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Tuscun Nebular
Posted - 2009.05.28 14:56:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 16:45:59
Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 16:42:43
Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 16:04:36
I've been playing mmos for some years now, and i've played mostly D&Ds. My last game was with World of Warcraft, and when I seen this game I tought it would be a good change, and at first, I really liked it.

Then as I went on I realized that it's just too complicated, confusing, and just too time consuming. When they made this game, they forgot to take into account that there's working people out there and catered the game for mostly young people who for the most part are students. That's why eve online has a limited subscripton. Too bad because it as a good story line. (Space adventure) the term used loosely Also, I believe that an actual written walk through guide/book like in other games would be a good idea, because one can refer to it off line! Not every person can spend so many hours on line, hence they can refer to the game off line! God, all of the other mmos have these books!

I found that when I asked for help from the so called vulonteer guys, all they told me was refer to the tutorial. When I attempted to train skills, I was lost because I didn't know what skill to train first, and when I bought a skill that I thought that I needed, I bought it, and when i went to train it, a message pops up, that I can't train that skill until I traind something first. then when I bought some item, I had t fly here and there, and do this, and that. If I went to train a skill and it wasn't possible, why does the program let me buy that particular skill/item? If the skill or item isn't compatible for my needs, Why doesn't the program lock me out from doing/buying the item/skill? It would make life in this game a lot easier, and less time consuming! and there's so many other time consuming issues and complication to address. What a waste of time and money for the working guy.

I don't know who or where to send this message to the developers to make them understand how many people who bought this game feel! All you have to do is listen to the confusion in the "Rookie help" yea what a joke that is too! What a shame, because this could be a great game like world of warcraft is. And don't tell me that this game is better than WoW just look at the subscription member population, that tells it all! I will not renew my subscription next month, and The developers should take note because again, this could be a real good game if they would just address these issues.

now, as for you players placing those negative responses like "Oh well you have a simple mind, get the fu--- out of this game, go back to world of warcraft, etc. etc. etc. You can post as many negative responses to my posting as you like, but the numbers don't lie. John walsh of G4tv "playin the game is like pulling wisdom teeth on a Sunday afternoon" People! All I want to do is play a game, not do 3-4 hours of research and reading after logging onto the game everyday before I can even think of playing! Also, look at the magazine reveiws online in regard to EVE ONLINE! For the most part the developers made this game for space enthusiasts with no room of simplification to new commers! read the reviews. All i'm saying is that the game is too time consuming, confusing, to new players. I love space adventure but I have a life outside the mmo world. Please foward concerns to the developers.....

Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2009.05.28 15:24:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 28/05/2009 15:25:34
Quote:
they forgot to take into account that there's working people out there and catered the game for mostly young people who for the most part are students.


Average EVE player age is 28.


Then again...if you're not able to read the forum descriptions so you can post your poorly thought out whine in the right forum, maybe this isn't the game for you. It's been said before, WoW is that way ->

Zeonos
Amarr
Griffin Industries Ltd
IMPERIAL LEGI0N
Posted - 2009.05.28 16:40:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Zeonos on 28/05/2009 16:42:03
too complicated, confusing, and just too time consuming???? yeah, for you character levels while your offline in wow as well. and it just happens to give you the best gear available.

Elric Redeye
Ex Coelis
Posted - 2009.05.28 17:04:00 - [4]
 

I'll grant you the learning curve is steep and unforgiving... just like space. That, and the thinking required, is part of Eve's appeal. As said nicely and not-so-nicely, you are not the target audience for this game. CCP will never pwn the MMORG world with Eve. Now go back to WoW where you have fun and, um, put in less time than you would in Eve (odd, that).

CCP could absolutely improve the tutorial phase of this game. I hear it is much better than it was but I worked through many frustrations that would have been trivial to avoid with better player-guidance.

Guillieme Lohran
Posted - 2009.05.28 17:12:00 - [5]
 

Man, he's right. This game is WAY too complicated if you have any sort of life. I guess working full time AND carrying a full load in grad school don't count. Strange, I've been playing for a little over a month and am using lots of Tech 2 mods and flying a BC. I better turn myself in for cheating or something.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Leandro Salazar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2009.05.28 17:17:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Tuscun Nebular
All I want to do is play a game, not do 3-4 hours of research and reading after logging onto the game everyday before I can even think of playing!


