limits the complexity of the endeavours that players can undertake. Maybe the remaining limited complexity is enough to make a rich game experience, but I'd be curious to see what player-run justice could do.

On a personal note, as someone with only a nominal sum on deposit with the Bank, I say just put the Bank into bankruptcy, have a trustee (or committee of trustees) liquidate it, pay out ISK-fractions on the ISK and have done.

Block Ukx
Forge Laboratories
Posted - 2009.08.29 02:32:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: HawkBlade
Originally by: Athre
Poison, would you like to help EBANK liquidate? I know you often push your 20% limit on MinMa shares, we have plenty.
This is the hidden point behind Block's activities. Some of eBank's remaining equity is invested in Block. If eBank was to liquidate Block would get his own debt back at a greatly reduced rate. In essence, Block is drumming up drama so that he can specifically rip off eBank customers.

My personal annoyance revolves around two points:

First, by naming myself, and few faultless others, you destroy any credibility in this action. Furthermore our statements of defense will create cover for those much more culpable. Simply put, you intentionally muddied the waters.

Secondly, it was bad enough that I was ridiculed, trolled, flamed, crucified, and finally relegated as "disgruntled" when I tried warning you and the rest of the public here about the failings I saw. Now your dumb ass wants to do it to me a second time.

Screw you, jenius.

PS: See, that's why this is going to go nowhere. You say your are roleplaying and that you are deadly serious. All I see is a serious jackass in deadly levels of denial.



Unlike EBANK, BSAC does keep strict records. I'm sure you have seen them, since SencneS have access to them.

EBANK invested 14,587,600,000 ISK in shares

On October 2008, EBANK traded 100,000 shares for a capital gain of 10 B ISK.

Presently EBANK owns 165,772 shares, which if they were liquidated at buy back (60,000 ISK) EBANK would receive 9,946,320,000 ISK.

The total return would then be 19,946,320,000 ISK, OR 5,358,720,000 ISK return on investment. Therefore, EBANK’s investment on BSAC has not incurred a loss.


Your defamation tactic is not going to work. I am sure SencneS can confirm this information. Please keep thread in topic.




Block Ukx
Forge Laboratories
Posted - 2009.08.29 02:34:00 - [159]
 

Originally by: HawkBlade
Might I add that you also forgot to charge the public as part of this law suit. My moral outrage is greatly diminished from the efforts I made to warn them. The public saw fit to make a comedy show out of my warnings and the production cost was a whopping 1.4 trillion isk.

Tough **** if they are not happy with what they bought.



You were hire to:

“Shar Tegral- Shar Tegral was someone we wanted from the start. Shar is well known in the business world, and has no IPO related commitments at this point in time. He has some coding skills that may assist the corporation at some point, but his strengths will be in ensuring full disclosure of corporate activities are in place, and ensuring the 'sheep' aspect of a board does not occur (everyone follow the leader).”

I believe you knew what was going on but decided to walk away and keep the public in the dark.


Athre
Minmatar
The Higher Standard
Posted - 2009.08.29 03:01:00 - [160]
 

Originally by: Block Ukx

EBANK invested 14,587,600,000 ISK in shares

On October 2008, EBANK traded 100,000 shares for a capital gain of 10 B ISK.

Presently EBANK owns 165,772 shares, which if they were liquidated at buy back (60,000 ISK) EBANK would receive 9,946,320,000 ISK.

The total return would then be 19,946,320,000 ISK, OR 5,358,720,000 ISK return on investment. Therefore, EBANK’s investment on BSAC has not incurred a loss.


Your defamation tactic is not going to work. I am sure SencneS can confirm this information. Please keep thread in topic.




You forget I too have access to the records as a share holder in my own right. What I am getting at Block is that the 3.06% gain per month due to devalued stock does not even meet the ROL for dealing with Savings accounts. If your stock were valued at 100 k like it should be, it would have covered more of the EBANK's customers interest. The sole reason for investing in you or anyone else was to cover the customer's interest.

So in essence while you are trying to point fingers, I am doing my due diligence to show that you as well are just as much to blame. I believe that is your topic - Blame, Name and Shame. Do not forget to name yourself.

