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bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 12:45:00 - [391]
 

Originally by: Admiral IceBlock

Amarr & Lasers
- Remove capacitor bonus from all their ships.
- Give their ships other bonuses; armor resistance, armor bonus, falloff, tracking, something clever for armor race.
- Increase damage of lasers to compensate for the removed capacitor bonus.


Why give the race that has the best available range buffer it can use as a tank even more bonuses to armour tanking?.

If any race deserves to have bonuses to armour its gallente as they are the race that has a weapon system that forces it into the optimal/high dmg range of ALL the other weapon systems, while lasers can sit back at range.

The fact that blaster ships need to move around the field to be within their high dps range also causes cap issues due to mwding so maybe a look at that could not hurt.

Beverly Sparks
Posted - 2009.06.04 12:45:00 - [392]
 

Originally by: Admiral IceBlock

Amarr & Lasers
- Remove capacitor bonus from all their ships.
- Give their ships other bonuses; armor resistance, armor bonus, falloff, tracking, something clever for armor race.
- Increase damage of lasers to compensate for the removed capacitor bonus.



No, Amarr do not need to be buffed.

Originally by: Admiral IceBlock


Caldari & Railguns/Missiles
- Remove missile damage bonus from all ships.
- Give their ships other bonuses; shield resistance, optimal, ECM, something clever for electronic race.
- Increase damage of missiles to compensate for the removed missile damage bonus ASWELL AS due to some ships having twin-weapon systems. This way, missiles will be totally skill related and not make ships like the Typhoon with twin-weaopons systems subpar.
- Rockets OMFG! Gigantic damage boost, lowered rof. Should be mini-torpedoes and not an autocannon shooting projectiles.
- HAMS! Damage boost; medium sized torpedoes.


No No No. Remove the word kinetic from their ship missile damage bonuses. Double flight speed, 1/2 flight time.

Rockets need to be made more effective versus frigates. More flight speed, higher explosion velocity, and maybe a small damage buff. Although the damage buff could come later, get them hitting for a higher percentage of their base damage, and then re-evaluate.

Originally by: Admiral IceBlock

- Tweak autocannons.
- Boost artillery damage; high alpha, low rof.
- Remove missile bonuses due to missile change.



Yea, tweak autocannons with a sledgehammer.

Originally by: Admiral IceBlock


Gallente & Blasters/Drones
- Increase the damage of blasters.



Maybe a little, but generally, just allow them to apply the damage they already have better. Range and tracking mostly.

Originally by: Admiral IceBlock

All races and weapons
- Make ships have linear upgrades to their class. E.g:
- Punisher -> Omen -> Armageddon.
- ... -> Maller -> Abaddon?
- Kestrel -> Caracal -> Raven.
- Griffin -> Blackbird -> Scorpion.
- ... -> Vexor -> Dominix.
- Rifter -> Rupture -> Tempest.
- Vigil -> Stabber -> Typhoon?


Yea, that sounds reasonable.

Seishi Maru
doMAL S.A.
Posted - 2009.06.04 13:09:00 - [393]
 

Originally by: Nuts Nougat
Edited by: Nuts Nougat on 03/06/2009 14:21:49
Originally by: Seishi Maru


run the nubmer before throwing things off. A tempest liek that at 170 km would have MORE damage than a megatron at same range. And at 220 km would be so far ahead of the magatrron that woudl not even be funny.


And still well behind the apoc. I think that tells a lot tbh...


someoen must be the best sniper. Nothign wrogn with that.

And also as compensation an APOC stands no chance agaisnt a tempest on close range.

Beverly Sparks
Posted - 2009.06.04 13:23:00 - [394]
 

Edited by: Beverly Sparks on 04/06/2009 13:24:47
Originally by: Seishi Maru
And also as compensation an APOC stands no chance agaisnt a tempest on close range....


... in a 1v1 fight on Sisi where the combatants start off 10 km apart.


Seishi Maru
doMAL S.A.
Posted - 2009.06.04 13:36:00 - [395]
 

Originally by: Beverly Sparks
Edited by: Beverly Sparks on 04/06/2009 13:24:47
Originally by: Seishi Maru
And also as compensation an APOC stands no chance agaisnt a tempest on close range....


... in a 1v1 fight on Sisi where the combatants start off 10 km apart.




on any 1v1 fight. You can say that is rare...specially in 0.0 ... but "240 km sniping" is also not so common... specially in empire. So stil remaisns that each sides has its advantages.

I do from tiem to time see solo or paired tempest in low sec gates and stations... pirates. NEver ever saw a pirate in a solo APOC....

Tempest do not need to match apoc as sniper.. matching megatron would be enough. Tempest already has more dps tahn megatron.. until the arti reload hits.. (the clip is an issue that suirely needs immediate correction). Just makign range modules give falloff bonus woudl minimaly increase effective range of others, while significantly increase for minmatar. Correct the clip issue and make some alpha striek tweaking and I woudl even drop my apoc for a tempest once in a while (and i trained into apoc to replace my tempest exaclty).

To mare
Amarr
Advanced Technology
Posted - 2009.06.04 13:42:00 - [396]
 

Originally by: bubbly bird
Its fine im happy to explain.

The premise was that BS lasers were virtually as good as BS blasters at blasters 4.5km optimal while lasers also having a vast range and dps advantage from out to 45+km that blasters do not get.

Now to solve this ppl wanted to make lasers worse at close range, that idea in of itself has some merit but doing so is more than a little problematic due to the reality of BS pvp.

One suggestion was to nerf BS laser tracking.

Now on paper or on a EFT graph showing a 1 v 1 BS fight the solution looked quite reasonable BUT when applied to TQ pvp and you factor in that multiple ships will be involved along with the target ship (a BS in this case) will have multiple webs on it as well as its orbit/transversal being utterly subjective to a single ship to be quite honest tracking becomes irrelavant even at the closest of ranges.

So to point this out i fitted a abaddon with T2 pulse loaded with scorch, i then fired 6 max shilled and pilgrim fitted tracking disruptors loaded with tracking speed scripts at it and reduced the abaddon pilots turret tracking skill (motion prediction) to 0.

