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Wannabehero
Wayward Ventures
Posted - 2009.06.01 18:56:00 - [211]
 

Hey Folks, to late to hop on the new forum-hate internetz-bandwagon?

Rolling Eyes

In seriousness though, I'm glad some changes are being done, should be more. More agents, more corporate diversity of agents (i.e. more corporations supplying high lvl good quality agents in varying fields), more reward from non-combat missions (mining and true manufacture pls!), more reward for running missions in low-sec, more rewards from low-sec exploration, and more diversity in missions (waiting to see what changes are being made on this front).

Thanks for a least this small token of improvement though.

Yahrr
The Tuskers
Posted - 2009.06.01 19:39:00 - [212]
 

Originally by: Tarodir
Want lv 4 mission runners in lowsec? Change the way scanning works, i tried to run one in lowsec and got probed out in about a minute.


I think we see the difference here between low and high sec habitants. How does it come that a high sec person get's killed within minutes while many low sec people fly the same ship until they try something way over the top (aka suicide mission)? I get the feeling here that high sec makes people blind and totally unaware of their surroundings, partially thanks to the protection that concord provides and the lack of cooperation with other players. Besides, if you limit yourself to high sec you miss 80% of the game...

Keep your eyes, your overview, scanner and local window open and you will be alright in low. That is if you don't try anything stupid like going for a mission in Aeschee or OMS of course.

I'm trying to make pirating a living and probing mission runners is fun imo, but the real reason (err.. semi real reason) that I support the idea of getting more people to low sec is to show them that there is more than the little world we call high sec. Explore the game, make a sunday trip to the New Eden wormhole, command your battlehauler of Doom to pick up your low sec buy orders, etc...

[/Aargh]

Nessa Aldeen
Caldari
The Sword and The Shield
Posted - 2009.06.01 20:03:00 - [213]
 

CCP I've been in missions for a long time now..Mostly to feed my ravenous need to kill in pvp, I need to grind pointless, wave after wave of missions that is about as exciting as watching Super Glue bond.

Bellum has a point.. the rewards in L4 missioning is huge. I make about 100m (if I'm lazy) a day, and make sick isk for no risk. However, being gunned down my some pirates in pvp fit while missioning in low risk is not something a missioner wants. Why risk my capital ship so that a pirate can go "LOL you noob?" There are tons of solo missioners out there who go into game, day in day out to make the isk that fund the economy from low sec and 0.0. True.

But for the love of eve, the changes you propose wont do jack. Just like L5 agents, they fail to attract the numbers because pirates want in on easy kills. and it will certainly not change the hubs.

I propose two different and drastic changes. The first is a revamp of the system of agents and how they work. A missioner (noobs or vets) is a given a range of agents they can pick from say 5 Level 1s. And each agent isn't too far away from one another or in low sec. The missioner then has to reach the 10.0 agent loyalty in which in turn he can choose to choose another agent from a different set..e.g. Level 1s again or Level 2s (they have no quality). And so on and so forth.

This makes the missioner to MOVE away from the same hub over and over again. Upon reaching the 10.0 mark, there will be a reward/award from that agent and he cant ask from that agent any longer.

Now, let's say hypothetically the missioner has done EVERY SINGLE agent for that faction (which I doubt,,, so you might wana tweak it a bit.). The missioner is now granted access to exclusive access to agents that give out locations to wormhole missioning/or faction killing. These agents are located in low sec and hi-sec. SO whats the difference? One mo..

Which comes to the revamp of the missions themselves..instead of endless ganks, endless trips from point a-b and endless mining. Make them more interesting by having missioners having to repair a ship while tanking, warp scramming a target ship, camping a gate (within the dungeon), etc. Courier missions while traveling from point a to b they have to deliver inside the dungeon i.e. station or ship and along the way theyre attacked (so the cargo either needs to be protected or small quantites)

Now for the low sec/faction militia (massive fail the latter) mission running, avoid slugfests that make the missioners a sitting duck for pirate and pirate-wanabes i.e. use of covop ships/stealth bombers and cruiser sized and BC/t3 class ships.

The idea is to make the missioners SWEAT but giving them a chance to gtfo say 50/50. Now if you dont like that idea, these missions can occur in wormholes or dungeons that have a time limit (a cover generator i suppose by the agent) before they are exposed to probes by pirates or gankers. After which, they can either gtfo or risk it.