Go play some Solitaire or WOW then. I play EVE exactly because it is a lot MORE than 'just playing a game'. And I am a 34 year old employed person. But if I want to 'just play a game' I fire up some FPS or whatever. I don't pay 30 bucks per month for just another silly game with no depth and long term consequences that caters to stupid, lazy and inattentive people.

And the fact that EVE is not as popular as the games that do just that is another bonus, not a bad thing. Too much popularity invariably turns good things bad.

Mikal Drey
Atlas Alliance
Posted - 2009.05.28 17:18:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Mikal Drey on 28/05/2009 17:20:24
Edited by: Mikal Drey on 28/05/2009 17:19:26
Edited by: Mikal Drey on 28/05/2009 17:18:31
Originally by: Tuscun Nebular
I've been playing mmos for some years now, and i've played mostly D&Ds. My last game was with World of Warcraft, and when I seen this game I tought it would be a good change, and at first, I really liked it.



error 1
eve is not WOW and we have a very very steep learning cliff to overcome as well as some harsh but fair consequences of loss.


Quote:
Then as I went on I realized that it's just too complicated, confusing, and just too time consuming. When they made this game, they forgot to take into account that there's working people out there and catered the game for mostly young people who for the most part are students.


error 2
eve average player age is 25+ btw im 35, with 2 kids, shift worker.


Quote:
That's why eve online has a limited subscripton. Too bad because it as a good story line. (Space adventure) the term used loosely Also, I believe that an actual written walk through guide/book like in other games would be a good idea, because one can refer to it off line! Not every person can spend so many hours on line, hence they can refer to the game off line! God, all of the other mmos have these books!


eve evolves over time and any guides will be out of date way before publication. eve is not WOW and certainly not as static as some other mmolg's. as a commercial enterprise you will find that "other" mmolgs want to gouge every single penny from your wallet. gaiming isnt about your skill at following a guide its about playing a game.

Quote:

I found that when I asked for help from the so called vulonteer guys, all they told me was refer to the tutorial.


send CCP an email about your ISD ineraction and the isd name. feedback is very important and a volunteer should be better than "rtfm" responses

Quote:
When I attempted to train skills, I was lost because I didn't know what skill to train first, and when I bought a skill that I thought that I needed, I bought it, and when i went to train it, a message pops up, that I can't train that skill until I traind something first. then when I bought some item, I had t fly here and there, and do this, and that. If I went to train a skill and it wasn't possible, why does the program let me buy that particular skill/item? If the skill or item isn't compatible for my needs, Why doesn't the program lock me out from doing/buying the item/skill?


because eve isnt easy mode and game mechanics like the market dont need layers of popups. there is also alot of information on your market screen and you just need someone to talk you through it big shame ISD let you down tbh.

Quote:
Please foward concerns to the developers...


im sure they read the forums :)

Shattered Crystal - 60 day GTC

Pesets
The Hunt Club
Posted - 2009.05.28 18:36:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Kahega Amielden
Average EVE player age is 28.


Just curious, where does that come from? I keep seeing this quoted as a fact all the time, but it seems to contradict the actual evidence. If it was indeed true, i'd imagine CCP would have more respect for the average customer's time; and players themselves wouldn't act as if they are half as old at best...

Quintus Thrax
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2009.05.28 18:45:00 - [9]
 



You obviously lack the intelligence and motivation to play Eve. Its not for everyone, there are other games that will be a better fit for you.

Hello Kitty online maybe or perhaps pong?

Eve is much less of a time sink then World of Warcraft. I have a full time job and 3 kids. My play time is restricted to Nap times and a few hours in the Evenings if I am lucky.

The rookie channel is pretty helpful to people who are willing to do some research online before playing and thus ask the right questions. I have always found the starter corp channels more useful since most of the people in there are in the same boat and have had similar experiences to you.

Unfortunately if you're not prepared to make the most of your gaming experience then you are going to struggle in any mmo. Even WoW is full of people who can't find that orc's wife in the barrens.

Guillieme Lohran
Posted - 2009.05.28 18:48:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Pesets
Originally by: Kahega Amielden
Average EVE player age is 28.


Just curious, where does that come from? I keep seeing this quoted as a fact all the time, but it seems to contradict the actual evidence. If it was indeed true, i'd imagine CCP would have more respect for the average customer's time; and players themselves wouldn't act as if they are half as old at best...