The result was that the abaddon turrets had a tracking speed of 0.00207 (a good skilled pilot with MF gets 0.04219 btw) that is about as bad as you can gimp tracking and close to a sieged dreads tracking.

Then i fitted a standard BS with the usual plates and mwd gang setup and set it to orbit the abaddon with full transversal i then applied multiple webs on the target to simulate a gang combat effect, i slso left the abaddon stationary and made no attempt to reduce the transversal effect through piloting ect.


The result was that even with such awsomly butchered tracking and in the worst possable condition as well as the target ship having a constant and perfect transversal orbit (a thing impossable on TQ as you well know) the abaddon was still hitting the target for significan dmg inside blaster optimal.


So for those who missed the point:

If after having its tracking screwed over down to 0.00207 while a good skilled pilot with MF gets 0.04219(im not sre what % that is but its a lotShocked) a pulse BS can still hit at uber close range, how is a rather pitiful 7.5%-10% tracking nerf to pulse gonna do anything worthwhile?.

I hope this clarifies things a little.



i dont see that much of a problem here if the target BS is under multiple web it mean its almost stationary so yeah even with low tracking the abaddon still hit his target and so will do the mega.
under the same conditions the mega and abaddon will do almost the same turret dps (the mega win because of drones) but you have to consider that both the ships have the same 25% damage bonus but the abbaddon have 1 more turret, im not speaking of tracking because following your example both of the ships are nearly immobile, but if both of them was moving the mega would win even with current TQ stats, now add a tracking nerf to laser and is even more easy for the mega.

after all of this im not contrary to a 10% boost to both tracking and dps of blaster but numbers over that would be unbalanced.

my idea of balancing is still:
-give blaster a damage and tracking boost nothing exagerated (5-10% max)
-leave laser damage and range where they are now but get rid of the tracking bonus its no longer needed after speednerf
-adjust autocannons so they will be the range and versatile weapon they should be they should do less damage than blaster in the 0-15km range zone and outdamage the on the over 15km zone, but they should do more damage than laser in the 0-15km zone and get outdamaged over the 15km.


about long range weapons i think rails and beams are well balanced (tachyons are awesome but i got no great problem with them they have theyr drawbacks), artillery is another story and need to be looked deeply.



Beverly Sparks
Posted - 2009.06.04 14:27:00 - [397]
 

Originally by: Seishi Maru
on any 1v1 fight. You can say that is rare...specially in 0.0 ... but "240 km sniping" is also not so common... specially in empire. So stil remaisns that each sides has its advantages.

I do from tiem to time see solo or paired tempest in low sec gates and stations... pirates. NEver ever saw a pirate in a solo APOC....

Tempest do not need to match apoc as sniper.. matching megatron would be enough. Tempest already has more dps tahn megatron.. until the arti reload hits.. (the clip is an issue that suirely needs immediate correction). Just makign range modules give falloff bonus woudl minimaly increase effective range of others, while significantly increase for minmatar. Correct the clip issue and make some alpha striek tweaking and I woudl even drop my apoc for a tempest once in a while (and i trained into apoc to replace my tempest exaclty).


All of these things are not equal.

i.e. You are average at solo PvP, which I suck at, and I am good with gangs and in fleet... See everything has it's place, perfect.

You cross training away from the Tempest says it all. I am not criticizing though, because I am doing the same thing.

bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 14:39:00 - [398]
 

Originally by: To mare



i dont see that much of a problem here if the target BS is under multiple web it mean its almost stationary so yeah even with low tracking the abaddon still hit his target and so will do the mega.
under the same conditions the mega and abaddon will do almost the same turret dps (the mega win because of drones) but you have to consider that both the ships have the same 25% damage bonus but the abbaddon have 1 more turret, im not speaking of tracking because following your example both of the ships are nearly immobile, but if both of them was moving the mega would win even with current TQ stats, now add a tracking nerf to laser and is even more easy for the mega.


You are missing the point.

The fact is that BS are gang ships and as such multiple webs will always be available and used on a target ship.

Do not think that i miss the fact that at blaster optimal in a abaddon vs mega 1 v 1 fight with max transversal orbit speeds the mega stands a reasonable chance of beating the abaddon but the fact is that those fights only happen in 3 places.

1. On paper.
2. On EFT graph.
3. On sissi in a BF area in a 1 v 1 fight.

You cannot balance BS using 1 v 1 stats because CCP has deliberatly made solo BS pvp a non issue with the web nerfs amoung other things.


Originally by: To mare
about long range weapons i think rails and beams are well balanced (tachyons are awesome but i got no great problem with them they have theyr drawbacks), artillery is another story and need to be looked deeply.


Tachyons on a apoc have the highest dps of all sniper turrets, the highest tracking of all sniper turrets, virtually max range optimal, no need to reload and can be used on a cap stable ship fit...because of the apocs bonuses they are one of the most OP turrets in the game.

But your right about arties they suck and need work.

bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 14:42:00 - [399]
 

Originally by: Seishi Maru
Originally by: Nuts Nougat

Originally by: Seishi Maru


run the nubmer before throwing things off. A tempest liek that at 170 km would have MORE damage than a megatron at same range. And at 220 km would be so far ahead of the magatrron that woudl not even be funny.


And still well behind the apoc. I think that tells a lot tbh...


someoen must be the best sniper. Nothign wrogn with that.




The problem is not that its the best the problem is that it is the best by WAY WAY WAY to big a margin.

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 14:51:00 - [400]
 

Edited by: Electric Universe on 04/06/2009 15:01:48
Originally by: bubbly bird
Edited by: bubbly bird on 04/06/2009 10:25:19

Originally by: Electric Universe


Dude, was i talking about sisi here?. We have something called TQ.

And a 1200+ DPS gank geddon on Sisi wont hit a Tempest any harder if it was a 1200+ DPS gank geddon on TQ. 1200 DPS is still 1200 DPS.


The sort of fight you are talking about only happens on sissi.

Stop wasting ppls time with your worthless 1 v 1 sissi data as anybody can setup a active tank BS so it can tank 1200+dps from 2 dmg types.