So what about rewards? Faction/special/sleeper drops and higher isk rewards and NOT bounties x1000000! Be serious CCP, having carriers running mission for level 5 is not what they are meant for. And its isk farming in a very large way.

Each special agent will offer the missioner a chance to be a true merc say every 30 mission to have a KILL RIGHT (Concord issued!) on criminals (-2 and below) with high bounties (which the criminals will not know who but are told they are now a target) located either in low or hisec. A true crossover from pve to pvp. Either that or make us a Merc sub profession :P

These special agents have inexhaustible number of missions but will only issue a certain number of mission before the missioner is referred to another agent. The previous agent will then contact the missioner after a certain time or award limit. Make these agents award special stuff not FLUFF.

Dont make missioners travel in BS for 11 jumps in low sec infested pirates to do Low sec L4s.

oh yeah, TL;DR.

Animka
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2009.06.01 21:07:00 - [214]
 

Edited by: Animka on 01/06/2009 21:14:17
Originally by: CCP Molock
Part of the incentive for this initiative has to do with the fact that a lot of this stuff has been sitting in the game for years and simply needs some freshening up.


And its still sitting there... adding some agents here and there isnt really refreshing anything.



Originally by: Nessa Aldeen
Make them more interesting by having missioners having to repair a ship while tanking


Thats a great idea. To repair while repairing, hmm... very interesting.


Quote:
camping a gate (within the dungeon)

Ohoho... that would be pretty pointless and boring. Unless there is a chance for a NPC hauler full of valuable BPO`s jumping in.

Adept Hunter
Caldari
Posted - 2009.06.02 00:54:00 - [215]
 

I feel so bad for mission runners in low sec..... lol
Go navy!

Tarodir
Posted - 2009.06.02 02:09:00 - [216]
 

Originally by: Yahrr
Originally by: Tarodir
Want lv 4 mission runners in lowsec? Change the way scanning works, i tried to run one in lowsec and got probed out in about a minute.


I think we see the difference here between low and high sec habitants. How does it come that a high sec person get's killed within minutes while many low sec people fly the same ship until they try something way over the top (aka suicide mission)? I get the feeling here that high sec makes people blind and totally unaware of their surroundings, partially thanks to the protection that concord provides and the lack of cooperation with other players. Besides, if you limit yourself to high sec you miss 80% of the game...

Keep your eyes, your overview, scanner and local window open and you will be alright in low. That is if you don't try anything stupid like going for a mission in Aeschee or OMS of course.

I'm trying to make pirating a living and probing mission runners is fun imo, but the real reason (err.. semi real reason) that I support the idea of getting more people to low sec is to show them that there is more than the little world we call high sec. Explore the game, make a sunday trip to the New Eden wormhole, command your battlehauler of Doom to pick up your low sec buy orders, etc...

[/Aargh]


I agree people should explore the game. I've been playing for over 3 years and i've done pvp in lowsec and 0.0 and run missions, that's why i run missions is to lose ships. PVP ships that is, not get killed by pirates while running missions.Very Happy The way low sec missions are now lv 4 and 5 its just not profitable enough. I admit it can fun though. The nighthawk and fittings i took in lowsec cost just over 300mil and was in the process of soloing a lv 5 when 2 pirates warped in. So it was me vs 15 npcs + 2 pirates(devoter/typhoon)i aligned to the highsec gate, killed the npcs that were scraming. After about 10 minutes of them shooting at me, not being able to break my tank they gave up and i warped to highsec. I thought that was funny, fail gankers.Very Happy

That's my example of how lowsec mission running can be fun and potentially unprofitable at the sametime. If i did lose that nighthawk would taken a bunch of missions to replace, thus unprofitable. Now if they did increase the profit and made it slightly harder to probe, not impossible just harder i don't think it would be hard to get a couple people together to risk doing missions in low sec.

Cpt EVGA
Caldari
Enter The Shadow
Posted - 2009.06.02 04:34:00 - [217]
 

LVL 4 missions suck now, all the loot and bounties have been reduced....

super fun to rip around in a tengu in one though heh

yonpytr
Amarr
Posted - 2009.06.02 04:55:00 - [218]
 

Great, new agents that i won't be using, but i guess it must benefit someone.
Will they help to lower the load in busy mission hubs? time will tell.

