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blankseplocked Will T3 ever come down to reality pricewise?
 
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E Vile
Posted - 2009.04.30 19:05:00 - [1]
 

No way am I going to fly a cruiser that outcosts a carrier. Not only are the ship prices still near 1 bil but subsystems are roughly 500 mil each. This ship is not worth a quarter that price. It's not better then T2 varients for specific roles.

I could see if this cruiser was totally insane preformance wise, but come on....these ships are not worth much more then a HAC in my opinion. Infact HAC have already gotten solo kills on these.

SO much for "new content". Give us some ships we would actually use (Other then the few extremely rich bored people)

4 LOM
Serenus Legion
Posted - 2009.04.30 19:08:00 - [2]
 

Originally by: E Vile
No way am I going to fly a cruiser that outcosts a carrier. Not only are the ship prices still near 1 bil but subsystems are roughly 500 mil each. This ship is not worth a quarter that price. It's not better then T2 varients for specific roles.

I could see if this cruiser was totally insane preformance wise, but come on....these ships are not worth much more then a HAC in my opinion. Infact HAC have already gotten solo kills on these.

SO much for "new content". Give us some ships we would actually use (Other then the few extremely rich bored people)


Last time i was in jita a tengu hull was 500m

I am stillwaiting for the hull + subsystems to fall into that 500M range before i even think about buying one. If they never do... oh well my loss i guess.

Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
Posted - 2009.04.30 19:09:00 - [3]
 

1bill? More like 600mil and still dropping. Already seeing hulls for under 600. T3 is sometimes better then T2 variants.

Nidhiesk
Posted - 2009.04.30 19:13:00 - [4]
 

its a market thing. Im not an expert but I know that the more available on the market the prices will eventually come down. Just look at invul t2 now a days. its insanely low right now. its hell. So yes, it will come down but...it will take time. I think CCP (including me) thought that t3 prices would go down faster than right now and would rush on W-space but thats not whats happening.

I could be wrong on that but thats my impression on the last part

Nidhiesk
Posted - 2009.04.30 19:16:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Nidhiesk on 30/04/2009 19:16:27
Originally by: Pottsey
1bill? More like 600mil and still dropping. Already seeing hulls for under 600. T3 is sometimes better then T2 variants.


sure true, sometimes its better than t2 but when you look at the price vs performance, no a lot of people would buy that. the consequences of losing the ship is very steep compared to t2 lol. its not only isk, its skill wise

Orakkus
Minmatar
m3 Corp
Posted - 2009.04.30 20:43:00 - [6]
 

Price may come down, but until CCP makes getting the resources from the wormholes easier, or more corps invest in long-term wormhole operations, the prices will stay prohibitively high.

Mr Reeth
Posted - 2009.04.30 20:46:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Pottsey
1bill? More like 600mil and still dropping. Already seeing hulls for under 600. T3 is sometimes better then T2 variants.


More like 3-5 billion and dropping slowly. Subsystems count as ship price.

The price on a full ship, subsystems included, will never drop too far. If the market crashes nobody will bother collecting the resources from WH space to make them.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2009.04.30 20:52:00 - [8]
 

Depends how highly the T3 resource gatherers value their time and in comparison to what.

Anubis Xian
Ministry of War
Posted - 2009.04.30 21:07:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Depends how highly the T3 resource gatherers value their time and in comparison to what.


Well if they are anything like Miners and T1 ship manufacturers...they don't value their time at all.

dread fire
Posted - 2009.04.30 22:53:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: dread fire on 30/04/2009 22:58:16
Currently the price of these ships is so high because the supplies to make them are still trickling down from W-space. Plus, to make them is even more complicated than T2 ships. It requires a blueprint to be reverse engineered, stuff to be bought or made, and made again before turning into a T3 ship. Not like your BS, which is a few mil trit and a handful of other easily mined or bought minerals.

Even if a T3 ship is not as good as a T2 ship, its versitility far outweighs the slightly worse performance. No more running 10-20 jumps back to jita to buy a new ship when you can just swap out your sub-systems for tackling or DPS.