Brock Nelson
Posted - 2009.08.29 03:42:00 - [161]
 

Well, this is a interesting read but couple of things

1. Who are the judge? How will you pick a judge that is not biased? You'll have to pick someone that isn't connected to EBank either through having an account or having EBank as one of the investor in their IPO. Even if you did confirm that they have no connection to EBank, how do you account for their alts? Other accounts?

2. Same thing for jury.

3. How is the punishment enforced? Execute them? Sure, recycle! Imprision them? Sure, stick them in a wormhole!

This is a fascinating read and unfortunately, it's ruined by Ji's usual mindless ramble just to get attention for himself...

HawkBlade
Posted - 2009.08.29 04:02:00 - [162]
 

Originally by: Block Ukx
I believe you knew what was going on but decided to walk away and keep the public in the dark.

The fact that you can say this only proves how moronic you truly are.

We are done here.

cosmoray
Perkone
Posted - 2009.08.29 04:53:00 - [163]
 

As fun as this would be its not going anywhere.
I would just like the whole issue closed out.

If the directors try to make a go of it, there will be flame threads for the whole year, or however long it takes.

EBANK should just be closed, people get some cash and everyone has closure and we move on.

Otherwise I see a whole year of MD arguments over the EBANK issue and how its going, etc....

LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2009.08.29 08:00:00 - [164]
 

Originally by: Redbad

We? Don't tell me you are still in this Ebank stuff after all that's been said and done.


I don't abandon friends.

Quote:
I believe that Lavista is possibly the worst perpetrator here, a real prince among the "MD Community" posing as a neutral representative on the CSM in favour of all MD etc when behind their backs he has stolen isk and been party, directly or indirectly, knowingly or unknowingly in RMT. I am surprised that CCP have not dealt with him summarily.

I have not stolen a single ISK.
I have actively been taking part in investigation of money laundering(RMT). I have never bought ISK.

So why should CCP "deal" with me?
Quote:
Personally I doubt this but he did leave Ebank at the most opportune time. I think Ebank for LaVista was intended to be a quirky footnote on his C.V

I'm still with EBANK, and has been so from the very start when Ricdic approached me about the idea back during summer 2007.

I was temporarily promoted to director while we were trying to get through the whole Ricdic issue a few months ago. A few weeks ago we decided that it was time to fill out the board again with active people. Hence we decided it would be in the interest of everybody to have Omber Zombie replace me.

Rhivre
Caldari
TarNec
Posted - 2009.08.29 08:24:00 - [165]
 

I believe, as Block has said, that he and I are of different opinions as to whether any crime has occured against the populace of New Eden.

If indeed he wishes to push for a pre-trial hearing in order to clarify this matter, then I am happy to state my case.

However, I believe an expert on the laws of each faction would have to be approached, as legality between the states that make up new eden varies (I am assuming we are in agreement that the factions which operate outside of Concord are not to be included).

Also, as Mr Nelson has stated, appointment of a judge and jury would indeed be an issue.

As Block is no doubt aware, the jury has to be open minded, despite any prejudice they may have following interstellar media reports, and as Mr Nelson states, they can have no relationship with any of the accused, either in a business, or more than a passing personal relationship.

For the record, I am happy to represent the defendents. I have no interests, nor interaction with their prior business, and whilst it is publicly recorded that I am a member of LaVista Vistas alliance I do not believe that this constitutes a conflict of interest.

However, as stated at the start of this message, before Block can proceed with his case, it must first be established that there is a case to answer.

It should also be noted that I am also of the opinion that there is insufficient grounds for either a criminal, or civil suit.

I suggest the first course of action should be to refer to our more learned friends within the intergalactic summit,as there are more knowledgeable persons on this subject than either Block or myself.

Felix Jugo
Posted - 2009.08.29 08:33:00 - [166]
 

As usual, the enforcement mechanism for this sort of thing is vigilante justice. The death penalty. Pod them as often as you like.

Scout 101
Posted - 2009.08.29 08:38:00 - [167]
 

lawyer here.
I will try the case, please send 30 bil retainer and I shall commence immediately.

Rhivre
Caldari
TarNec
Posted - 2009.08.29 08:41:00 - [168]
 

I have requested assistance from our learned capsuleers at the intergalactic summit, I propose that Block holds off on any further action until an answer is forthcoming. I propose a timeframe of 2 days to allow for research and response.