IMHO one option to break the busy mission hubs is to have an equal number of level 4 agents in all regions and with all corps in null, low and high sec. This means that if you have 50 agents in caldari high sec, 20 in low sec and 10 in null sec, you should have the same numbers in the other empires and null sec regions. If you keep adding agents mostly to caldari, you will get more players in caldari space until you need to dedicate a whole server just to that region.

I'm more familiar with amarr agents, but i'm sure there are similar cases in all regions.
If a corp like Ardishapur has only 2 lvl 4 agents, (Q-17 and Q-14) one in 0.5 and the other in 0.4, and another corp like Civic Court has 12 lvl 4 Q20 agents in 3 systems in low sec (not counting other lvl 4 agents), this needs to be rebalanced.

I think many of us would like to know how CCP decided adding agents was a solution and what other options they considered, but I won't hold my breath.

One question, where are the Viziam R&D lvl 4 agents?

One suggestion regarding missions with sleeper AI, CCP could introduce them like storyline mission, after a number of normal missions (hopefully less than 16), an agent (the same, a storyline or a new kind of agent) could offer it. After that, frequency can be adjusted.

There are improvements we want, improvements we need and improvements we get.

Lugburz
Group 2
Posted - 2009.06.02 05:08:00 - [219]
 

Edited by: Lugburz on 02/06/2009 05:12:32
LOL

No low sec agents, i really hope you guys mean 'no low sec PIRATE' agents? Stop looking for easy prey your as bad as the guys in nubhubs killing ibis's.
As for the faction agents mainly being caldari i sort of understand as a most of the people who run missions do so in caldari space - but i dont think you asked why, to my knowledge caldari space is good to run missions in as most of the hubs are far enough from low sec to not get missions there and also there are a fair few systems that have more than 1 level four agent in one station which doesnt seem to be quite the same for others.
No small rats in missions anymore? Does that mean i know longer have to worry about being scrammed?? WooT! personally i think missions would be better if kitted out like PvP so instead of umpteen dumb bs/bc/frigs you would only get a few but using dif tactics (so use the templates for falcons/rooks/arazu's etc - curses would be EXCELLENT rats in missions for blood or sanshas) im not sure why its not so?
A thought on empire faction low sec missions (just a thought) maybe solo mission runners could be assigned wingmen (much in the same way as fighters work) for dangerous low sec missions?
Any changes to COSMOS areas? Also what about agents like Bosmeiver mauls or whatever his name is (the second lot of agents from the graduation certificate tree that dont work)
My five minutes anyways Very Happy

Edit: Yes i know some of the above has been mentioned before but i cant remember the arguments against them, i definetly remember seeing the fighters one.
as for low sec missions, well i would rather do missions in 0.0 than do them in low sec - in 0.0 at least you know who your fighting against or at least what your up against seems less risky, prolly just more people roaming low sec.

Sister Tisiphone
Posted - 2009.06.02 05:16:00 - [220]
 

Edited by: Sister Tisiphone on 02/06/2009 05:17:31
Originally by: Terranid Meester
Eve is pvp first and pve second.

Perhaps the developers have forgotten that basic bit of info? Level 4 missions make too much for little effort. They should all be moved or changed into the lower sec scheme of things. Let level 3 missions take over from level 4's in high sec. Grinding Level 4 mission runners should be made to make more effort for their isk. In fact remove the grind.


Care to prove this ?

If this were even remotely true, the dev blog wouldn't have been talking about the majority of players missioning in Caldari Hi sec.

You seem to forget what EVE really is: It's a business. While you and several others may enjoy PvP, ganking and piracy, CCP must make sure that there is enough content in the safe areas of the game to ensure their players do not get frustrated by the griefers out there and stop paying their $14.95 a month.

When this happens, even the PvP crowd loses: Less carebears coming into lo sec to lose their ships to the griefers. (And by griefers, I mean those who gank a ship that has no chance of surviving the encounter: A gate camp taking out an Iteron I is simply ruining the game for the Iteron pilot, unless a ransom is at least offered)

Some people seem to have this silly, almost childish misconception about PvP and how it's the be-all and end-all of MMO's; When done right, i.e. when a player is given a choice in whether to participate or not (i.e. aware of the risks), it works well. When forced into PvP (i.e. moving all L4 contacts into lo sec), it is inevitable that they'll meet up with the pirates who are really teenagers being raised in a trailer park, getting their kicks out of blowing up the no0bs.

