open All Channels
seplocked EVE General Discussion
blankseplocked POS for carebears
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: first : previous : ... 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 [13]

Author Topic

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.19 10:10:00 - [361]
 

Originally by: DeFood
*sigh*. Not irrelevent. 0.5 and up are "safe". POS are inherently not safe. Therefore they dont belong in high sec empire.


Please point me to where CCP or the developers said that POS are inherently not safe and also where they said that POS would be not available for NPC corp members. You keep basing your discussion around it.

My point to have POS personally in 0.5+ is that they would be safe as i am in a NPC corp.

Discorporation
Amarr
Evolution
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2004.10.19 11:04:00 - [362]
 

Originally by: Sosona


Please point me to where CCP or the developers said that POS are inherently not safe and also where they said that POS would be not available for NPC corp members. You keep basing your discussion around it.

My point to have POS personally in 0.5+ is that they would be safe as i am in a NPC corp.


GG in shooting own your own argument..

PoS are high-end toys, their defenses and the forcefield that keeps them invulnerable for a time (whilst under attack) as well as your ability to semi-time how long it takes before it leaves reinforced state is all the evidence we need to claim that they're meant as bases that can be destroyed. Their very gameplay aspects proves this, no need for ccp to come out and say "HAY GUYS U CAN SHOOT AT THESE THINGS, K?"..

So, being that they are able to make a profit, and that they're combat-related, having them 100% safe is completely contrary to their purpose. Since you already stated that your presence in an NPC corp would make em 100% safe (since you can't be wardecced), you argued for NOT having them in 0.5+ space.

again, gg :)

Buggsi
Posted - 2004.10.19 11:23:00 - [363]
 

Why not just make it a prerequisite, you MUST be in a corp to own a POS. So any other CORP can declare war on you.

Marcus Aurelius
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2004.10.19 11:33:00 - [364]
 

Originally by: Buggsi
Why not just make it a prerequisite, you MUST be in a corp to own a POS. So any other CORP can declare war on you.


It already is, you can only anchor pos for your corp, not for yourself. Members of an npc corp dont get the role that aloows anchoring of stuff for their corp, hence NPC corp members dont get to play with pos.

//end

Valentine Keen
Thundercats
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.19 11:34:00 - [365]
 

Originally by: Discorporation
Originally by: Sosona


Please point me to where CCP or the developers said that POS are inherently not safe and also where they said that POS would be not available for NPC corp members. You keep basing your discussion around it.

My point to have POS personally in 0.5+ is that they would be safe as i am in a NPC corp.


GG in shooting own your own argument..

PoS are high-end toys, their defenses and the forcefield that keeps them invulnerable for a time (whilst under attack) as well as your ability to semi-time how long it takes before it leaves reinforced state is all the evidence we need to claim that they're meant as bases that can be destroyed. Their very gameplay aspects proves this, no need for ccp to come out and say "HAY GUYS U CAN SHOOT AT THESE THINGS, K?"..

So, being that they are able to make a profit, and that they're combat-related, having them 100% safe is completely contrary to their purpose. Since you already stated that your presence in an NPC corp would make em 100% safe (since you can't be wardecced), you argued for NOT having them in 0.5+ space.

again, gg :)


But let's make sure we catch that distinction.

NPC corp in 0.5, sure. Player corps in 0.5 can still fight over them, so that's while you're right that its not a great argument to allow them, it doesn't preclude them from 0.5+

Yes the risk will be lower, but rather than fixate on balancing risk vs reward by attempting to disallow them in safe space, simply reduce the rewards of owning them in safe space instead.

That way everyone gets to use them, but no one can argue that they're unfair or altering the risk reward balance.

(While they're at it, improve the middle ores like Hedbergite or something to make 0.4 worth going to and I for one would happily set up shop out there. To an extent, I'm hoping the random ore changes in Shiva will make it viable to head out to low sec, for the chance at the odd Gneiss rock or two etc.)

