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Kel Shek
Posted - 2004.10.13 01:24:00 - [241]
 

Quote:
Dude, this is a ******* game, it's supposed to be entertainment, you know, fun?

Some of you ppl act like allowing players to actually have fun instead of slaving over this ******* MMO is a crime or something.

God Dammit it's supposed to be FUN!

A lot of you want to turn this game in to some type of masacistic online torture game for those of us who don't play the game exactly like you. **** off!
lol, this is funny. Razz how to explain this...

this is a real game that is meaningful, and has long term, gradual progress... NOT everything in it should be treated like, or is meant to be an instant reward, active *fun* thing. some of it is more long term investment type stuff. a POS is supposed to be a tool, not a toy. something utilized to make other things more fun/effective/easier. as well as it produce profit on its own.

do you have a house rule when playing monopoly that the "jail" is closed? why not? its not "fun" to do that...

Quote:
I've been playing for 15 months now, and it seems as though the most exciting content to date is not gonna be accessible for me, I'm ****ed.../quote] ... have you tried POS's in the test? lol, IMO, at least, they are kinda anticlimactic. again. this is in the nature of it being a TOOL. its not "exciting" as such,... kinda like getting a video card for a birthday present, Razz yeah, its great and new, but its not quite as "thrilling" as getting say... well something you actually USE, and DO things with. (ie: In game: level 4 missions)

Quote:
I've seen so much added to this game for PvP'ers, and very little for me, for 15 months. Now I finally get it, and I have to put my ass out there so the ******* PK'ers get a chance at me if I want to enjoy this new content.
umm... what about all that new mining content? the new varietys of ore and minerals? new ships? agents?

what do you want POS to be like that would let you utilize it, without entirely trivializing it for the 0.0'sers and high end content people?

DarkMatter
Sintered Sanity
Posted - 2004.10.13 01:37:00 - [242]
 

Quote:
what do you want POS to be like that would let you utilize it, without entirely trivializing it for the 0.0'sers and high end content people?


Why would it trivialize it for 0.0 corps?

They get to use them as remote refining outposts, and bases of operation.

What the hell do they care if I use it in Empire space to mine my low end, and now low quality ores, build & sell tech I stuff... Does it really diminish their fun? I think not...

You guys just don't want to see the likes of me have a POS in Empire, beacause you can't freely gank it whenever you want, it kills you to see "carebears" have fun, you want to force us to you, so you can feel powerfull & l33t killing players who have no interest in killing you... This is all what it boils down to, always has been, always will be...

It's your attitude that's the problem, your using game balance scare tactics to support your arguments, when in reality, my corp having a POS in Empire is not going to hurt the gameplay, or style of play of any of you out in 0.0 space...

Maya Rkell
Third Grade Ergonomics
Posted - 2004.10.13 02:02:00 - [243]
 

DarkMatter, with the fuss you've made, YOUR POS is probably toast anyway.


Kel Shek
Posted - 2004.10.13 02:10:00 - [244]
 

Quote:
What the hell do they care if I use it in Empire space to mine my low end, and now low quality ores, build & sell tech I stuff... Does it really diminish their fun? I think not...


I think you misunderstand the objection slightly.

in many opinions, at least, if they can be built in high sec, they should reasonably be able to at least break even run by someone who lives only in that space or higher.

how much ISK drain would it need to be, if yo uwere allowed to build it ANYWHERE, for you to just give up on the idea and use NPC stations? 1M a day? 2 a day? 5?

the whole point is that if it can be profitable for someone who doesn't go below .5, with 100% safety.... then it will be a trivial cost for people who DO work in the lower sec areas... you'd have people making POS on every moon everywhere, and simply not caring if it was blown up, as it was so cheap... and they could probably make it reasonably defended, so it'd take 10 people in BS's hammering on it for an hour or longer to take it down.. at a solo-maintainable cost.

am I getting through to you here? lol, I'm privately... hell my corp probably won't be able to maintain a 0.0 POS when Shiva hits. in low sec empire... posssibly. that make any sense?

remember that some people can apparently afford to lose multiple BS's in a row without a big problem. you have multi-billionaires... the leading edge content can't be avaliable to everyone, just those on the leading edge.