Before you start screaming for how every little target - err, player - should be moved to lo sec, think a moment about the business aspect of the game: You have to take care of / please the carebears because they're the ones paying the bills.

So if you want something for lo sec, pirates, gankers, etc, come up with an equally balanced suggestion for the carebears. Making suggestions that only benefit the lo sec gankers are pretty much going to get ignored, as they rightly should be.

Rip Minner
Gallente
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
Posted - 2009.06.02 05:51:00 - [221]
 

Originally by: thorax spartan
(having players in corps fighting over a good agent sys willnot only make the game more fun but will make all the carebears band together to fight off highsec merc's and other carebears for for cntrl of mission sys's


Why do you think carebears will fight over cntrl of a missioning system. You cant force us to pvp. We dont fight for low sec or null sec ether. You guys got to get it into your thick heads you cant make non pvp players suddenly want to pvp. The best rewards for fighting are already there in low sec and null sec.

We run missions becouse we like pve content. Were not going to suddenly start pvping to get at are pve content.

Junko Togawa
Caldari
Posted - 2009.06.02 06:36:00 - [222]
 

Yay for CCP, cleaning up the overview, streamlining L4's and adding more agents to hisec, the one true home of the dedicated Mission Runner! PvE gets some lub, and I get mad lulz at all the tears and braindead 'solutions' pouring forth from the butthurt piwate-alt forum warriors ITT.

Go CCP! Long live EvE! ugh

AncientLord
Posted - 2009.06.02 09:40:00 - [223]
 

Edited by: AncientLord on 02/06/2009 09:44:05
Originally by: CanI haveyourstuff
Originally by: CCP Fallout
blablablablaaaa.....dev blog.



CCP and guys who work on this "improvement" , I'm sorry to be rude but this shows ****ing clearly that you do not have any damn idea about this game.

Why do you have to do everything against what your players ask?????

I really hope that you NOW READ this feedback what players have written here and reconsider some stuff about this "improvement"



This is so true, developers have clearly showen.... they dont have any idea how the game goes.

Originally by: Poreuomai
Am I the only one who is not too concerned about agent quality? Most of my (alt's) mission income comes from bounties, loot & salvage, which are not affected by agent quality.



Your thinking out of the box, while others dont :).

carebear one
Posted - 2009.06.02 11:55:00 - [224]
 

I think this tweak of the mission system is a good start by CCP.

Also I dont understand why there is so much complains about pushing up the numbers of caldari agents. Even the players who are now complaining about that using most of the time caldari agents because there is the fact with this agents is the lowest chance to be send to the low sec.

Also this whining about moving Level 4 agents to the low sec is redicioules ... what will happen then? Most of the mission runners wont use the level 4 agents anymore. The risk of loosing a multimillion ISK mission ship due to pirats, gangers and griefers is not compensated by the reward of those mission (beside there is a growing number of players in EVE, even if the pvp-player like that or not, who dont like to be forced to a pvp-fight and those players are also paying customers who making CCP able to pay there employees and to keep EVE online)
and it is a fact the a pve-ship has few to none pvp-capabilities even like a pvp-ship cant run a higher level mission.

Arran Ramir
Posted - 2009.06.02 12:34:00 - [225]
 

Edited by: Arran Ramir on 02/06/2009 12:38:13
The current mission system is just Fail in EvE, and i cant grasp anyone who does them for fun..
Dont get me wrong, i run each weekend mission in High Sec getting my wallet up, to buy new ships i loose in PvP in the rest of the week (my corp aint active in weekends)..

But i HATE running these missions, its a nessecity, thats all, their not fun too do, nor even challenging by now, but they are the best and fastest means too grind ISK in the game, if you arent into trading, or buying ISK.

I am not able too run 0.0 belts nor plexes due too heavy hostilities in the area i'm bases at in 0.0 space, and i loose enough in PvP that i dont want too be jumped by some griever piwaat that thinks he is cool by jumping in my mission pocket shooting my multi billion faction fitted CNR when i allready have a load of lol rats on me, while the reward of that mission is not more rewarding as that backwater agent in Empire..