Buggsi
Posted - 2004.10.19 11:37:00 - [366]
 

Originally by: Marcus Aurelius
Originally by: Buggsi
Why not just make it a prerequisite, you MUST be in a corp to own a POS. So any other CORP can declare war on you.


It already is, you can only anchor pos for your corp, not for yourself. Members of an npc corp dont get the role that aloows anchoring of stuff for their corp, hence NPC corp members dont get to play with pos.

//end



<---Im with stupid.

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.19 12:29:00 - [367]
 

Originally by: Discorporation
GG in shooting own your own argument..

PoS are high-end toys, their defenses and the forcefield that keeps them invulnerable for a time (whilst under attack) as well as your ability to semi-time how long it takes before it leaves reinforced state is all the evidence we need to claim that they're meant as bases that can be destroyed. Their very gameplay aspects proves this, no need for ccp to come out and say "HAY GUYS U CAN SHOOT AT THESE THINGS, K?"..

So, being that they are able to make a profit, and that they're combat-related, having them 100% safe is completely contrary to their purpose. Since you already stated that your presence in an NPC corp would make em 100% safe (since you can't be wardecced), you argued for NOT having them in 0.5+ space.

again, gg :)


I dont see the difference to a apoc stripmining away in 1.0. It is the same kind of safety, it doesnt have restrictions in mounting offensive or defensive modules or using them at all - the difference to 0.0 or 0.4 is merely the risk vs. reward - you make much less ISK per hour with this previously high-end toy. While you can more or less easily gank a frig or industrial in 1.0 and get its loot, it is nearly impossible to do the same with a battleship. Exactly the same like it would be for POS if they could be owned by a NPC corp member.

So i dont see at all how i argued against my own case.

Beside this - it was already discussed that empirespace POS shouldnt/wouldnt be able to use all different modules for example like offensive ones or refinery or labslots.

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.19 12:32:00 - [368]
 

Originally by: Marcus Aurelius
It already is, you can only anchor pos for your corp, not for yourself. Members of an npc corp dont get the role that aloows anchoring of stuff for their corp, hence NPC corp members dont get to play with pos.

//end


If that would be the final way how POS are introduced into eve, then my personal case would indeed be ended as it means no POS without severe risk.

DeFood
Gallente
UMEC
Posted - 2004.10.19 12:40:00 - [369]
 

1. POS are not "player houses".
2. POS are not a toy for NPC corps. (NPC corps already have (indestructible) NPC owned stations. Ha!)
3. There is no need to allow POS in 0.5+. Restricting them to 0.4 and below does NOT exclude anyone from owning a POS. Anyone willing to own/operate a POS is implicitly willing to operate in 0.4 down. Any players who feel they are being excluded by this policy should not be allowed to operate a POS as they clearly do not understand the role of, or risks inherent in, owning a POS.

Valentine Keen
Thundercats
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.19 13:29:00 - [370]
 

Originally by: DeFood
1. POS are not "player houses".
2. POS are not a toy for NPC corps. (NPC corps already have (indestructible) NPC owned stations. Ha!)
3. There is no need to allow POS in 0.5+. Restricting them to 0.4 and below does NOT exclude anyone from owning a POS. Anyone willing to own/operate a POS is implicitly willing to operate in 0.4 down. Any players who feel they are being excluded by this policy should not be allowed to operate a POS as they clearly do not understand the role of, or risks inherent in, owning a POS.


YOUR definition of its role anyway.

As I've said before, there would be risks with ownership in 0.5+ and not all functions of POS make them only beneficial in low sec space.

By all means they should be of limited use in 0.5 and above, but I still don't understand any real reason that anything other than Risk vs Reward should govern these, as with any other items owned by players.

drunkenmaster
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.19 14:51:00 - [371]
 

Originally by: Sosona
Originally by: Marcus Aurelius
It already is, you can only anchor pos for your corp, not for yourself. Members of an npc corp dont get the role that aloows anchoring of stuff for their corp, hence NPC corp members dont get to play with pos.