Archbishop
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2004.10.13 02:32:00 - [245]
 


DarkMatter I was once against the "only in 0.0" view too (look back at my posts). But I've been brought around to realize that in reality even the carebear industrialists can use them in .4 with proper defenses.

Look at my case. I'm in an Empire based corp with 20+ empire wars. But there are plenty of 0.0-0.4 systems in the Amarrian Empire thus there is a real chance for us to have a POS. As a chief Industrialist I have a vested interest in constructing a mining station. Being in Empire space if situated properly it won't be possible for the majority of 0.0 "gankers" to even get to it because they'd have to fly through empire to get to it. If they're true "gankers" they have the -9.0+ security standing to go with it.

With defense shield generators and Oppressor tower sentries I'm confident any station built by my corp will stand up to all but the mightiest Minmatar fleet. I'm sure the Minmatar terrorists are also planning right now for a secret base in one of their illegal strongholds in the Amarrian region of Heimatar (a little roleplaying there).

You've said you are being "denied" access to content. Thats just not true at all. I'd like you to open the map and see how far the nearest .4 system is from whereever you live. I'd guess its within 10 jumps. Its not that far.

The POS were designed to be work tools not trophies. While my desire to have one in Empire for Amarr (as a trophy - catch the flag sort of thing) I see that they are work tools for mining and development outside of Empire space. We have mining barges being introduced for Empire space and alot of market and trade enhancements directed toward Industrialists. I think we'll be fine.

Archbishop
PIE CORPORATION

These views are my own and not those of PIE CORPORATION

Dethra
Minmatar
Infusion.
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2004.10.13 02:44:00 - [246]
 

Originally by: Buggsi
And how can you gain territory if the only territory to gain is only available in 0.0 space?


You go attack and build a POS in 0.0... then you get the territory for yourself..

DarkMatter
Sintered Sanity
Posted - 2004.10.13 02:55:00 - [247]
 

Edited by: DarkMatter on 13/10/2004 03:01:53
Quote:
The POS were designed to be work tools not trophies


Exactly, basic game content that has been promised for over 12 months now.

POS's are not THE reward for taking the risk. The risk part of the equation should only come into play when you decide how much profit you would like to make from this structure.

Who says POS's need to be all the same? We have multiple types of ships, some more high end than others, some with better capabilities than others. POS's should be the same way.

The more unsecure the location gets, the higher profit margin potential increases. Better moons & roids out in 0.0 means, those who have the balls to risk losing a POS in 0.0, reap much higher rewards. Those who choose to place thier POS in 0.5-0.7 must realize they will be earning much lower profits, but should have this game content avialable to them, we still do pay a monthly fee. I know we are mere sheep, but we still pay to play.

You're right, it's not a trophy, it's a tool, a tool that all the players have been waiting for, and IMO deserve to be able to utilize.

0.5+ POS's will still be subject to destruction via corp war, so it is not zero risk.

Like I said b4, it's an attitude problem, not a game mechanic problem. It's PK'er rhetoric that is the issue at hand, not economic armageddon...

Quote:
DarkMatter, with the fuss you've made, YOUR POS is probably toast anyway.

That's life.

But if you don't speak up, you'll never be heard...

Pick Me
Posted - 2004.10.13 04:23:00 - [248]
 

Wow, all this talk about goods and bad for each, but let's look at what might happen.

The Carebear Menace (yes it's real and you are all going to feel it!)

First, POS in 0.0 space only (let's say!)

You get rich carebears that did'nt want to take risk because they did'nt have to take risk (zyd and mega CAN be buyed)

Now they look at it, after they crash the forum with hundread of post about it, they decide that having big wallet is no use and they can put aside 300 mil for a 0.0 POS venture (just to see).