If i risk a multi billion ISK ship, i want too be rewarded accordingly, in PvP there is a golden rule, dont fly want you cannot afford too loose.

A other thing is why people dont want too risk ships, is price vs reward, keeping them stuck too empire..

If i look at myself, i play since 2006, i got for PvP mostly cheap ships, too a max of 200mil with fittings, my PvP ships that i loose, i can replace often in one evening of mission grinding in Highsec, If i loose my CNR (full faction fitted) on a mission by a ganking piwaat, the loss is just too high too replace it in a short amount of time, it will takes months too replace it, hence you prolly only see such ships in empire, hardly in 0.0 space or lowsec..

Thus risk reward too use these ships in a pvp enviroment is way too high compared too the cost/time you too get such a ship
Ships as this are Carebear ships, and alot of mission runners (Hardcore Carebears and PvP pilots getting their wallet up alike) wont take these into a risky situation..

Now i dont see myself as a Carebear, and i hate mission running, but if i look on the speed i can make ISK in 0.0 space, and the speed i can make ISK in HighSec, i would be a idiot, trying too grind ISK in 0.0 space nowerdays..
Partionally we are ourself too blame, even i use probing too probe plexes out, hoping too find a idiot who's plexing, and then giving him a visit..
Knowing others can do that to me as well, prevents me of doing plexes on my own, while i have more means of defending myself as the average solo carebear (i still have corpmates and a alliance members that could help) still, the reward of making ISK like that, bleeches with the ease you can grind ISK in empire, withou too worry too loose your ship..

In short :

1 : Risk vs Reward in lowsec/0.0 is off, in fact i can make ISK faster in Empire as in lowsec/0.0
2 : T2 ships are too expensive for most too loose, thus people wont risk them, after months of flying that Raven, you cannot get better by skills anymore, thus you upgrade too a CNR/marauder too do those mission faster, wich maximises profit again by doing those missions faster as with a default raven.
3 : People hunt Mission runners in lowsec/0,0 space with no means when jumped too excape, drop aggro, get-out fast, making them avoid missioning in lowsec/0.0
4 : Mission are repettavive, boring and way too easy, spice them up, by smarter ai, with more players let them switch aggro, make them dynamic, towards a players SP or sumthing (hence running them now for 3 years, atm back at AFK mission grinding, nothing penetrates my tank nowerdays on lvl4's)..
5 : Lvl 5 missions rewards are not on par with lvl4's making them uninterresting to do, keeping more people based at lvl4 agents.

Adding more empire agents wont solve the issue, the mission running problems lies way deeper as just adding more agents

Sister Tisiphone
Posted - 2009.06.02 13:31:00 - [226]
 

Originally by: Yahrr


I'm trying to make pirating a living and probing mission runners is fun imo, but the real reason (err.. semi real reason) that I support the idea of getting more people to low sec is to show them that there is more than the little world we call high sec. Explore the game, make a sunday trip to the New Eden wormhole, command your battlehauler of Doom to pick up your low sec buy orders, etc...



... I think you made a spelling mistake. Allow me to rephrase what you said:

"the real reason that I support the idea of getting more people to low sec is to have more PvE'ers to blow up, take their stuff and nuke their pod."

You guys (gankers, pirates, griefers) still don't get it: We're not going into lo sec en masse because it's not fun. When I get a mission that takes me into lo sec, I get my jump clone, a gallente shuttle or an Iteron I, do the mission and get out. If/when the gankers get me, they get squat, other than the testosterone rush they get from killing a shuttle. (Akin to taking candy from a baby, but with even less skill).

PvP is a small minority of the players in Eve: They happen to be the more vocal of players, which is why you hear more of it, but this Dev blog is the proof in the pudding that the majority of the players are PvE'ers: In other words: They're the ones that pay the bills, that keep the lights on at CCP, so to speak.

Remember this, too: In order for a PvE'er to even have a chance against the gankers, it needs a lot of SP to get the modules and ship you'd like: That means staying in the game long enough to get both the SP and the experience to give it a shot. Force those people into lo sec and they'll just up and quit: The gankers are notoriously short-sighted in their neanderthal thinking, being obsessed with their KB rankings and not thinking about the long term effects of their bully-in-a-schoolyard behaviour.