Originally by: Electric Universe
Yes the Abaddon have higher resists than the Megathron in total. And if you put in 50-60 mill isk extra into the Megathron instead of paying that much extra to get an Abaddon, you will do around 1% more DPS than the Abaddon after resists then.


WRONG.

Even if you use faction ANP's it will still have less, but even if it did have 1% more we are talking about the range being in blaster optimal so the dps differance should be at least 10-20%.

Originally by: Electric Universe
LOL, no matter what you say, if you just want it and want to risk to lose your ship, then a Blaster Mega is still a good solo PVP ship even when you risk to lose the ship sometimes.


Get a frigging clue you fool a solo ship that is either useless or vulnerable to almost EVERY ship smaller than it is a useless solo ship.

Originally by: Electric Universe
EDIT: LOL, NightmareX told me that he have spend 400 mill isk more into his Navy MegaTwisted Evil.

See here, this is his new setup: LINK.

Yes, that's with his skills. With all skills on level 5, he will have 81.7% EM resist just to tell you how much better the rest of the resists gets to.

He doesn't have a slave set right now, that's why you only see 42k armor. With a LG slave set, he will get 286k EHP.



There has already been a warning given to brining up alts and who's who trolling of this thread so i suggest you pack in using such obvious bait in your posts to try and start off topic arguments about your main cos i will be reporting it and pointing out your provocations, manipulations and lies.



1st thing. Where did i say what kind of PVP i was doing there?. I was only saying that IF a 1200+ DPS geddon was shooting me on Sisi, it woudn't do more damage to my Tempest on TQ. It would still do 1200 DPS no matter what. And the resists to my Tempest is 100% the same on both TQ and Sisi.

I think you should start reading what i'm saying at least 5 times from now on before you post anything.

2nd thing. Yes the 2x Damage mods Megathron will do 1% more DPS than the Abaddon. But the Abaddon will have more EHP or armor hp because the Mega use 2x plates. Remember that NightmareX did a really nice maths of why NightmareX's Navy Mega with 2 faction ANP's (that is dirt cheap) and 2 damage mods was doing more DPS, had more EHP than the Abaddon earlier.

And because the Navy Mega have exact same DPS output as the Mega, then they are both doing the same DPS.

The only thing that is different is that a normal Mega have 7 low slots while the Navy Mega have 8. So the normal Mega have one lesser plate. So it have lower armor hp.

But hey, we are comparing a tier 2 ship with a tier 3 ship stats wise lol. You can't get the Mega to have better stats than the Abaddon if both of the ships use the same type of setups.

But with the EANM'S and ANP's that was used on his Mega earlier, that Mega was then doing 1% more DPS because of the resists. Yes NightmareX did calculate out why the Navy Mega was doing 1% more DPS + had 3k more EHP than the Abaddon. He had included the total resists values in that math.

And because the Navy Mega & Mega have 100% the same DPS output, then the normal Mega are still doing 1% more DPS than the Abaddon.

3rd thing. Solo PVP are still doable no matter what you say. You just have to use your brain a bit, like you can't.

4th thing. Oh the tearsLaughing.

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:00:00 - [401]
 

Edited by: Electric Universe on 04/06/2009 15:09:07
And just to add.

The Navy Mega setup NightmareX used earlier to compare with was not the setup he have now. He was using a setup similar to what setup Murina was using on his Abaddon.

So after NightmareX had calculated out everything stats wise after everything was fitted, then his Navy Mega was doing around 1% more DPS and had 3k more EHP than the Abaddon.

And because the normal Mega have the same setup as NightmareX had on his Navy Mega in low slot (except that he used 3x plates on his Navy Mega) that he compared to Murina's Abaddon, then both of the normal Mega and the Navy Mega have exactly the same resists. So the Mega only have lower armor because it use 2x plates and not 3x plates like the Navy Mega did.

The only difference is that the Abaddon have a little more EHP / armor HP than the Mega, but that's because 2x plates are used, not 3 that was used on NightmareX's Navy Mega.

So yes, as long the resists are the same on both the Mega and Navy Mega, and have the same amount of damage mods, then the normal Mega will still do the same DPS as the Navy Mega, and that again means it will do 1% more DPS than the Abaddon after resists.

So here is a protip to you. Shut up and learn to do maths and learn how to use the ships right, or just leave this topic if you can't write more than lies all the times.

Rhadamantine
Game Community
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:09:00 - [402]
 

Hold on here, I don't see any TQ PvP information with your name Electric, as you won't find any with mine.
How are you finding out this information? Are you being told things and taking their word for it?
People tell me many things, but I tend to try and find out the truth myself, before making comments.

You just pointed out some guy called NightmareX fitted (cheaply it seems) a navy mega to compare to standard battleships. Giving him more HP and damage.
You then moan that comparing tier 3 with tier 2 is a bad idea. What gives?

I'm not sure if you're a troll tbh, that whole thing just didn't make sense to me.

To mare
Amarr
Advanced Technology
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:23:00 - [403]
 

Originally by: bubbly bird
Originally by: To mare



i dont see that much of a problem here if the target BS is under multiple web it mean its almost stationary so yeah even with low tracking the abaddon still hit his target and so will do the mega.
under the same conditions the mega and abaddon will do almost the same turret dps (the mega win because of drones) but you have to consider that both the ships have the same 25% damage bonus but the abbaddon have 1 more turret, im not speaking of tracking because following your example both of the ships are nearly immobile, but if both of them was moving the mega would win even with current TQ stats, now add a tracking nerf to laser and is even more easy for the mega.


You are missing the point.

The fact is that BS are gang ships and as such multiple webs will always be available and used on a target ship.

Do not think that i miss the fact that at blaster optimal in a abaddon vs mega 1 v 1 fight with max transversal orbit speeds the mega stands a reasonable chance of beating the abaddon but the fact is that those fights only happen in 3 places.