Look here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eve_online

About half the players I regularly interact with are older with actual jobs. I'm 42.

Flying ZombieJesus
Posted - 2009.05.28 18:59:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: Flying ZombieJesus on 28/05/2009 18:59:16
Theres your skill curve




CCP Mitnal


C C P
Posted - 2009.05.28 19:10:00 - [12]
 

Moved to New Citizens and made topic title less inflammatory.

Cleaned. Whether you believe the OP to be true or not, does not give you the right to flame him. That only compounds problems and will lead to forum warnings and bans if necessary.


Ohmebius
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2009.05.28 19:30:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Flying ZombieJesus
Edited by: Flying ZombieJesus on 28/05/2009 18:59:16
Theres your skill curve






LOL brilliant!

Beovylf
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.05.28 19:35:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Tuscun Nebular
Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 16:45:59
Too bad because it as a good story line. (Space adventure) the term used loosely


This is hilarious. Newsflash... EVE is a SPACE ADVENTURE.

Quote:

For the most part the developers made this game for space enthusiasts with no room of simplification to new commers!


What the F is a commer? Is that some slang term for commie?

Traidor Disloyal
Private Nuisance
Segregati0n
Posted - 2009.05.28 19:42:00 - [15]
 

This game is a lot easier then it was back in 2003. There may not be that many walkthroughts (if any) for this game but there is a lot of information provided for the new player. All it takes to get that information is to read the forums here and else where (just like one would have to do for other games).

If you had read the forums you would have found programs called EVEMON and EFT (Eve Fitting Tool). One program is used to set up your training skills and the other is for setting up your ships. But, you don't know how to use those programs? Get on the forums and ask. Find other forums that have info on how to fit a ship. Find a group of players who have a clue on how to do things in game. Don't contact me and ask to join my corp cause after you join I will blow your ship up and pod you just for the laughs.

The thing I like about this game (one of the things anyway) is the fact that everything is not handed to you on a silver platter. You actually need to think about a few things to get anywhere. And I like that I can play a couple hours a night and still have fun because I do not have to be on line to train stuff.

I started playing in 2003 with a different character. I bought a Rupture and a Stabber before I left (played for 6 months). I came back in 2006 and was embarrassed with that character and my ship fits. We didn't have EVEMON back then so my skills were all over the place. And what I had on that Rupture was just awful. One was that I had mixed weapon types (arty and AC) on those ships. I then read these forums and other sites and got a good idea of what I had done wrong and started over.

I got bored with WoW after about a year and a half (it takes a lot to get me bored). I will hit the three year mark for this game come August and I am still not bored with this game. And I can't fly anything bigger then a Battleship.

Chebchelios
Posted - 2009.05.28 19:52:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Tuscun Nebular
Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 16:45:59Then as I went on I realized that it's just too complicated, confusing, and just too time consuming.
How long have you been playing for, if I may ask?

I've just started the EVE adventure, I turned my free 14-days trial into a paying account a couple of days ago, and between the few hours spent having fun with character creation, the time browsing through forums and the like to make sure the game was for me, and, well, real life, I can't say I've played this game very much. Still I don't feel it's nearly as complex as yo describe it. I found the tutorial missions rather well done (if not exactly thrilling), the skill/certificate system quite intuitive, and the few things that did not seem to make sense relatively easy to figure out given the extensive amount of information available online. I do expect things to get more complicated as I keep playing, but as of now I have a hard time believing the learning curve is as steep as a lot of people make it sound.

As for being time-consuming, especially compared to a WoW, I couldn't disagree more. I get to gain experience while working during the day, and if I can't find time to play for whatever reason at night, I can still log in for a few minutes, figure out what skill(s) I need to get/upgrade next, update my skill queue and log off. Like I mentioned my experience in the game is far from extensive, so I might be dead wrong on many accounts. But so far I feel like the game is particularly versatile in the sense that you don't have to play a whole lot in order to get your character to progress. Especially with the PLEX system which, still in my opinion, is very much adapted to working people (who have more money than they have time, as opposed to kids or students as you suggested) who can get ISKs without the need to grind for them for hours.