Chib
Drunken Wookies
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2009.06.02 14:17:00 - [227]
 

my vote is here for pirate mission overhaul.... specifically sansha

for every 5 missions you do you can bet at least 2 are the same mission...which either indicates to me there usnt enough or whatever mechanism you have in place that assigns the missions each time you open the conversation is borked


so in summary

More LVL 4 sansha missions
Less doing the same mission over and over again consecutively

and of course

********LVL 5 PIRATE MISSIONS*********

Rip Minner
Gallente
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
Posted - 2009.06.02 14:42:00 - [228]
 

Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:44:57
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:43:06
Originally by: Arran Ramir
Edited by: Arran Ramir on 02/06/2009 12:38:13
1 : Risk vs Reward in lowsec/0.0 is off, in fact i can make ISK faster in Empire as in lowsec/0.0



If you cant make more isk in low sec or 0.0 then mission runing in high sec its becouse you lack the skills to harvest/refine/use the invaluble resoures that make what low sec and 0.0 what they are. And you lack the brains to see this.

Edit: But I bet your corp's and allance thx you for the cheap guard and fighter so they can make big isk.

Tiny Tove
Posted - 2009.06.02 14:45:00 - [229]
 

I want to add my voice to the din of muppets who think that putting L4 in lowsec fixes Eve. I mean I know lowsec has the best agents already, and I know that it was actually the lowsec inhabitants that are the reason they don't take the lowsec mission options, but I want to suspend reality a little here and whine.

Actually I take it all back.
What I mean is, me and my two friends are camping a gate, if CCP could take the trouble to send one fully faction fitted CNR into our little party at a rate of 1 every five minutes, at regular 5 minute intervals, that would be really great thanks, I think we can all agree that once this change is made, the Eve market will balance quickly and the price of goods will return to the mythical figures people carry in their heads about how much things should cost, and how much a CNR wreck should be worth.

Arran Ramir
Posted - 2009.06.02 16:58:00 - [230]
 

Originally by: Rip Minner
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:44:57
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:43:06
Originally by: Arran Ramir
Edited by: Arran Ramir on 02/06/2009 12:38:13
1 : Risk vs Reward in lowsec/0.0 is off, in fact i can make ISK faster in Empire as in lowsec/0.0



If you cant make more isk in low sec or 0.0 then mission runing in high sec its becouse you lack the skills to harvest/refine/use the invaluble resoures that make what low sec and 0.0 what they are. And you lack the brains to see this.

Edit: But I bet your corp's and allance thx you for the cheap guard and fighter so they can make big isk.


Guess you never been into 0.0 space i guess, or at least never expierenced real 0.0 life, wars etc..
Try too grind a pocket/plex, i give you 20secs before your probed out, and ganked in that plex pocket...

Most of the time your grinding a pocket with one eye out on local, if local is spiking with neuts, only a idiots stay in the pocket, and ofc whines later here on the forums that he is ganked...

And sure i see constantly people with haulers and salvager run behind their main chars in 0.0 too salvage, and damn those belts are allways full with miners getting minerals.. And damn, those stations have a constant stream of mission runners earning ISK...

Not everyone is in goonfleet, and is protected by 300 blues in local in 0.0 space, but alas, those braincells of your werent working anyways, since you allready had the urge too allready start out name calling, and seeing your writing style, and assumptions.. dont be afraid, not everyone has enough braincells and realize they have too use them before replying.. Laughing


Jove X
True Slave Foundations
Shaktipat Revelators
Posted - 2009.06.02 18:22:00 - [231]
 

Edited by: Jove X on 02/06/2009 18:23:49
Originally by: harogen
So... unless I missed something, not a single new agent in in low sec? brilliant...


.. and along this line .. no 0.0 NPC faction agents (Sansha's, Angels etc) as many apparently have already noticed?

Well, ok - how about:
AN INTERBUS STATION (with LP STORE)?

Hide if you need to, make us find it .. but please CONSIDER IT?