1. On paper.
2. On EFT graph.
3. On sissi in a BF area in a 1 v 1 fight.

You cannot balance BS using 1 v 1 stats because CCP has deliberatly made solo BS pvp a non issue with the web nerfs amoung other things.


so you saying that the tracking bonus on the mega is useless because actual metagame?
i do agree with you on the need to make blaster viable but i also think that different weapon should serve different purpose.
ok laser are the best for mid range engagement with big supports
lets make blaster the ultimate weapon for small size engagement
and projectile a versatile weapon that cant beat the above weapons on what they specialized to do but can hold his own out of the normal engagemet range of the above weapons distance > 10km for blaster and distance <15km for laser

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:28:00 - [404]
 

Edited by: Electric Universe on 04/06/2009 15:31:34
Originally by: Rhadamantine
Hold on here, I don't see any TQ PvP information with your name Electric, as you won't find any with mine.
How are you finding out this information? Are you being told things and taking their word for it?
People tell me many things, but I tend to try and find out the truth myself, before making comments.

You just pointed out some guy called NightmareX fitted (cheaply it seems) a navy mega to compare to standard battleships. Giving him more HP and damage.
You then moan that comparing tier 3 with tier 2 is a bad idea. What gives?

I'm not sure if you're a troll tbh, that whole thing just didn't make sense to me.

If you think about the things with the Mega / Navy Mega, then NightmareX did an excelent job on doing the maths on how good the ships is earlier in another topic that is now locked.

I can read and i can understand what he are saying. And i can also read and understand how each of the weapons are meant to work.

The Navy Mega was just an example i used because the Navy Mega have the exact same DPS output as the normal Mega. And because i use the same setup in low slot on a Mega as NightmareX did use on his Navy Mega, then i will have exact same DPS and resists on the Mega's i use to use as an example when i compare ships with the normal Mega.

No i don't moan that tier 3 gives better stats than tier 2. I only say that a tier 3 BS have better stats than tier 2 BS. Tier 3 BS'es almost have better stats than even faction BS'es to.

So comparing a normal tier 2 BS to a tier 3 BS you will never get any better stats on a tier 2 BS than you can get on a tier 3 BS if you use the same type of setups on both ships.

BUT......., because the Mega with Neutrons already have so high DPS output and because the damage types it does are so good, then the Megathron with Neutrons will do slightly better DPS than the Abaddon with 7x Pulses and one RR.

With 8x Pulses on the Abaddon, then the Abaddon will do more DPS than the Blaster Mega, but then he have no RR's.

Even a Mega with no damage mods will do more DPS than an Abaddon with 7x Pulses and 1x damage mod fittedWink.

In an RR gang, an Abaddon need to have one RR fitted anyways. So he have to offer one gun for one RR.

Oh, it all makes seense if you can understand how things are supposed to work and if you can do maths.

If you can do those 2 things, then you will start to understand what i'm talking about.

To mare
Amarr
Advanced Technology
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:43:00 - [405]
 

Originally by: bubbly bird

Originally by: To mare
about long range weapons i think rails and beams are well balanced (tachyons are awesome but i got no great problem with them they have theyr drawbacks), artillery is another story and need to be looked deeply.


Tachyons on a apoc have the highest dps of all sniper turrets, the highest tracking of all sniper turrets, virtually max range optimal, no need to reload and can be used on a cap stable ship fit...because of the apocs bonuses they are one of the most OP turrets in the game.

But your right about arties they suck and need work.



tachyons are so good when they used on the apoc because its a ship designed to snipe since it have optimal range bonus but even rail if used on a ship designed to snipe are good.

[apoc]
Reactor Control Unit II
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II
Heat Sink II
Tracking Enhancer II

100MN MicroWarpdrive II
F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines,Targeting Range
F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines,Targeting Range
Medium Capacitor Booster II,Cap Booster 800

Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L
Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L
Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L
Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L
Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L
Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L
Tachyon Beam Laser II,Aurora L

Trimark Armor Pump I
Trimark Armor Pump I
Trimark Armor Pump I

261 dps at 188+25
312 dps at 163+25 if you switch TE for another heat sink (also need to switch the EANM for cpu problem) 103k EHP

----------------------------

[rokh]
Reactor Control Unit I
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Damage Control II
100MN MicroWarpdrive I
Medium Capacitor Booster II,Cap Booster 800
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Sensor Booster II
Sensor Booster II,Targeting Range
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
Core Defence Field Extender I
Core Defence Field Extender I
Core Defence Field Extender I

321 dps at 194+30 (more dps at more range)
277 dps at 151+30 just switchin fo faction tungsten (for better tracking than apoc)
102k EHP

-------------------------------------

[sniper]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Adaptive Nano Plating II
100MN MicroWarpdrive II
Sensor Booster II,Targeting Range
Sensor Booster II,Targeting Range
Medium Capacitor Booster II,Cap Booster 800
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L
425mm Railgun II,Spike L

Trimark Armor Pump I
Trimark Armor Pump I
Trimark Armor Pump I

261 dps at 168+30 (same tracking of the rokh with faction ammo)
97k EHP

not cool as the 2 others but cant expect great things for a ship w/o optimal bonus (=not designed to snipe) bu can still hold his own


all the 3 ships need a cap booster to be cap stable (yes even the apoc)

Beverly Sparks
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:44:00 - [406]
 

Originally by: To mare

and projectile a versatile weapon that cant beat the above weapons on what they specialized to do but can hold his own out of the normal engagemet range of the above weapons distance > 10km for blaster and distance <15km for laser



That's exactly what it is now.

It needs to be better then the other weapons when the other weapon is not in it's optimal engagement range.

IF you were to start in the other weapons optimal engagement range and move out, it cannot be that you would start out by being outdamaged by a lot to being outdamaged by a little. How could you win? In a perfect world, AC's would dominate blasters between say 15-25 just as much as blasters dominate from 5-15. And similarly AC's should out DPS Lasers from 5-20 and lasers from 20-35.

The whole problem is at the BS level close range is not a reliable way to reduce DPS. Imagine if there was a falloff that went from optimal and went back towards zero.. that would assure that Pulses had crap damage in close.

So if the optimal was 40k they would still do 100%. Then at 20k, they would be doing 1/2 (35% or whatever) damage, and 0 at 0. Then they would be fighting in the same type of scenario as AC's are.

Rhadamantine
Game Community
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:44:00 - [407]
 

Edited by: Rhadamantine on 04/06/2009 15:49:22

@ Electric Universe: Show me the math then please, because atm it just looks like opinion.