Now many carebear WILL decide to do that!

So now you have all 0.0 INVADED by carebears from all over empire, even alliance will not be able to repell them all!

Pirate will have no place to hide, each system they jump it, there is 5-10 carebears mining (and/or agressive toward Pirate)

What's their weapons?
-Clearly the numbers (they will come hundred at the time!)
-They have nasty miner 2 laser that cannot just yet mine directly enemy ship hull, BUT, they sure have 50 drones each to deploy!
-Theses 50 Drones each will surely create a lot of lag, added to the crap in local that they will spill out!
-Contrary to Pirates, they like to stay around the same places, so they will know their surrounding, escape route etc better than a lost pirate venturing in their turf.

I'm telling you, pirates and alliance members will soon ask for a carebear nerf...

I can't wait!

Chaos (not the server name!) is just the start of the deep changes that are coming

S'Daria
Posted - 2004.10.13 04:31:00 - [249]
 

It will be a slaughter.

YARRRR!! >>>> ugh

pxmars
Aperture Harmonics
Posted - 2004.10.13 05:24:00 - [250]
 

well I been on the sever for a while building my own little safe spot. I know that you can build pos in empire space in .3 and lower. Depending on what you intend for the spot it can be for mining moon with a very nice defence or military base with tons of fire power. I hear of pos with 10-12 guns they could add many more as the control tower has power and cpu to handle. all kind of eletronic warfare mods and shield harders Missle batteries that hold thousand and thousands of missles . It will not be a easy matter to take down a pos will require lots of ships

drunkenmaster
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.13 08:27:00 - [251]
 

I want a Darkmatter of my own.

Any time I disagree with something, he could write sweary posts for me, and lower the quality of my side of the argument. It would be great. No more genuine/thoughtful discussions. Cussing is the future, my friends.

Joshua Calvert
Caldari
Rule One
Posted - 2004.10.13 08:33:00 - [252]
 

Originally by: drunkenmaster
I want a Darkmatter of my own.



You're not alone

drunkenmaster
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.13 08:55:00 - [253]
 

Originally by: Joshua Calvert
Originally by: drunkenmaster
I want a Darkmatter of my own.



You're not alone


Whoah! 90% of the universe! That's too big, I'd have to move house.

Request retracted.

meowcat
Aliastra
Posted - 2004.10.13 09:12:00 - [254]
 

#eve-warcry
[18:16] <Oveur> Starbases (POS) are for the more advanced player and will get available to younger corps when we allow them in higher security levels (Up to 0.8 planned)


Rolling Eyes

Avon
Caldari
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
Posted - 2004.10.13 09:24:00 - [255]
 

Originally by: meowcat
#eve-warcry
[18:16] <Oveur> Starbases (POS) are for the more advanced player and will get available to younger corps when we allow them in higher security levels (Up to 0.8 planned)


Rolling Eyes


Eve-tendo. Frankly I am disgusted, but unsurprised.

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.13 09:57:00 - [256]
 

Edited by: Sosona on 13/10/2004 10:03:12
Originally by: Kel Shek
I think you misunderstand the objection slightly.

in many opinions, at least, if they can be built in high sec, they should reasonably be able to at least break even run by someone who lives only in that space or higher.

how much ISK drain would it need to be, if yo uwere allowed to build it ANYWHERE, for you to just give up on the idea and use NPC stations? 1M a day? 2 a day? 5?

the whole point is that if it can be profitable for someone who doesn't go below .5, with 100% safety.... then it will be a trivial cost for people who DO work in the lower sec areas... you'd have people making POS on every moon everywhere, and simply not caring if it was blown up, as it was so cheap... and they could probably make it reasonably defended, so it'd take 10 people in BS's hammering on it for an hour or longer to take it down.. at a solo-maintainable cost.


From what i heard/read, the POS need some new stuff to be run - mined from icefields or something like that and those can only be mined in industrials. Some people argued that these fields dont even exist in empirespace. Moon harvesting seems to play a important role on how profitable/practicable a POS is and not every Moon will make sense to have a POS because of it.

