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blankseplocked [psych] The Theory of the Failure Cascade: How Alliances Die
 
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Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2009.07.17 18:15:00 - [91]
 

Originally by: Stahlregen
Edited by: Stahlregen on 17/07/2009 17:49:54
Originally by: Kayosoni
better games come out. Like Aion.



HahahahhahahahaHAHAHUELELELLELEAIKSBDASDJASDKASD

Yeah, enjoy your typical-korean-grind-fest-lineage-clone.

edit:
Quote:

Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence



I get a bit of a semi reading that.





wts Valakas neck, $5000.

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

Yazoul Samaiel
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.07.17 18:33:00 - [92]
 

Originally by: Talon Scorpio
Originally by: Nought Prymary
Originally by: Talon Scorpio

It depends on how the "pain" is coped with. Examples of whole alliances that end up camped into stations by a few persistent lurkers in local are prevalent.


You all should listen to Talon Scorpio on this subject. Having been in both Rise and Kenny, and probably having lots of old corp friends in Skunk-Works, Aggressiondot, and numerous Kenny pets, Talon can tell us with much first-hand experience "How Alliances Die."


That's right, I have always been the common element. I also killed Red Alliance. Just ask Bapp.

Next.



How is your "Proud last stand " in delve and quesrious going ? I heard its going to be epic and no matter what goons do you guys will still win.


Ohh wait...Neutral

KayenTelva
Minmatar
Mara Riganis
Posted - 2009.07.17 20:52:00 - [93]
 

i guess being paid to point out the obvious and take credit for spaceship slang is profitable

who knew ?

Danton Marcellus
Gallente
Nebula Rasa Holdings
Nebula Rasa
Posted - 2009.07.17 22:40:00 - [94]
 

Edited by: Danton Marcellus on 17/07/2009 23:19:31

No-one outside EVE knows what a CSAA is, not everyone in EVE does.

Also we're another alliance of ourselves, warded against cascades, though we're not on that scene so it remain a curious note.

Someone ban the furry for breaking the thread with his enormous shaite image.

Terribad
Gallente
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.07.17 22:57:00 - [95]
 

wow it's like i'm reading about IRON/AGGRO/MH/EXE/etc. fascinating.

nadro
Gallente
Wreckless Abandon
Minor Threat.
Posted - 2009.07.18 11:56:00 - [96]
 

Though i didn't read the article (knew the answer already Cool) i will add big words to this discussion. Fail is now, as others claimed too, pretty much expected in many cases. After numerous and richly documented ones, CAOD can easily claim 'world forum on fail'. Alongside that - and mostly ignoring each other, is a growing number of people that will join what brings friends, fun or roids, expect it to fail in caodian terms or believe in whatever goal, leave-point-laugh, join a new one or switch game. Players that don't even bother to plan that far ahead in game or don't care if their current efforts 'fail' in the 'long term'. They are that way either by original or by acquired-through-constant-fail gamestyle, with the later mostly padding the numbers these times.

A new group usually guarantees fun during the first steps, with active leadership (#2 reason of short-term success) and fcs (by far #1 reason for any success whatsoever in eve - if they 're any good). And many times without some of the 'seriouz' aspects that joining an 'established' one may have. If you remove the 'omg our house is on fire' aspect, all you have left is a game. Go around, pick a team, enjoy.

Ofc there's always a ghostly alignment for most players due to their past, friends, enemies, whatever, and also to add to the much needed rp that raises the fun level. Even if you hate all, you really enjoy killing goons eer i mean some more than others.

Somewhere in that wall i had a point, finders keepers.

hmm this can be the tl;dr i guess, in a game fail is the opposite of how serious you are about it:
Originally by: The Mittani

emotional investment in sports is common, just as it is in games, you'll note that i did not deny this in what you quoted

the particular stressors which render combat and war so damaging simply don't exist in games or sports, which is why i stay away from any ~sun tzu~ or battlefield analogies


dt over..

Clementina
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2009.07.18 12:51:00 - [97]
 

The Engineering term is Cascading Failure. If you google that (Or maybe "Cascading Failure"), you will see references to technological Systems that fail because a small part of them fails and somehow drags the rest of the system with it.

If you google Failure Cascade, you will see references to Space claiming Eve online alliance that have failed, and speculation as to why.

The Byzantine Generals Problem also seems like a useful engineering problem that could be used to analyze Eve Alliances in some kind of way, I just don't know how yet.

Twilight Magester
Caldari
Foundation
Posted - 2009.07.18 13:00:00 - [98]
 

Edited by: Twilight Magester on 18/07/2009 13:05:24
Originally by: Clementina
The Engineering term is Cascading Failure. If you google that (Or maybe "Cascading Failure"), you will see references to technological Systems that fail because a small part of them fails and somehow drags the rest of the system with it.

If you google Failure Cascade, you will see references to Space claiming Eve online alliance that have failed, and speculation as to why.



It's actually pretty funny, I used failcascade in class one day when we were talking about elevators failing, and successfully identified another EVE player :D

The Mittani
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.07.18 17:55:00 - [99]
 

Originally by: Talon Scorpio
The Mittani *names have Power, everyone knows that* , we find in you the shades of both William and Henry James.
I am very nearly willing to wish upon you the same disease of mind suffered by both gentlemen, but I expect everyone has dark moments at 3AM.

Add to the worthless undergraduate Psychology degree those of English, Religion, Philosophy and MFA's from self important Writer's Workshops. The pride of Cheever, no less, and life in all of it's tedious minutiae, so eventually breaks a heart, etc etc etc.

Anyway, I was bored and did not avert my gaze from the ****ograpy you wrote. It appears your pleasure was not so sublime, indeed the contrary.

I think that within any situation when one gives over control on a mental/emotional/psychological level, ie, identifcation of self with an outside entity, learned helplessness does develop. The certain requirement in the arena of EVE, is that there then has to be the retention of strong leadership that acts with intent and direction.
Leadership gets tired, it burns out, it fails to evolve to changes, it gets lazy, it forgets that demands for obedience are paid for by the coin of co-dependence.

It is a known phenomena that chronic low level pain can induce an awareness of one’s helplessness, followed by frustration, depression.. Suicide.

Bathos slips silently in the cacophony of Pathos and such entertainments as we had the last few months ensues.

Boredom, such a slippery slope.






your posting style has taken a distinct turn towards yoda of late it seems

Jimmy Duce
Gallente
Chaotic Tranquility
Posted - 2009.07.18 18:45:00 - [100]
 

Quit stealing my ideas, or did I originally get it from you:D

Shidhe
Minmatar
The Babylon5 Consortuim
Posted - 2009.07.19 17:21:00 - [101]
 

I guess its game theory (in a technical sense). Individual strategies vs. collective ones. The collapse comes when the breakdown is so obvious that most people no longer fear retribution for abandoning the ship. Up to that point, almost any bad policy is accepted, after that point everyone turns on the leader and says 'shame' despite the fact that they were all in the same boat before.

For example - the economics of a bubble is simply that standing up and saying 'this is getting really silly' in the middle of one will result in
1) You make a loss compared to everyone else as the bubble continues to grow
2) The bubble goes POP and everyone blames you for popping it.

Often the timing results from one action: The 'loyal' deputy who says the right or wrong thing. Or the breaking of the accepted rules by the leadership making everyone realise that they no longer have the protection they thought they had. The common things are that it will have been obvious to any outside observer that the Emperor has had no clothes for some considerable time, and that there will have been a 'whispering campaign' in the ranks for almost the same time.


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