People go out of their way to kill anything out of the norm, so a Navy mega would be primary on TQ for sure.
So I'm not sure and extra 3k hp over the abaddon, would be worth the cost. (if your figures are correct)

You have such a narrow window with blasters though, surely the range amarr ships have, would make them a better choice?

Edited for spelling. Embarassed

bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 15:50:00 - [408]
 

Edited by: bubbly bird on 04/06/2009 16:11:19
Originally by: Electric Universe

1st thing. Where did i say what kind of PVP i was doing there?. I was only saying that IF a 1200+ DPS geddon was shooting me on Sisi, it woudn't do more damage to my Tempest on TQ. It would still do 1200 DPS no matter what. And the resists to my Tempest is 100% the same on both TQ and Sisi.

I think you should start reading what i'm saying at least 5 times from now on before you post anything.


Maybe if you posted things that had any bearing on the topic at hand it would be easier because pointing out that a ship that can active tank 1200dps from another shiop is a worthless and pointless comment to make.

Originally by: Electric Universe
Rant about a faction fitted navy mega


Nobody is interested in your silly faction fitted navy mega as this is about a normal mega with a T2 fit max.


Originally by: Electric Universe
3rd thing. Solo PVP are still doable no matter what you say. You just have to use your brain a bit, like you can't.


The last time you ranted on about solo BS pvp being alive and well you tried dropping farjungs name out in the hopes it would add wieght to your arguments, you also tried speaking on behalf of your alliance at the time.

Farjung posted later in the thread and told you quite clearly how wrong you were and he also explained why, so did a top member of your previous alliance so unless you want another embarressing spanking perhaps you shouls stick to posting about your XP in solo of gang pvp flying a blaster BS.

But i suppose if you limited yourself to doing that you would have to stop posting altogether...LaughingRolling Eyes

bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 16:06:00 - [409]
 

Edited by: bubbly bird on 04/06/2009 16:08:36
Originally by: Rhadamantine


@ Electric Universe: Show me the math then please, because atm it just looks like opinion.

People go out of their way to kill anything out of the norm, so a Navy mega would be primary on TQ for sure.
So I'm not sure and extra 3k hp over the abaddon, would be worth the cost. (if your figures are correct)

You have such a narrow window with blasters though, surely the range amarr ships have, would make them a better choice?

Edited for spelling. Embarassed


Here is some exact math and the workings out for you if you need anything explaining by all means please ask.


THESE FIGURES ARE FROM STANDARDLY FITTED RR MEGAS AND ABADDONS.

Your mega starts with 7 guns and RR with 832 gun dps and 300 drone dps to be assigned.

The ABADDON has 75.7% thermal resists and 71.9 kinetic resists.

300 thermal drone dmg from T2 gaurd less 75.7% = 72.9 DPS.
482.56 kinetic damage from its guns less 71.9% = 135.6 DPS.
394.44 thermal damage from its guns less 75.7% = 84.9 DPS.

YOUR MEGA GETS A TOTAL OF 293.4 MAX DPS OUT TO 4.5KM vs THE ABADDON.


The abaddon starts with 7 guns and RR with 802 gun dps and 180 drone dps to be assigned.

The mega has 73.4 em resists and 65.5 thermal resists.

180 thr drone dmg less 65.5% = 62.1 DPS.
465.16 gun em damage less 73.4% = 123.8 DPS.
336.84 gun th damage less 65.5% = 116.2 DPS.
THE ABAD GETS A TOTAL OF 302.1 MAX DPS OUT TO 15KM vs the MEGA.


THE ABAD GETS A TOTAL OF 302.1 MAX DPS AFTER RESISTS OUT TO 15KM vs THE MEGA.
THE MEGA GETS A TOTAL OF 293.4 MAX DPS AFTER RESISTS OUT TO 4.5KM vs THE ABAD.

The mega actually hits the abaddon for 3% LESS DPS than the abaddon hits it, and for 300% less range, and the mega has a WEAK 52.2% explosive resist hole and also has 18% LESS EHP.


PS: i sent you a ingame mail about the nightmareX/electric situation, you will understand when you read it.

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 16:22:00 - [410]
 

Originally by: Rhadamantine
Edited by: Rhadamantine on 04/06/2009 15:49:22

@ Electric Universe: Show me the math then please, because atm it just looks like opinion.

People go out of their way to kill anything out of the norm, so a Navy mega would be primary on TQ for sure.
So I'm not sure and extra 3k hp over the abaddon, would be worth the cost. (if your figures are correct)

You have such a narrow window with blasters though, surely the range amarr ships have, would make them a better choice?

Edited for spelling. Embarassed

I can't be arsed to browse through multiple topics with over 50 pages each just to find the 2 replies with the maths on the Navy Mega.

Anyways, for my play style, or the way i want to fight all the time, then the Megathron is much much better for me than an Abaddon can be ever.

Uhm, a Navy Mega wouldn't directly be primary on TQ. Haven't you seen DHB's lastest movie?. He's there in a Bhaalgorn in a gate fight with many on each sides. He wasn't even primary there in the movie when the other gang jumped in on them there.

So saying a Navy Mega will be primary is just rubbish.

Or it can be primary if you want it. But then, it makes some things in that fight pretty easyWink.

If your in a 30 man gang vs another 30 man gang and then you make the Navy mega as bait, then it will be easy to just warp in right after the Navy Mega and just RR it, because everyone knows who the primary for the enemy gang is.

Yes the figures are totally right about the Navy Mega that have 3k more EHP than the Abaddon. But then, we are originally talking about the normal Mega, and the normal mega have lower EHP than the Abaddon.

But the DPS are the same on the normal Mega as the Navy Mega have.

Rhadamantine
Game Community
Posted - 2009.06.04 16:33:00 - [411]
 

Edited by: Rhadamantine on 04/06/2009 16:34:49
Originally by: Electric Universe
Anyways, for my play style, or the way i want to fight all the time, then the Megathron is much much better for me than an Abaddon can be ever.

Uhm, a Navy Mega wouldn't directly be primary on TQ. Haven't you seen DHB's lastest movie?. He's there in a Bhaalgorn in a gate fight with many on each sides. He wasn't even primary there in the movie when the other gang jumped in on them there.