I'd suggest you keep trying for a little while. Your comment about the game being time-consuming in particular really leads me to believe you might have rushed a few steps: this really is a game that you can make as little time-consuming as you want it to be.

Tuscun Nebular
Posted - 2009.05.28 19:59:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Beovylf
Originally by: Tuscun Nebular
Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 16:45:59
Too bad because it as a good story line. (Space adventure) the term used loosely


This is hilarious. Newsflash... EVE is a SPACE ADVENTURE.

Quote:

For the most part the developers made this game for space enthusiasts with no room of simplification to new commers!
It's a typo error ****head!

What the F is a commer? Is that some slang term for commie?

Janya Rykayn
Posted - 2009.05.28 20:06:00 - [18]
 

If you don't like Eve, maybe one idea would be to find a game that you do like.

The reasons that you give for not liking Eve are the same reasons that I DO like Eve. I don't like other mmorps because they're too linear and spoonfed. Eve is a complex dynamic system. Even just the economic simulation is fascinating.

It's interesting that there aren't many people in Eve who are like you. Most seem to be intelligent.

Don't waste your money on something you don't like!!

K'Daai
Mensa.
Posted - 2009.05.28 20:08:00 - [19]
 

Hi, I'm 23 and I play Eve. I have two jobs and I am pursuing a Master degree in AI.

You fail at understanding this game and it's target audience miserably.

Can I have your stuff?

Tuscun Nebular
Posted - 2009.05.28 20:40:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Tuscun Nebular on 28/05/2009 20:59:42

YEAH! I looked up those out of game tools in the forums as you said, and there's nothing but compatibility problems and running issues. Why should I have to spend countless hours reading forums from other players? The program should be set up where a person isn't intimidated by the game. A persons first experiance should be pleasant and fun, then as you go further into the game, it becomes more challenging. By the way, is eft and evemon programs from eve online, or are they some sort of hacks? If they are hacks, you can be banned! either way, I wis that I could get a refund for this game. Oh, by the way, just take a peek at those magazine reviews! These are professionals in gaming and they all agree that eve isn't such a great game....

JeanMichel Bizarre
Firebird Squadron
Terra-Incognita
Posted - 2009.05.28 20:50:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: JeanMichel Bizarre on 28/05/2009 20:51:54
Edited by: JeanMichel Bizarre on 28/05/2009 20:51:06
I've been playing EVE since around mid march and if at first I loved it I was in your very situation not more than a few days ago but I have quite easily overcome it and I am loving it again. Every second of it.

I have found that setting personal goals (short and mid term) that you can achieve with relative ease makes the game infinitely more enjoyable. For instance, I have recently found great pleasure in exploration. I started training a few skills, bought a probe and went exploring. I found a worm-hole today, and a hidden dead-space pocket with dozens of high-bounty (like 3 million a piece for some of them) npc rats which I couldn't kill as the biggest ship I can fly atm is a cruiser. None-the-less, it was all great fun.


I'll also quote a bit of text that I think should make you think things over a bit.

Quote:
'Most newbies think that a terrible grind is required in EVE because newbies are 'powerless', or because other MMOs insist that you hit wolves with a sword for hours on end before you can level up. The greatest thing about EVE is that you are able to think yourself out of almost any situation; your best weapon is your mind, and you're putting your wits against other humans, rather than pixelated monsters. While in the Bad Old Days, the deck was stacked against the newbie, in this day and age the only thing holding back a newbie is a lack of imagination, daring, or cunning.'



maddmaxx III
Caldari
Sons Of 0din
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2009.05.28 20:58:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: maddmaxx III on 28/05/2009 20:58:26

To the op,

lol your first mistake was mentioning wow, in these forums that will get you nothing but flames. Oh and CCP dose not give a ****.

good luck with whatever you choose, you should however give eve another chance, it dose not have to be as time consuming as you think, in fact eve is a great game for casual mmo players.

Lukriss
Caldari
Notorious Legion
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:02:00 - [23]
 

First of all, it seems that EVE is not for you,

Secondly, you say you don't want to do 4 hrs of research before getting into a game, yet you want a walkthrough book?

Tuscun Nebular
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:04:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: maddmaxx III
Edited by: maddmaxx III on 28/05/2009 20:58:26

To the op,

lol your first mistake was mentioning wow, in these forums that will get you nothing but flames. Oh and CCP dose not give a ****.

good luck with whatever you choose, you should however give eve another chance, it dose not have to be as time consuming as you think, in fact eve is a great game for casual mmo players.