One way of how CCP could do it, would be to initially have 5 places in each region in 0.5+ which are beeing auctioned off to the public via ingame RP auctions from the factions. Minimum bid for example 500 mil isk for a 3 month rent. Empirespace wont get icefields so people cant mine the required "fuel" to keep the POS running, the reason for this is that the empires themselves have plenty stations running and therefore as a critical resource, dont allow others to mine icefields. Another option would be to say that the icefields in empirespace have been long mined and the empires either have a secret technology to create artificial iceblocks which can be used for fueling or that the empires have mining ops in outer-region icefields and offer iceblocks for high prices on the npc market. In the later case, we would have a new market item with a high price which some rich ppl (owners of empirespace POS) need to buy. That would also result in a new income for low-sec owners or ninja-miners and traders.

Now you calculate the fuel-use each day of a small POS and add a daily renting fee on top of it so for example you come up with a price of 1.5 Mil ISK each hour to keep a POS in 0.5+ running. That means each month your POS in empirespace costs you 1080 Mil ISK.

Now calculate the average income each hour you can do with a mining BS (or a mining barge or whatever will be the #1 miner in empirespace in shiva) in a 0.7 system for example. Lets say it is 3.5mil ISK. Now if you allow a refinery structure in empirespace POS (what i would want), then you simply calculate how much max. profit each day a refinery structure should give. The costs each day are 36 million, the profit during 12 hours of mining for a day (50% activity of a single person) would be 12 * 3.5mil = 42mil. Add that up and you come to 36mil + 42mil = 78mil a day.

One "simple" way to make sure a POS with a single refinery cant make more then for example 80mil profit a day, would be to use a progressive refining tax - just like tax is used in some countries in reallife. Once you reach a througput of X-ore units (which sum up to a max of 80mil marketvalue), the refining tax would heavily rise. Like in reallife you will find out that refining/working more then a certain amount doesnt make sense because the tax eats it all.

A even simpler way would be to restrict a empirespace refining structure to a amount of N units of ore each hour/day and make it impossible to attach 2 refining structures to a control tower (like making a refinery structure needing 51% of the power of a tower).

So there - no super-isk making machine (those are in 0.0 sec anyway and contrary to the 0.0 people whining in this thread, you dont see me whining that 0.0 POS make alliances super-rich and therefore monopolize other markets like T2 BPOs which in fact is happening to a degree), no empirespace flooding of carebear POS and still it is new content for (some) people who dont want to team up with a existing alliance.

.. continued

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.13 09:59:00 - [257]
 

Edited by: Sosona on 13/10/2004 10:04:17
... continued

I would probably not allow offensive weapon structures to be attached in 0.5+ POS since the regional control (and defence) should be done by the governing regional faction. However for RPing POS like those of PIE and a corp war against them, that may be necessary. In reallife expensive structures/factories have armed guards too - however they are many degrees less capable then a army and in case of a attack they simply call the local enforcement authorities (concord).

This is just one quickly written example (which probably contains one or two misunderstandings of POS since i didnt test them yet on sisi) but i think you see how empirespace POS could be introduced while not screwing any game balance and beeing consistent with RPing and the eve universe/story.

Originally by: Kel Shek
remember that some people can apparently afford to lose multiple BS's in a row without a big problem. you have multi-billionaires... the leading edge content can't be avaliable to everyone, just those on the leading edge.


I think we are all agreeing that POS shouldnt flood empirespace and therefore the restrictions can be severe. However the "leading edge" isnt only "i can gank you faster" IMHO or else i dont see why CCP is investing so much manpower to create market, production, research, refining, mining etc. when they really just could have it like a pure pvp game like unreal tournament Wink

I am one of those multi-billionaires and i stopped making ISK a while ago, because it is no challenge anymore and there is no point in me having 2 billion or 5 billion or 10 billion. Because there simply is nothing i can do with it in eve. I have absolutely no interest in making even more pointless ISK with POS, it is only a new toy/content for me.