So saying a Navy Mega will be primary is just rubbish.

Or it can be primary if you want it. But then, it makes some things in that fight pretty easyWink.

If your in a 30 man gang vs another 30 man gang and then you make the Navy mega as bait, then it will be easy to just warp in right after the Navy Mega and just RR it, because everyone knows who the primary for the enemy gang is.

Yes the figures are totally right about the Navy Mega that have 3k more EHP than the Abaddon. But then, we are originally talking about the normal Mega, and the normal mega have lower EHP than the Abaddon.

But the DPS are the same on the normal Mega as the Navy Mega have.


There maybe situation where a faction ship might not be primary, but my opinion is, it would be most times. It's just human nature.

You stated the Mega has slightly more dps than the abaddon, so using the Navy mega gets you 3k more HP. That seems an awful lot of isk to throw at a ship for and extra 3k hp.
If you take into account the figures posted by Bubbly Bird, it makes even more sense to choose the abaddon over the mega. That's before you take range into account.

As far as your play style is concerned, I'll have to take your word for it, as I don't see any info backing it up.

Edit: After reading the in-game mail, it makes abit more sense if true. Shocked

Nuts Nougat
SniggWaffe
FREE KARTTOON NOW
Posted - 2009.06.04 16:35:00 - [412]
 

Originally by: To mare
Originally by: bubbly bird

Originally by: To mare
about long range weapons i think rails and beams are well balanced (tachyons are awesome but i got no great problem with them they have theyr drawbacks), artillery is another story and need to be looked deeply.


Tachyons on a apoc have the highest dps of all sniper turrets, the highest tracking of all sniper turrets, virtually max range optimal, no need to reload and can be used on a cap stable ship fit...because of the apocs bonuses they are one of the most OP turrets in the game.

But your right about arties they suck and need work.



tachyons are so good when they used on the apoc because its a ship designed to snipe since it have optimal range bonus but even rail if used on a ship designed to snipe are good.

[apoc]
261 dps at 188+25
312 dps at 163+25 if you switch TE for another heat sink (also need to switch the EANM for cpu problem) 103k EHP

----------------------------

[rokh]

321 dps at 194+30 (more dps at more range)
277 dps at 151+30 just switchin fo faction tungsten (for better tracking than apoc)
102k EHP

-------------------------------------

[sniper]

261 dps at 168+30 (same tracking of the rokh with faction ammo)
97k EHP

not cool as the 2 others but cant expect great things for a ship w/o optimal bonus (=not designed to snipe) bu can still hold his own


all the 3 ships need a cap booster to be cap stable (yes even the apoc)
ughughYARRRR!!NeutralArrowIdeaQuestionExclamationWinkRolling EyesTwisted EvilEvil or Very MadCrying or Very sadEmbarassedRazzMadLaughingCoolConfusedShockedSurprisedSadSmileVery Happy
Please tell me your are joking with these setups sir. These are not sniper ships. Sniper ships consist of:
  1. 8 (or whatever number of turrets) guns

  2. 3 damage mods

  3. optimal range mods(can be locus rigs, scripted tracking computers or tracking enhancers)


Apoc in this setup does 400 dps out to 220km with 2 range mods, 250km with 3. It also has the highest tracking and it doesn't need to reload either. Even the rokh, supposed sniper king doesn't even get near these numbers. 320 dps and extremely crappy alpha compared to tachyons, with worse tracking. And range is capped at 250 anyway, so rokh gets no advantage out of the sick optimals it could get.

Seriously you can't compare a 3 magstab rokh to a single heatsink apoc, it just doesn't work that way. Yes the rokh will have a better tank, but I think we were discussing sniping here, not tanking.

I'm not even going to go after megathron stats, or god forbid, a tempest.

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 16:36:00 - [413]
 

Originally by: bubbly bird
Edited by: bubbly bird on 04/06/2009 16:11:19
Originally by: Electric Universe

1st thing. Where did i say what kind of PVP i was doing there?. I was only saying that IF a 1200+ DPS geddon was shooting me on Sisi, it woudn't do more damage to my Tempest on TQ. It would still do 1200 DPS no matter what. And the resists to my Tempest is 100% the same on both TQ and Sisi.

I think you should start reading what i'm saying at least 5 times from now on before you post anything.


Maybe if you posted things that had any bearing on the topic at hand it would be easier because pointing out that a ship that can active tank 1200dps from another shiop is a worthless and pointless comment to make.

Originally by: Electric Universe
Rant about a faction fitted navy mega


Nobody is interested in your silly faction fitted navy mega as this is about a normal mega with a T2 fit max.


Originally by: Electric Universe
3rd thing. Solo PVP are still doable no matter what you say. You just have to use your brain a bit, like you can't.


The last time you ranted on about solo BS pvp being alive and well you tried dropping farjungs name out in the hopes it would add wieght to your arguments, you also tried speaking on behalf of your alliance at the time.

Farjung posted later in the thread and told you quite clearly how wrong you were and he also explained why, so did a top member of your previous alliance so unless you want another embarressing spanking perhaps you shouls stick to posting about your XP in solo of gang pvp flying a blaster BS.

But i suppose if you limited yourself to doing that you would have to stop posting altogether...LaughingRolling Eyes

To the first thing.

Your still to damn stupid to actually see what i'm really talking about, so booohooo, cry some more.

Because of this, you now need to read what i'm saying at least 10 times before you post anything so you can understand what i'm talking about.

2nd thing.

Ahahah, your still dumb and don't see that i'm talking about the Navy Mega and the normal Mega because they use the same setup in low slot and high slot, and still have the same DPS and resists. And i dod use the Navy Mega as an example because the Navy mega with 2x damage mods was doing 1% more DPS than the Abaddon. And because the normal Mega have the same DPS output, then the normal Mega still does 1% more DPS than the Abaddon.

3rd thing.

Uhm, i'am in an allaince?. Wow, i mean seriously wow, you really need to learn to read. I took Darknesss and Leilani as examples because i know those 2 players are crazy players when it's about using Blaster BS'es.

Those 2 players are 2 examples that shows how good Blaster BS'es can be when they are used right and piloted by the right guys.