Carniflex
StarHunt
Fallout Project
Posted - 2009.06.03 04:28:00 - [232]
 

Originally by: Arran Ramir
Originally by: Rip Minner
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:44:57
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:43:06
Originally by: Arran Ramir
Edited by: Arran Ramir on 02/06/2009 12:38:13
1 : Risk vs Reward in lowsec/0.0 is off, in fact i can make ISK faster in Empire as in lowsec/0.0



If you cant make more isk in low sec or 0.0 then mission runing in high sec its becouse you lack the skills to harvest/refine/use the invaluble resoures that make what low sec and 0.0 what they are. And you lack the brains to see this.

Edit: But I bet your corp's and allance thx you for the cheap guard and fighter so they can make big isk.


Guess you never been into 0.0 space i guess, or at least never expierenced real 0.0 life, wars etc..
Try too grind a pocket/plex, i give you 20secs before your probed out, and ganked in that plex pocket...




You are not looking at whole picture in here. While it is true that some (majority) of 0.0 areas have 'crap' quality the rewards are still there. They are just not 'personal' level rewards but more like corporate/alliance level rewards in the form of higher end moons and refining taxses in outposts. Those rewards do offer you as an alliance footsolider some indirect benefits - usually in the form of various replacement or dotation schemes or just being able to get some extra dreadnaughts into battles or even simply 'free jumps' for your transportation needs. If you are really getting absolutely nothing from those rewards there is good propability someone in the leadership is saving alliance money for personal titan or whatever just poke around to find where it is going and if you don't like it you can always throw a tantrum about it.

Rip Minner
Gallente
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
Posted - 2009.06.03 04:51:00 - [233]
 

Originally by: Arran Ramir
Originally by: Rip Minner
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:44:57
Edited by: Rip Minner on 02/06/2009 14:43:06
Originally by: Arran Ramir
Edited by: Arran Ramir on 02/06/2009 12:38:13
1 : Risk vs Reward in lowsec/0.0 is off, in fact i can make ISK faster in Empire as in lowsec/0.0



If you cant make more isk in low sec or 0.0 then mission runing in high sec its becouse you lack the skills to harvest/refine/use the invaluble resoures that make what low sec and 0.0 what they are. And you lack the brains to see this.

Edit: But I bet your corp's and allance thx you for the cheap guard and fighter so they can make big isk.


Guess you never been into 0.0 space i guess, or at least never expierenced real 0.0 life, wars etc..
Try too grind a pocket/plex, i give you 20secs before your probed out, and ganked in that plex pocket...

Most of the time your grinding a pocket with one eye out on local, if local is spiking with neuts, only a idiots stay in the pocket, and ofc whines later here on the forums that he is ganked...

And sure i see constantly people with haulers and salvager run behind their main chars in 0.0 too salvage, and damn those belts are allways full with miners getting minerals.. And damn, those stations have a constant stream of mission runners earning ISK...

Not everyone is in goonfleet, and is protected by 300 blues in local in 0.0 space, but alas, those braincells of your werent working anyways, since you allready had the urge too allready start out name calling, and seeing your writing style, and assumptions.. dont be afraid, not everyone has enough braincells and realize they have too use them before replying.. Laughing




Your right I was usuming your were in a real corp/allance not a freelance roving piret gang. The kind that have to live off the scraps of High sec and low sec becouse there not on par with low sec 0.0 Allances and cant realy protect and defend a system for them selfs. And hate the fact that they have to go carebear it up to suport them selfs in low sec. But that still dont mean that low sec and 0.0 dont have better isk rewards that you cant get at.

Valkerias
Posted - 2009.06.03 05:01:00 - [234]
 

Someone mentioned that PVP setups are poor for Missions. I think I have a solution. When someone probes down a mission, and warp in (as opposed to warping in as a fleet member), the rats for that mission should re-spawn and aggro that person, including the gate scrambling NPCs. Let's make these "pirates" and "ninja salvagers" have to fight to the "prize" just like the PVE players do. Sure, the risk will still be there, but it'll be more manageable. In addition, if the PVPs get frustrated and give up, or lose too many ships, that's just more bounties for the PVE player. Which would actually result in BETTER rewards for low-sec and bring MORE PVE players, and as a bonus, reduce high-sec overcrowding. Wouldn't that be best for everyone? But no, I can already hear some Griefbear go, "NOO I want my easy 'carebear' kills! Don't make me fight NPCs too!! It's so booring!!!"

DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2009.06.03 10:49:00 - [235]
 

I must admit, when I read about this it APPEARED that what ccp was saying was.

"You guys use these 25 agents sooooo much that it's dragging down those systems, so we are adding in 25 more agents in different systems to spread the load and make the system run better"...

Everyone seems to have taken it (for some reason) to mean
"ZOMG WE LUV L4 AGENTS AND KALDARI, SO WE ARE GIVING YOU MO-MO-MO-MO AGENTZ!"

Lets face it, No new Agents that YOU use = Because Not enough people are mission running on those agents!..

Possibly I got the wrong end of it, but I rekon most of you are not viewing this as a server performance feature, your viewing it as a perk.

Malusae
Caldari
ADVANCED Combat and Engineering
Violent Society
Posted - 2009.06.03 11:38:00 - [236]
 

One of my main level 4 agents was on this list. But unless the market hub that I make money off of moves with it, I'm not going anywhere.

Odhinn Vinlandii
Minmatar
Apolitical
Posted - 2009.06.03 18:11:00 - [237]
 

Originally by: Sister Tisiphone
Edited by: Sister Tisiphone on 02/06/2009 05:17:31
Originally by: Terranid Meester
Eve is pvp first and pve second.


Care to prove this ?




He doesn't have to. The Dev's have said repeatedly that this is a pvp game, and that logging in is consent to pvp.

However, trading, manufacturing, mining are all pvp as well.

You are logged in competing against other players are you not?

...or by /carebear/ do you mean someone who play's EVE as if it were a solo offline game? I hate these types of anti-community solo-players passionately and they should be grief'd.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2009.06.03 21:01:00 - [238]
 

Originally by: DeODokktor
I must admit, when I read about this it APPEARED that what ccp was saying was.

"You guys use these 25 agents sooooo much that it's dragging down those systems, so we are adding in 25 more agents in different systems to spread the load and make the system run better"...

Everyone seems to have taken it (for some reason) to mean
"ZOMG WE LUV L4 AGENTS AND KALDARI, SO WE ARE GIVING YOU MO-MO-MO-MO AGENTZ!"

Lets face it, No new Agents that YOU use = Because Not enough people are mission running on those agents!..

Possibly I got the wrong end of it, but I rekon most of you are not viewing this as a server performance feature, your viewing it as a perk.


no one uses the other agents because
a) they don't exist
b) they are in the middle of nowhere
c) they are in lowsec

and no, most of us are viewing this as the completely wrong solution, and that ccp didn't even try to understand the problem they were trying to fix.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2009.06.03 21:03:00 - [239]
 

Originally by: Malusae
One of my main level 4 agents was on this list. But unless the market hub that I make money off of moves with it, I'm not going anywhere.


only 1 agent is being moved. and a few new agents will probably have very little effect on established market hubs.

Valkerias
Posted - 2009.06.04 04:27:00 - [240]
 

Originally by: Jove X
Edited by: Jove X on 02/06/2009 18:23:49
Originally by: harogen
So... unless I missed something, not a single new agent in in low sec? brilliant...


.. and along this line .. no 0.0 NPC faction agents (Sansha's, Angels etc) as many apparently have already noticed?

Well, ok - how about:
AN INTERBUS STATION (with LP STORE)?

Hide if you need to, make us find it .. but please CONSIDER IT?


Interesting. Here's some suggestions for LP store items.

Jove Modulated strip miner. (1.5X the yield of tech 2 modulated strip miners.)

Jovian overdrive Ice Harvester (0.5 harvesting time of Ice Harvester I.)

Sleeper Technology skill book.

Jovian Faction Covetor
4 high slots, 2 med slots, 4 low slots. Base cargo 8000

Base speed 100 m/s

Jovian Faction Hulk

4 High slots, 4 Med slots, 4 low slots. Base cargo 10000

Base speed 100 m/s

Same boosts as regular hulk or covetor but 1.5 X powergrid and cpu.

Jovian Mining implant, doubles the target range of Strip miners and harvesters, increases mining barge and exhumer target range by 4 Km. Downside, decays like mining crystals and will eventually self-destruct in time. (or self-destruct player pod via "jovian disease.")

The LP and isk price of these items should be insanely high or it could unbalance the game.


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