//end


If that would be the final way how POS are introduced into eve, then my personal case would indeed be ended as it means no POS without severe risk.


So, leaving the NPC corp is now 'severe risk'?

Whatever next?

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.19 15:33:00 - [372]
 

Originally by: drunkenmaster
So, leaving the NPC corp is now 'severe risk'?

Whatever next?


Try to read and understand the whole sentence i wrote and even in context of the topic of this thread Rolling Eyes

Avon
Caldari
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
Posted - 2004.10.19 15:35:00 - [373]
 

I read it the same way as DM, maybe you should re-word it?

Bhaal
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2004.10.19 15:47:00 - [374]
 

Quote:
I read it the same way as DM, maybe you should re-word it?


That's because you two are...

Ah, never mind, I just got back from being banned...

Avon
Caldari
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
Posted - 2004.10.19 15:52:00 - [375]
 

Originally by: Bhaal
Quote:
I read it the same way as DM, maybe you should re-word it?


That's because you two are...

Ah, never mind, I just got back from being banned...


Are what?
If you haven't got the guts to speak your mind, don't post.

Someone ban him again please?

Bhaal
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2004.10.19 15:57:00 - [376]
 

Edited by: Bhaal on 19/10/2004 16:06:02
Quote:
Are what?
If you haven't got the guts to speak your mind, don't post.


I have the balls, but what I would say is against the forum rules, so I'll hold back this time.

If you have nothing nice to say...

But seriously, I don't think NPC corp members should be able to operate a POS...

I agree 100% with whatever DarkMatter has said in this thread however...

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.19 16:08:00 - [377]
 

Originally by: Avon
I read it the same way as DM, maybe you should re-word it?


What i mean is that i cant have a POS as a single person then. I would have to join a corp or create one and that would open up the possibility for anybody to declare war on me and my POS. Now for the POS it depends on the circumstances if it would be a "severe risk" in 0.5+ as i could simply uninstall it if i am away for some days, but as a trader you have to do a lot AFK travelling in empirespace and getting wars on me means that AFK travelling with expensive stuff is too much of a risk. I used to sell goods for low prices so they sell quick and therefore i had a small profit margin. Losing one load worth of 200mil or so could mean a week of trading without profit.

Dont underestimate serious trading - we have our wars too and people do get ruined and try to get even or they just try to get a lead in supply by ganking you and taking the loot Smile If i see somebody regularly re-selling expensive stuff and i know their source (which regularly happens), i will ofc consider ganking them and taking their stuff or pay somebody to do it. Its quick profit. So beeing in a NPC corp is much better.

Apart from that - i like my npc corp, i like helping new players and occasionally organising something with/for them.

Avon
Caldari
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
Posted - 2004.10.19 16:19:00 - [378]
 

Originally by: Bhaal
Edited by: Bhaal on 19/10/2004 16:06:02
Quote:
Are what?
If you haven't got the guts to speak your mind, don't post.


I have the balls, but what I would say is against the forum rules, so I'll hold back this time.

If you have nothing nice to say...

But seriously, I don't think NPC corp members should be able to operate a POS...

I agree 100% with whatever DarkMatter has said in this thread however...



lol, you would though, wouldn't you? Wink

Xavier Arron
Minmatar
The Knights of Ni
Posted - 2004.10.19 17:26:00 - [379]
 

Edited by: Xavier Arron on 19/10/2004 17:31:14
Edited by: Xavier Arron on 19/10/2004 17:29:33
OMG - this is just someone trying to be funny? must be some ebil pirate alt.

Originally by: Sosona

What i mean is that i cant have a POS as a single person then. I would have to join a corp or create one and that would open up the possibility for anybody to declare war on me and my POS.


Oh no - no more zero risk, someone may declare war on me, even in empire. (Possible consequences for your actions?).

Originally by: Sosona

Now for the POS it depends on the circumstances if it would be a "severe risk" in 0.5+ as i could simply uninstall it if i am away for some days, but as a trader you have to do a lot AFK travelling in empirespace and getting wars on me means that AFK travelling with expensive stuff is too much of a risk.