And if you haven't got it with you, Farjung said that he haven't been playing for years when he posted that. And that makes his post invalid to many points.

As i said, ask Darknesss, Leilani or many others that can use Blaster BS'es very nice about how they are. Because Darknesss and Leilani for example have been playing all the time and know how the game have changed the last years.

Uh, have i ever been in an alliance dude?. Don't take NightmareX as me, because he's not. And the noob in the same alliance as NightmareX that was smacking him is the same type of player like you, your lazy and very poor to use the Blasters after how their standards are today with them.

And because of that, you scream for boost because you want CCP to make Blasters to easy mode.

Lasers are now easy mode. Enjoy it as long it lasts.

To mare
Amarr
Advanced Technology
Posted - 2009.06.04 16:58:00 - [414]
 

Edited by: To mare on 04/06/2009 17:01:22
Originally by: Nuts Nougat
Originally by: To mare
Originally by: bubbly bird

Originally by: To mare
about long range weapons i think rails and beams are well balanced (tachyons are awesome but i got no great problem with them they have theyr drawbacks), artillery is another story and need to be looked deeply.


Tachyons on a apoc have the highest dps of all sniper turrets, the highest tracking of all sniper turrets, virtually max range optimal, no need to reload and can be used on a cap stable ship fit...because of the apocs bonuses they are one of the most OP turrets in the game.

But your right about arties they suck and need work.



tachyons are so good when they used on the apoc because its a ship designed to snipe since it have optimal range bonus but even rail if used on a ship designed to snipe are good.

[apoc]
261 dps at 188+25
312 dps at 163+25 if you switch TE for another heat sink (also need to switch the EANM for cpu problem) 103k EHP

----------------------------

[rokh]

321 dps at 194+30 (more dps at more range)
277 dps at 151+30 just switchin fo faction tungsten (for better tracking than apoc)
102k EHP

-------------------------------------

[sniper]

261 dps at 168+30 (same tracking of the rokh with faction ammo)
97k EHP

not cool as the 2 others but cant expect great things for a ship w/o optimal bonus (=not designed to snipe) bu can still hold his own


all the 3 ships need a cap booster to be cap stable (yes even the apoc)
ughughYARRRR!!NeutralArrowIdeaQuestionExclamationWinkRolling EyesTwisted EvilEvil or Very MadCrying or Very sadEmbarassedRazzMadLaughingCoolConfusedShockedSurprisedSadSmileVery Happy
Please tell me your are joking with these setups sir. These are not sniper ships. Sniper ships consist of:
  1. 8 (or whatever number of turrets) guns

  2. 3 damage mods

  3. optimal range mods(can be locus rigs, scripted tracking computers or tracking enhancers)


Apoc in this setup does 400 dps out to 220km with 2 range mods, 250km with 3. It also has the highest tracking and it doesn't need to reload either. Even the rokh, supposed sniper king doesn't even get near these numbers. 320 dps and extremely crappy alpha compared to tachyons, with worse tracking. And range is capped at 250 anyway, so rokh gets no advantage out of the sick optimals it could get.

Seriously you can't compare a 3 magstab rokh to a single heatsink apoc, it just doesn't work that way. Yes the rokh will have a better tank, but I think we were discussing sniping here, not tanking.

I'm not even going to go after megathron stats, or god forbid, a tempest.



sniper setups need to be DDD proof and if they are double DDD proof is better or enjoy to see your whole fleet destroyed with 1-2hits

oh and GL fitting 8 tachyons on a apoc.

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 17:15:00 - [415]
 

Edited by: Electric Universe on 04/06/2009 17:23:58
Ok i have been looking through some of the replies to NightmareX with some of the maths on the Navy Mega against the Abaddon.

The Navy Mega setup he did use is this:

High-Slot:

7x Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L
1x Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction

Med-Slot:

1x 100MN MicroWarpdrive II
1x Warp Disruptor II
1x Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
1x Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Low Slot:

1x Damage Control II
3x Coreli C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating
1x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
1x 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
2x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Rigs:

3x Trimark Armor Pump I

Drones:

5x Ogre II

This setup have 79.9% EM, 73.9% Thermal & Kinetic and 63.8% Explosive resists. It have 26921 armor HP without any armor implants. And it also have 152705 EHP. And this setup does 1126 DPS.

Now, lets go to the Abaddon setup:

High-Slot:

7x Mega Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency L
1x Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction

Med-Slot:

1x 100MN MicroWarpdrive II
1x Warp Disruptor II
1x Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
1x Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Low-Slot:

1x Damage Control II
2x Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
1x 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
3x Heat Sink II

Rigs:

3x Trimark Armor Pump I

Drones:

3x Ogre II

This setup have 82.7% EM, 77.5% Thermal, 74% Kinetic and 72.3% Explosive. It have 24144 armor HP without any armor implants. And it have 142111 EHP. And this setup does 992 DPS.

Alright, under here is just a basic calculation:

First of all, Blasters are doing most Kinetic damage, and look what your Kinetic resist is on your Abaddon, and then look at your Thermal resist that is the lowest damage Blasters do.

Then look at what damage lasers do. Yes, lasers do most EM damage and does some Thermal damage. Oh wait, look how high my EM resist isLaughing. The Navy Mega have better resists to EM that is the highest damage to lasers and then you have lower resists to Kinetic that is the highest damage to Blasters.

Than lets do some more calculating.

Now lets go to the Neutrons and the Caldari Navy Antimatter L ammo. The Caldari Navy Antimatter L does 32.2 kinetic damage and 23 thermal damage.

Then we take 32.2 damage minus the 74% Kinetic resist the Abaddon have to kinetic. And that damage will then be 8,372 damage.

Then we take the Thermal damage that is 23 minus the 77.5% Thermal resist your Abaddon have. And that will be 5,175 damage.

And 8,372 damage + 5,175 damage = 13,547 damage.

Now lets go to the Pulses and the Amarr Navy Multifrequency L. The Amarr Navy Multifrequency L does 32.2 EM damage and 23 Thermal damage.

Then we take the 32.2 EM damage minus the 79.9% EM resists i have on the Navy Mega. And that is 6,4722 damage.