Wendy Spacetraveller
Posted - 2009.08.29 11:02:00 - [169]
 

itt: only in eve

Saartje Sarel
Posted - 2009.08.29 11:50:00 - [170]
 

Edited by: Saartje Sarel on 29/08/2009 11:52:36
cross posted.

5. Profit!!

Lord Apocrypha
Posted - 2009.08.29 12:00:00 - [171]
 

Edited by: Lord Apocrypha on 29/08/2009 12:01:00
Guilty as charged.

Karanth
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Directorate
Posted - 2009.08.29 13:40:00 - [172]
 

Edited by: Karanth on 29/08/2009 13:41:01
This ridiculous farce reminds me of that worthless "citizens grand jury" formed up of birthers that wrote up a terribly formatted and hardly legible indictment that was slammed by the court it was brought before. Part of why it was rejected is the fact that random citizens did not have the right to convene random grand juries, as that is a right reserved for the judicial branch of the government.

Or, in other words, random people can't usurp rights from government because they are insane/bitter/vengeful/made of potato salad.

But then again, I know in a thread like this, logic of any sort is out of place, so I will provide a translation:

BLOO BLOO HURR INTERNET LAWYERING BLOO BLOO A DURR


Karanth
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Directorate
Posted - 2009.08.29 13:55:00 - [173]
 

And also, let me be the first to say that we live in uncertain times. Our enemies have never been greater, and our very way of life us under threat of random suicide ganking terrorists and greedy executives robbing you, the people, of your money.

But sadly, the greed of those trusted people has resulted in personal bankruptcy declarations rising by 27% in the last quarter alone, with even greater shocks throughout the financial markets.

We're all hurting here. But things will get better. We can heal the system that greed broke here. The first steps of the revolution against our oppressors have already been taken, and while the road of change we travel is rough, we shall prevail!

What can you do to assist the revolution? Simple, easy steps. Stand in solidarity with your champions against the bourgeois capitalist pig-dogs. No matter what they tell you, disbelieve their lies and propaganda, and report it to the revolutionary committee. Refuse to toil under their weight and do all within your power to seize the means of production from the Elite!

We have the power to create a better world, one where we are equals, freed from our chains. Will it be easy? No. But can we do it, if we work together? YES WE CAN.


Block Ukx
Forge Laboratories
Posted - 2009.08.29 14:17:00 - [174]
 

Originally by: Rhivre
I believe, as Block has said, that he and I are of different opinions as to whether any crime has occured against the populace of New Eden.

If indeed he wishes to push for a pre-trial hearing in order to clarify this matter, then I am happy to state my case.

However, I believe an expert on the laws of each faction would have to be approached, as legality between the states that make up new eden varies (I am assuming we are in agreement that the factions which operate outside of Concord are not to be included).

Also, as Mr Nelson has stated, appointment of a judge and jury would indeed be an issue.

As Block is no doubt aware, the jury has to be open minded, despite any prejudice they may have following interstellar media reports, and as Mr Nelson states, they can have no relationship with any of the accused, either in a business, or more than a passing personal relationship.

For the record, I am happy to represent the defendents. I have no interests, nor interaction with their prior business, and whilst it is publicly recorded that I am a member of LaVista Vistas alliance I do not believe that this constitutes a conflict of interest.

However, as stated at the start of this message, before Block can proceed with his case, it must first be established that there is a case to answer.

It should also be noted that I am also of the opinion that there is insufficient grounds for either a criminal, or civil suit.

I suggest the first course of action should be to refer to our more learned friends within the intergalactic summit,as there are more knowledgeable persons on this subject than either Block or myself.


Your opinion has been noted. However, it is the job of a Grand Jury to determine if there is probable cause that a crime was committed. At present, I’m conducting an investigation with the purpose to prosecute the people responsible for an alleged EBANK fraud.



Karanth
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Directorate
Posted - 2009.08.29 14:27:00 - [175]
 

Ok, now that I have laid my groundwork here, I feel I can proceed.

Block, what the **** is your brain doing, that it calls this terrible mockery of rational thought worth not only considering, but typing out and then defending?

How could you possibly believe that this farce would actually result in anything of worth aside from inspiration for trolling? I'll address the "charges" from first an ingame perspective, and then an out-of-game viewpoint.

Firstly, under what authority do you charge EBank, let alone CCP, a not-in-game entity, with any of your listed accusations? The Yulai Conventions make no reference to, or provision for, non-CONCORD personnel such as yourself to bring forth charges against anyone. No Empire would ever bring them on behalf of you in front of the Inner Circle, as they would be laughed right out of the chambers.