LOL - AFK travelling in 0.5+ empire is just too risky. Then donít AFK travel.

Originally by: Sosona

I used to sell goods for low prices so they sell quick and therefore I had a small profit margin. Losing one load worth of 200mil or so could mean a week of trading without profit.

Dont underestimate serious trading - we have our wars too and people do get ruined and try to get even or they just try to get a lead in supply by ganking you and taking the loot Smile If i see somebody regularly re-selling expensive stuff and i know their source (which regularly happens), i will ofc consider ganking them and taking their stuff or pay somebody to do it. Its quick profit. So beeing in a NPC corp is much better.



Your ganking people? you must be a griefer (acording to this thread.)

You also stay in an NPC corp to avoid all risk, while you gank players from other corps and avoid the possibility of getting declared war on ugh.


So lets all have ISK making POS COMPLETELY risk free in empire space by asking for it to be possible for single players in NPC corps to be able to build POS.

Since no defence will be needed they can save on running costs and make even more money than any other corp who would have to deploy defence.

drunkenmaster
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.19 17:45:00 - [380]
 

Sosona, there are hundreds of corps in this game, and many that have never had a war dec on them.

One of my accounts has his own corp, and has for several months, He's been based out of a 0.4 system for the last 6 at least, and has never had a war dec, never been attacked, and hasn't even been randomly targetted, as far as I can remember.

The risk is higher, naturally, because someone *could* war dec me, or attack me out in the belts. But they haven't. I've only ever seen one pirate in this entire region, and that was me. And I didn't attack anyone here either, it's not worth my time. And in general, 3-4 man corps don't get wardecced, because there's no point, unless they have made a point of causing trouble in some way or form.

And if you still want to help out the new guys (which is a cool thing to do. I used to like it a lot) then join a corp that does that, like BALEC, or one of the player-made academies.

DeFood
Gallente
UMEC
Posted - 2004.10.19 21:34:00 - [381]
 

Originally by: drunkenmaster

And in general, 3-4 man corps don't get wardecced, because there's no point, unless they have made a point of causing trouble in some way or form.


Yes. No one *currently* bothers to war dec small corps because there *IS* no point.

Post Shiva however, some griefer corp stumbles upon a luxurious POS with all the trimmings. Investigation reveals a small corp behind it.

**** it! I'd bloody war dec and attack it. Its a challenge.

Tharrn
Amarr
Epitoth Fleet Yards
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2004.10.19 22:06:00 - [382]
 

Originally by: Sosona
Originally by: Avon
I read it the same way as DM, maybe you should re-word it?


What i mean is that i cant have a POS as a single person then. I would have to join a corp or create one and that would open up the possibility for anybody to declare war on me and my POS. Now for the POS it depends on the circumstances if it would be a "severe risk" in 0.5+ as i could simply uninstall it if i am away for some days, but as a trader you have to do a lot AFK travelling in empirespace and getting wars on me means that AFK travelling with expensive stuff is too much of a risk. I used to sell goods for low prices so they sell quick and therefore i had a small profit margin. Losing one load worth of 200mil or so could mean a week of trading without profit.


We have 20+ wars going and I am *still* flying AFK when I am not near the known hotspots :P
You really underestimate the size of Empire space. If you travel a lot and know what you are doing it is very, very unlikely that you bump into an enemy by chance. It's a common misconception that being at war equals being under siege 24/7.

Sosona
Posted - 2004.10.19 22:37:00 - [383]
 

Originally by: Tharrn
We have 20+ wars going and I am *still* flying AFK when I am not near the known hotspots :P
You really underestimate the size of Empire space. If you travel a lot and know what you are doing it is very, very unlikely that you bump into an enemy by chance. It's a common misconception that being at war equals being under siege 24/7.



Been there, done that (with another char). Having seen ppl lose all their stuff repeatedly due to it.


Pages: first : previous : ... 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 [13]

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only