Myko
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2004.10.13 10:33:00 - [258]
 

auction? rent? but then it will favour the big corps, i pay my $15 a month, i should have access to all the stuff, why not make it a lottery? oh, cos then everyone who doesnt get one will claim its rigged... /sarcasm off

wouldnt it just be easier to make them low sec/ non-empire space? rather than having all these (likely to be bugged) rules and pre-requisites just make it a clear divide (like the current sec status is effectively), at least when Shiva hits tranquility. See how pos go, whether they are cost effective, how they work, what their defences are like against fleets etc. and then decide whether there should be any empire pos.

i think im gonna start a petition for darkMatter dolls in the eve store. Complete with 3 phrases: "no, your wrong", "your a PvP'er", "i'm a carebear" Twisted Evil j/k

Avon
Caldari
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
Posted - 2004.10.13 10:35:00 - [259]
 

Originally by: Myko

i think im gonna start a petition for darkMatter dolls in the eve store. Complete with 3 phrases: "no, your wrong", "your a PvP'er", "i'm a carebear" Twisted Evil j/k


I'll buy one if it comes with a free EVE-Online dart board, black candle or voodoo pins. :)

Varia
Gallente
Posted - 2004.10.13 10:41:00 - [260]
 

Lots of angry people here, shame really but due to the diversity of the world of eve these kinds of augments will always be with us.

I for one could not care less where a POS is allowed, Iíll build one in 0.0 if able and if itís gets destroyed then so be it.

I believe one of the main reasons for the anti POS in > 0.4 systems group is because with pos in empire space itís even more unlikely that they would travel into 0.0.
I donít see that as a problem, with POSers everywhere I see more targets for the corps that love destroying things.

I also see POSers in deep space like the old Wild West homesteads, constantly on the edge of destruction needing other homesteads to gang together to help defend each others plot of land.

One major point I donít think anybody has mentioned, when POSers are allowed in 0.0 space the majority of these people will be the same people that currently supply empire with the large amount of Z & M minerals over the past year, miners that only go into 0.0 from time to time will most likely find it harder to get in, which I think will mean that these high end minerals will skyrocket in price plus the availability will not be as abundant.

What would then happen to the empire POSers? Not only will they be constantly attacked by corps bent on destroying all empire POSers, but having to pay stupidly high prices for the high end minerals, I think in the end they will have no other choice other than to try claim there own plot of 0.0.

The more players that move to 0.0 space the safer 0.0 would become overall.

Good luck to all, and please allow players to play the game how they wish too.

Reloaded INC
Caldari
Pacific Dawn
Posted - 2004.10.13 10:49:00 - [261]
 

good sir's can we please have some civilty here, read my post and i will explain why u cant have POS in empire space.

take this example

a gank fleet decides that pirating and raiding in .4 and below is not lucrative enough they come across a sutible trade.

build an uber fortress in .5 space make an insta warp book mark to the fortress. get a gigantic armour/sheild tanking "set up" find a empire gate with little turret defense.

attack an indy or other craft carrying profitable goods. say for instance u fire 4 torpedos and hit your book mark by the time sentries and concord respond you are alrerady alligned for warp and of to your merry base of doom.

concord turns up and tries to wtf pown u in your fortress and promptly get slain enmass.

this is the reason why u cant have player owned structures in empire.

DarkMatter
Sintered Sanity
Posted - 2004.10.13 11:06:00 - [262]
 

Edited by: DarkMatter on 13/10/2004 11:22:52
Quote:
good sir's can we please have some civilty here, read my post and i will explain why u cant have POS in empire space.

take this example

a gank fleet decides that pirating and raiding in .4 and below is not lucrative enough they come across a sutible trade.

build an uber fortress in .5 space make an insta warp book mark to the fortress. get a gigantic armour/sheild tanking "set up" find a empire gate with little turret defense.

attack an indy or other craft carrying profitable goods. say for instance u fire 4 torpedos and hit your book mark by the time sentries and concord respond you are alrerady alligned for warp and of to your merry base of doom.

concord turns up and tries to wtf pown u in your fortress and promptly get slain enmass.

this is the reason why u cant have player owned structures in empire.