Wow, you comment was the first that made any kind've sense. Like you said, ccp doesn't give a ****, because they already have te money for the game, but they won't get a penny more...

Ta'jek
Angels Of Death EVE
Free Worlds Alliance
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:22:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Traidor Disloyal


I got bored with WoW after about a year and a half (it takes a lot to get me bored). I will hit the three year mark for this game come August and I am still not bored with this game. And I can't fly anything bigger then a Battleship.


LOL I got bored with WOW before I even made it through the character creation screen.

Vyllana
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:26:00 - [26]
 

EVE is a niche game, not a mainstream game like WoW. EVE caters to people that enjoy a slower paced, more thoughtful, and much more complex type of gaming. That style is not for everyone, and so EVE is not for everyone. However, by catering to this niche, EVE is able to remain stable and succesful, and to continue to steadily grow in population.

Meanwhile, games that try to be "like WoW", in catering to less thoughtful players, dumbing everything down, all in the end discover that they can't really compete with WoW, as one can clearly see in the rapid population booms at release and then painful, withering, declines of games like Age of Conan and Warhammer.

EVE does not compete directly with WoW, it is a totally different type of game, and draws its subscribers from a pretty different pool of people. That is why EVE is prospering when so many other MMOs are not.

Six Across
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:36:00 - [27]
 

Pfft, give the guy a break. Hiding behind the internet scoffing at new players doesn't impress me, and it certainly won't make you seem like part of a higher class that WoW players.

Everyone is confused by Eve. If it were not the case, we wouldn't have 2003 players asking for advice on these forums. He has valid points and made a lot of effort in explaining them. If all you antagonizers can see is the WoW reference you shouldn't bother replying.

Accept his argument and offer constructive criticism, or move on...

Tinker
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:52:00 - [28]
 

Oh and as for the "not recieved" help. EVE players tend to
respond to questions which are covered in the tutorial with :

"Welcome to EVE now Arrow do the tutorial"

That is because you usualy can tell when someone asks a
question if he has done the "tut" or not.

You complain about not having success ? When you are done
with your 3 L1 tutorial Agents that each explain different
aspects of EVE (Mining/Industry/Production , Combat ,
Exploration/Trade etc), you have around 2m ISK, 3 to 4
frigate class ships in your hangar plus at least 1 industrial.
And on top of that you know how to put them to use "aka"
you learned the skills.

Now the tutorial is not done in 1 hour. Doesnt need to be
done in that time neither as you can pick up where you
left the last time. Best thing on that ? Your character
evolves and trains while you are asleep or at work so that
is too time consuming ? mhmhm

You dont want to do research on a game, thats fine as you
just go ahead and play it, thats what everybody else does
before he/she wants to go into detail about exploration
or industry and production or corp management or ......
Shocked But those did the tutorial. Shocked

fly safe or what ever you do out there
T

ps english is not my native tongue so dont flame me for typos

Tuscun Nebular
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:52:00 - [29]
 

Player six across...Thanks you for being so understanding. For me, I don't know where to start in this game. i.e. which skills and such should I buy/train first? In other games it's not really a guessing game! If you're not eligable for a certain skill/item your basically blocked from that area, and guided in the right direction. Why isn't it like that in this game? i.e. I bought certain sills and when I went to train them, a message then comes up, well you not eligable to train that skill/item, and I have to research what I have to train as a prerequsite and that goes on thruouth the game. It's frustaiting and intimidating to a new player, and when I ask for help in the rookie chat, all I get is read the tutorial. after reading the abusive responses to my conerns, naturally I become defensive. Why can't some of the players here guide me as where to go, and what to do? Anyway, tanks.

Louis deGuerre
Gallente
Malevolence.
Posted - 2009.05.28 21:56:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Louis deGuerre on 28/05/2009 21:57:13
*yawns at wall of text*

Sooo...did you have a question or is this just a complain thread ? If so ask it already, short and clearly please and it will be answered by this fountain of wisdom we call the forum. Otherwise, please move the thread back to GD Mitnal Very Happy

BTW, there's an enter key on your keyboard. There's also a thing called paragraph. I's advise you to use it if you want some to answer with something else than TL;DR.


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