On top of that, aside from using SCC-controlled fluid routers for money transfers, the SCC has no real standing in this case. At best, they could show that EBank, in a non-CONCORD-enforced contract, promised to give people money if they were sent money first. You can twist your language as you like, but that's what it is, and is no more worthy of CONCORD notice than your average 10x scam, or "forgetting" a zero on your contract for minerals or a Raven.

And now, how do you propose to make this joke indictment over internet space bucks work? Why start now, as opposed to all the other failures and scams of the past? If you claim size, then you lose any moral grounds to demand justice. Pray tell, what sort of legal procedure should we be using? American? Icelandic? Maybe just list out the 100 most important and well-known legal systems and see what the DOW end-of-trade numbers say we should use, in the best MD fashion? Laughing

Ooh, ooh, what about punishments? We can't forget that we need to determine a punishment for these crimes. We can't use the RL charges as those work under the understanding that legal tender is being used, not pretend money on a server in London.

Oh, but to apply these charges, we need an impartial judge, and jury. Now, who would be best to choose for these tasks? First though would be Chribba, as every inbred banjo-playing ****** can squeeze the only name they know out between drooling fits. But I would liken the odds of him wasting time here to be the same that every single WoW server simultaneously reformats itself irrecoverably.

Well, there is always CCP for a job of final oversight- oh, wait. They are named on the "indictment." Well, maybe T20 can come back for a guest appearance?

You have no way to perform any of the needed functions of a court of law, and no one here does. CCP does not either, as due process isn't a right, freedom of speech isn't a right, and transparency is as much as CCP wants.

Aside from possibly one of the better trolls in a while, and the satisfaction of a job well done on that I might add, you have nothing to gain, and more to lose. I'd say you'd be risking the respect of your peers, but really, who at this point really, in the last year, has trusted anyone farther than they can drive to their house and pummel them? I put cash into EBank, I took cash out of EBank, and I knew from the very first that the only person to blame if I lost money from it would be me.

Now, with all of that out of the way, we can get back on with this magnificent troll you got going here. I'll be back in a bit to toast a few marshmallows on that flaming over there.

P.S. And remember, just as the ore I mine is free, like my datacores, posting this has only increased the value I had before, except in spacebucks, the dividend here is in trollbucks.

P.P.S. whole lotta care up in here lol


Block Ukx
Forge Laboratories
Posted - 2009.08.29 14:36:00 - [176]
 

Originally by: Karanth
Ok, now that I have laid my groundwork here, I feel I can proceed.

Block, what the **** is your brain doing, that it calls this terrible mockery of rational thought worth not only considering, but typing out and then defending?

How could you possibly believe that this farce would actually result in anything of worth aside from inspiration for trolling? I'll address the "charges" from first an ingame perspective, and then an out-of-game viewpoint.

Firstly, under what authority do you charge EBank, let alone CCP, a not-in-game entity, with any of your listed accusations? The Yulai Conventions make no reference to, or provision for, non-CONCORD personnel such as yourself to bring forth charges against anyone. No Empire would ever bring them on behalf of you in front of the Inner Circle, as they would be laughed right out of the chambers.

On top of that, aside from using SCC-controlled fluid routers for money transfers, the SCC has no real standing in this case. At best, they could show that EBank, in a non-CONCORD-enforced contract, promised to give people money if they were sent money first. You can twist your language as you like, but that's what it is, and is no more worthy of CONCORD notice than your average 10x scam, or "forgetting" a zero on your contract for minerals or a Raven.

And now, how do you propose to make this joke indictment over internet space bucks work? Why start now, as opposed to all the other failures and scams of the past? If you claim size, then you lose any moral grounds to demand justice. Pray tell, what sort of legal procedure should we be using? American? Icelandic? Maybe just list out the 100 most important and well-known legal systems and see what the DOW end-of-trade numbers say we should use, in the best MD fashion? Laughing

Ooh, ooh, what about punishments? We can't forget that we need to determine a punishment for these crimes. We can't use the RL charges as those work under the understanding that legal tender is being used, not pretend money on a server in London.