Uhm... If thier sec status is not high enough, not only should they not be able to own a POS in secure Empire space, but they certianly should not be able to dock with one...

Only upstanding citizens with the proper faction & security status should be able to own/operate & utilize the benefits of a POS in Empire space...

I'm not talking just the CEO either, the weighted average (based on position and duration in the corp) corp member sec rating & corp member faction should be taken into consideration...

There are plenty of ways to solve such issues...


Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.13 11:20:00 - [263]
 

Originally by: Reloaded INC
good sir's can we please have some civilty here, read my post and i will explain why u cant have POS in empire space.

take this example

a gank fleet decides that pirating and raiding in .4 and below is not lucrative enough they come across a sutible trade.

build an uber fortress in .5 space make an insta warp book mark to the fortress. get a gigantic armour/sheild tanking "set up" find a empire gate with little turret defense.

attack an indy or other craft carrying profitable goods. say for instance u fire 4 torpedos and hit your book mark by the time sentries and concord respond you are alrerady alligned for warp and of to your merry base of doom.


You can already do that. There is no need for a POS to run to, but i dont think i can explain the "how to" in this thread - that may get the thread locked or my post erased? I dont know, but if a GM confirms that i can post how you can kill people and escape concord no matter where, i will do it here. Probably would screwup systems like yulai a bit though and lead to more nerfs or concord upgrades.

For another possibility how to do that which is/was actively done in the past. I'll just mention the words "alt" and "caracal" here... isnt a real secret afaik.

Originally by: Reloaded INC
concord turns up and tries to wtf pown u in your fortress and promptly get slain enmass.


I fought concord and sentry guns with another char and i dont think that would work. Concord is currently rather "uber" and in that case would completely pwn your POS. If you kill one or two concord ships, it just makes more appear. They appear very very fast and arent that easy to take down anymore like they where before.

I guess we owe a lot of that to zombie inc's stunt in yulai a while back.

However - if you would pull such a stunt in empirespace with your POS, i would expect you to lose sec-status plus faction status and thereby lose your right to have the POS in the factions region.

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.13 11:24:00 - [264]
 

Originally by: DarkMatter
Uhm... If thier sec status is not high enough, not only should they not be able to own a POS in secure Empire space, but they certianly should not be able to dock with one...


Good point - they couldnt dock anyway.

The "running away before concord and sentries react" is anyway more of a problem then people may think. In my experience the lag is only on your clients side. Concord appears in numbers and i sometimes took damage before i even saw them appearing. The more appear, the more lag you get while they gank you. I doubt petitioning because of a loss like that would help you either Wink

Shambala
Minmatar
Doomheim
Posted - 2004.10.13 13:12:00 - [265]
 

Quote:
"Not only will they be constantly attacked by corps bent on destroying all empire POSers, but having to pay stupidly high prices for the high end minerals, I think in the end they will have no other choice other than to try claim there own plot of 0.0."

Wait a minute that seems to imply there are griefer corps running around like crazy. We all know there are no griefers and gankers in Eve and there never have been. The danger is all carebear paranoia right? The guys in 0.0 alliances who say there's some risk all say its overblown. Yeah sure it is.
Quote:
"I guess we owe a lot of that to zombie inc's stunt in yulai a while back."

Im not familiar with this Zombie Inc or what they did as I'm pretty new to Eve. I assume it was griefers working around somekind of exploit or glitch in the game to grief newbies in Yulai which is supposed to be empire space thats safe? Oh wait we don't have griefers in Eve. Everyone is responsible no one would do something like that.
Rolling Eyes

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.13 13:28:00 - [266]
 

Originally by: Shambala
Im not familiar with this Zombie Inc or what they did as I'm pretty new to Eve. I assume it was griefers working around somekind of exploit or glitch in the game to grief newbies in Yulai which is supposed to be empire space thats safe?