And then take the 23 Thermal damage minus the 73.9% Thermal resist i have on my Navy Mega. And that will be 6,003 damage.

And 6,4722 damage + 6,003 damage = 12,4752 damage.

So yeah, when you see here, the Navy Mega are doing more DPS than the Abaddon. The Navy Mega here does 8.6% more DPS than the Abaddon.

And 5x ogre II's on a Mega / Navy Mega = 317 DPS. 3x Ogre II on an Abaddon = 190 DPS.

And the t2 Pulses for the Abaddon have 4.33527 sec ROF and 8.99289 damage mod while the t2 Neutrons on the Mega / Navy mega have 4.61155 sec ROF and 9.92537 damage mod.

Yes this is with both the Abaddon and Navy Mega with all skills on level 5.

So here the Navy Mega have more DPS and more EHP than the Abaddon.

But ofc, if we are using the same setups on both of the ship and then change out the Navy Mega for a normal Mega with the same setup om the Mega as we have on the Navy Mega, then we just takes one plate away. So the Mega just loose some armor HP then.

But it's still doing the same DPS and have the same resists as the Navy Mega.

1600 RT
Posted - 2009.06.04 17:23:00 - [416]
 

Originally by: Electric Universe

stuff



comparing a navy mega VS a abaddon isnt fair

start using non faction ships and maybe you have a point

bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 17:24:00 - [417]
 

Originally by: Rhadamantine


There maybe situation where a faction ship might not be primary, but my opinion is, it would be most times. It's just human nature.

You stated the Mega has slightly more dps than the abaddon, so using the Navy mega gets you 3k more HP. That seems an awful lot of isk to throw at a ship for and extra 3k hp.


500 or so UNINSURABLE mil for the same dps as a normal mega and only 3k more ehp than a abaddon....LaughingLaughing


Originally by: Rhadamantine
As far as your play style is concerned, I'll have to take your word for it, as I don't see any info backing it up.


His playstyle is just another lie as electric his alts and nightmareX have never flown a mega on TQ, or if they have they were transporting it as none of them has a single link to any KB with a kill or a loss involving them flying a blaster MEGA or any blaster BS for that matter...Laughing

Originally by: Rhadamantine
Edit: After reading the in-game mail, it makes abit more sense if true. Shocked


It is, and its been proven several times. Believe me if you watch the posting long enough its totally obvious.

bubbly bird
Posted - 2009.06.04 17:26:00 - [418]
 

Edited by: bubbly bird on 04/06/2009 17:36:28
Originally by: 1600 RT
Originally by: Electric Universe

stuff



comparing a navy mega VS a abaddon isnt fair

start using non faction ships and maybe you have a point


Not only a faction ship but he is also using these as tanking modules if you did not notice...3x Coreli C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating (another 25mil each btw).LaughingRolling Eyes

Beverly Sparks
Posted - 2009.06.04 17:30:00 - [419]
 

Edited by: Beverly Sparks on 04/06/2009 17:31:37
Originally by: Electric Universe
What?


This is where EFT takes you on a magical trip to no where.

If all that was true, they could have this be the graphics for eve.

Mega...................... Apoc

...Antimatter..Multifreq.......

O....>>>..........<<<.......O

Electric Universe
The Choir
Posted - 2009.06.04 17:36:00 - [420]
 

Edited by: Electric Universe on 04/06/2009 18:50:01
And to continue from my post before this.

You can use the same setup on the Navy Mega as you use on the normal Mega over, except that you have one less low slot on the Mega. But you can use another setup to on the normal Mega that is also doing more DPS than the Abaddon.

The Low and Med slot are the exact same as the setup over. But then change the setup on the normal Mega to this in low slot:

1x Damage Control II
2x Coreli C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating
1x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
1x 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
2x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

With this setup the normal Mega have 78.4% EM, 71.9% Thermal & Kinetic and 61.1% Explosive resists. It have 20610 armor HP and 106359 EHP. No implants are used here. And this setup does the same as the setup over, 1126 DPS. And have the same ROF and damage mod as the setup on the Navy mega on the post over from me.

So again, lets do some calculations on the NORMAL Mega's stats.

Now lets go to the Neutrons and the Caldari Navy Antimatter L ammo. The Caldari Navy Antimatter L does 32.2 kinetic damage and 23 thermal damage.

Then we take 32.2 damage minus the 74% Kinetic resist the Abaddon have to kinetic. And that damage will then be 8,372 damage.

Then we take the Thermal damage that is 23 minus the 77.5% Thermal resist your Abaddon have. And that will be 5,175 damage.

And 8,372 damage + 5,175 damage = 13,547 damage.

Now lets go to the Pulses and the Amarr Navy Multifrequency L. The Amarr Navy Multifrequency L does 32.2 EM damage and 23 Thermal damage.

Then we take the 32.2 EM damage minus the 78.4% EM resists i have on the Mega. And that is 6,9552 damage.

And then take the 23 Thermal damage minus the 71.9% Thermal resist i have on my Mega. And that will be 6,463 damage.

And 6,9552 damage + 6,463 damage = 13,4182 damage.

So yeah, when you see here, the normal Mega are still doing more DPS than the Abaddon.

Yes this is with both the Abaddon and Mega with all skills on level 5.

Then you use the same ROF and damage mods + the drones DPS here to, and then you will see what i'm talking about.

The normal Blaster Mega still does slightly more DPS than the Abaddon. But then, the Abaddon have a little better resists and EHP than the Mega.

So i'am still wrong that the normal Mega with 2x damage mods does lower DPS than the Abaddon with 3x damage mods LOLLaughing?.
Originally by: bubbly bird
Not only a faction ship but he is also using these as tanking modules if you did not notice...3x Coreli C-Type Adaptive Nano Plating (another 25mil each btw).LaughingRolling Eyes

Those cost around 18-20 mill each.

And yeah, i can pay 40 mill isk more (because i only use 2 of them on the normal Mega) and put those mods i spent 40 mill isk on into my normal Mega and still have more DPS and still have used around the same amount of isk or less maybe on the Mega in total than i would do if i had bought an Abaddon woth ONLY t2 mods fitted.


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