Oh, but to apply these charges, we need an impartial judge, and jury. Now, who would be best to choose for these tasks? First though would be Chribba, as every inbred banjo-playing ****** can squeeze the only name they know out between drooling fits. But I would liken the odds of him wasting time here to be the same that every single WoW server simultaneously reformats itself irrecoverably.

Well, there is always CCP for a job of final oversight- oh, wait. They are named on the "indictment." Well, maybe T20 can come back for a guest appearance?

You have no way to perform any of the needed functions of a court of law, and no one here does. CCP does not either, as due process isn't a right, freedom of speech isn't a right, and transparency is as much as CCP wants.

Aside from possibly one of the better trolls in a while, and the satisfaction of a job well done on that I might add, you have nothing to gain, and more to lose. I'd say you'd be risking the respect of your peers, but really, who at this point really, in the last year, has trusted anyone farther than they can drive to their house and pummel them? I put cash into EBank, I took cash out of EBank, and I knew from the very first that the only person to blame if I lost money from it would be me.

Now, with all of that out of the way, we can get back on with this magnificent troll you got going here. I'll be back in a bit to toast a few marshmallows on that flaming over there.






Opinion noted.

Am I the only person that thinks a crime was committed? I doubt it, but if that is the case, then you have nothing to fear.

The investigation will continue. There is a lot of information that I have uncovered that you are not aware of.


Proton Power
Amarr
Retirement Retreat
Posted - 2009.08.29 14:36:00 - [177]
 

If I plead guilty can I only get 1 year probation since I saved the courts millions of isk on a trial for me?

Dzil
Caldari
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
The Fourth District
Posted - 2009.08.29 14:54:00 - [178]
 

Originally by: Block Ukx
Originally by: LaVista Vista
Are you suggesting that people should support class action over something that belongs to CCP?


Criminal in-game charges. I'm not talking about an outside lawsuit, but rather a law suit by the people of New Eden.

Originally by: LaVista Vista

You are also suggesting that people who had nothing to do with the disappearence of the ISK should be charged.


Only parties that in some form or manner participated or facilitated the Fraud are being charged.





Sure... nevermind that there is currently an ongoing WAR between the four empire factions to which the majority of MD assets belong, an ongoing WAR by the major players of 0.0 that the majority of the remaining minority belong, and a lawless middle full of pirates pretty much encompasses the rest.

If you were at all serious on this one, the cart is miles (sorry, kilometers) before the horse. You need trustworthy 3rd parties holding assets that can be seized as "damages", an elected or appointed judge based on some system of merit, and established court proceedings.

In lacking all of that, I'd recommend your best course of action is financial rebuke of any liabilities you might owe to ebank, and possibly guns. This post will have all the impact of an internet petition to legalize *********.

Karanth
Gallente
RONA Corporation
RONA Directorate
Posted - 2009.08.29 15:10:00 - [179]
 

Originally by: Block Ukx

Opinion noted.

Am I the only person that thinks a crime was committed? I doubt it, but if that is the case, then you have nothing to fear.

The investigation will continue. There is a lot of information that I have uncovered that you are not aware of.



Well damn, I sure got shown. Where does this sort of dismissal sound familiar frOHWAIT I KNOW IT'S THE SCAMMERS REFRAIN WHEN THEY GET CALLED OUT.

I mean, I know that hiding info is a time-honoured bull**** scam tradition and all, and "Well, that just, like, YOUR OPINION, man", constitutes a valid legal defense, right, but you know, you maybe, juuust maybe, actually answer a question instead of dancing around like a ballerina?

And do I think a "crime" was committed? No, as I am not a child who, upon discovering that my buddy who is running the bank in Monopoly is passing himself cash under the table, decides to call the police for committing bank fraud and violating a number of federal regulations.

But, you know, that's just, like, MY OPINION, man. Rolling Eyes


Aethrs
Posted - 2009.08.30 23:20:00 - [180]
 

Edited by: Aethrs on 30/08/2009 23:22:17
Hey, some pirates stole my cookies on the way to jita with them. That's theft, and I want criminal charges filed. I have evidence to prove this crime and believe CCP is also liable for enabling criminal enterprise such as this.

I hereby demand everyone don carebear suits and weapons will now fire love hearts to make all children cry with joy... because we have to protect children from things like evil space pirates.

Wait, arn't banks allowed to run off with our money in real life? Perhaps EBANK should get a bailout.



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