They used several ships with remote shield/cap transfer to tank one ship against the sentries and concord in yulai. That ship then killed and podded mostly everybody it could who came to the gate/station.

I think some of the results where the insane increase of sentry guns in empirespace (8 instead of 2 or 4), the increase of damage of sentries, the increase and variation of sentry gun range, making sentry guns nearly invulnerable to scrambling, introducing the criminal tagging system and making it a hostile act if somebody supports a "criminal" with remove shield/cap transferers. I am not sure if they also made sentry guns invulnerable to dampening, because i know that was used after the incident in other places (a bunch of BBs or scorps dampen sentry guns at stations or gates so they cant hit any agressor).

Several of zombie where (temporarily) banned after that, but i think it had another reason - cause they didnt stop with killing people after the GMs told them to. But that is just hearsay Smile Yulai had a very high killing and podding rate that day and the GMs had to process many petitions of lost ships, implants and items from what i heard.

The tactic wasnt really new, i did see it in discussion in pvp corps way before zombie did it.

Einheriar Ulrich
Minmatar
Vengeance of the Fallen
Syndicate.
Posted - 2004.10.13 13:28:00 - [267]
 

Originally by: Shambala
Quote:
"Not only will they be constantly attacked by corps bent on destroying all empire POSers, but having to pay stupidly high prices for the high end minerals, I think in the end they will have no other choice other than to try claim there own plot of 0.0."

Wait a minute that seems to imply there are griefer corps running around like crazy. We all know there are no griefers and gankers in Eve and there never have been. The danger is all carebear paranoia right? The guys in 0.0 alliances who say there's some risk all say its overblown. Yeah sure it is.
Quote:
"I guess we owe a lot of that to zombie inc's stunt in yulai a while back."

Im not familiar with this Zombie Inc or what they did as I'm pretty new to Eve. I assume it was griefers working around somekind of exploit or glitch in the game to grief newbies in Yulai which is supposed to be empire space thats safe? Oh wait we don't have griefers in Eve. Everyone is responsible no one would do something like that.
Rolling Eyes



Not griefers, just opportunistic scavengers, helping the shipbuilding industryCool

Sorry this is a PvP game, not sims in space

Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2004.10.13 13:30:00 - [268]
 

Originally by: Einheriar Ulrich
Sorry this is a PvP game, not sims in space


w00t! Cool

DarkMatter
Sintered Sanity
Posted - 2004.10.13 13:42:00 - [269]
 

Quote:
Sorry this is a PvP game, not sims in space



All you PK'ers will have to realize someday that it is a comination of the 2, not strictly one or the other.

0.0 lawless
0.5 to 1.0 lawfull
0.1 to 0.4 in-between

This game is for everyone dude...


Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2004.10.13 13:49:00 - [270]
 

Edited by: Seleene on 13/10/2004 13:53:38

Originally by: DarkMatter
Quote:
Sorry this is a PvP game, not sims in space



All you PK'ers will have to realize someday that it is a comination of the 2, not strictly one or the other.

0.0 lawless
0.5 to 1.0 lawfull
0.1 to 0.4 in-between

This game is for everyone dude...



What the heck is a PK'er?! What game are you playing? This is EVE, not Diablo or Ultima. Grrrr, I hate that term! Evil or Very MadEvil or Very MadEvil or Very Mad

The people in EVE who enjoy PvP, the vast majority of us anyway, are not mindless savages who just want to gank anything that crosses our path. It seems as if you just want to lump us all into one basket. We have feelings too, ya know? Crying or Very sad

EDIT: My point is that, at least speaking for myself, I understand that the game needs all kinds of players. I've never spoken out against the need for people who suck on 'roids all night; I'm just glad I'm not one of them! Cool


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