Joe Martin
Locus Industries
Posted - 2009.04.30 23:05:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: dread fire
Even if a T3 ship is not as good as a T2 ship, its versitility far outweighs the slightly worse performance. No more running 10-20 jumps back to jita to buy a new ship when you can just swap out your sub-systems for tackling or DPS.


God forbid anyone have more than 1 ship in their base of operations.

Elizabetherat DeMartha
Posted - 2009.04.30 23:13:00 - [12]
 

Can't believe I've never tried this, but can you swap subs near an mom?

Davinel Lulinvega
Posted - 2009.04.30 23:21:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Anubis Xian
Originally by: Tippia
Depends how highly the T3 resource gatherers value their time and in comparison to what.


Well if they are anything like Miners and T1 ship manufacturers...they don't value their time at all.

What. BUT I THOUGHT MINERALS I MINED MYSELF WERE FREE?!?! Shocked

Caroline Nikon
Posted - 2009.04.30 23:29:00 - [14]
 

The prices are goign down not because the supply is raisign a lot.. but because the fever for a t3 ship has passed and peopel are less willign to spent a crapload of isk on them. Unless CCP changes the costs to build them I don 't foresee to be possible to make a ship ready to fly under 800M isk.

Preppa Atch
Posted - 2009.05.01 00:27:00 - [15]
 

T1 is inexpensive because of AFK macro miners.
T2 is inexpensive because of AFK moon mining.
T3 will become inexpensive because ?????

Deva Blackfire
Viziam
Posted - 2009.05.01 00:44:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Preppa Atch
T1 is inexpensive because of AFK macro miners.
T2 is inexpensive because of AFK moon mining.
T3 will become inexpensive because ?????


BECAUSE OF FALCON

And seriously: because of "i get it for free" squad.

EFT Warrior
Posted - 2009.05.01 00:51:00 - [17]
 

The reason things are cheap is because T1 and T2 components can be mined, manufactured and assembled in empire, where the risk is low, the input you have to give it and the resulted output are predictable, and everyone feels "safe" making it. On the flip side you have W-Space, consisting of several thousand unknown uncharted systems that required an elite team to go in and make a profit from it, where the supply line is just as unstable and moving supplies can be difficult. Of course prices will be high because the results aren't predicable, aren't "safe" and can't be done with ease.

Aleus Stygian
Posted - 2009.05.01 03:29:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Preppa Atch
T1 is inexpensive because of AFK macro miners.
T2 is inexpensive because of AFK moon mining.
T3 will become inexpensive because ?????


BECAUSE OF FALCON

And seriously: because of "i get it for free" squad.


Truth.

Also, amusing fact: A Tengu with the 'Covert Reconfiguration' subsystem fitted gets a 5% bonus per level to Medium Hybrid Turret damage. However, it has no turret hardpoints.

Good thinking there, CCP. Did the coffee machine break down that particular morning, or...?

MyOwnSling
Gallente
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.05.01 03:55:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Aleus Stygian
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Preppa Atch
T1 is inexpensive because of AFK macro miners.
T2 is inexpensive because of AFK moon mining.
T3 will become inexpensive because ?????


BECAUSE OF FALCON

And seriously: because of "i get it for free" squad.


Truth.

Also, amusing fact: A Tengu with the 'Covert Reconfiguration' subsystem fitted gets a 5% bonus per level to Medium Hybrid Turret damage. However, it has no turret hardpoints.

Good thinking there, CCP. Did the coffee machine break down that particular morning, or...?
Devs already stated that this is a typo. It's really a missile bonus.

Xequecal
Posted - 2009.05.01 04:05:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Xequecal on 01/05/2009 04:05:42
Honestly, they need to stay at extremely high prices. You can do some immensely overpowered stuff with them, like a bubble-immune Loki that webs/scrams you at 30km and does almost 600 DPS with 80k EHP. You don't need a single piece of faction gear for this, just judicious use of overheating and with the heat damage subsystem you can maintain it for like >4 minutes.

Real Poison
Minmatar
Stormlord Battleforce
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2009.05.01 05:56:00 - [21]
 

they need to stay at that high level?

i don't think so. if the prices don't come down in the next month it would be just fail from CCP.

spending that amount of effort to bring new toys in apocrypha and then locking out 99% of the playerbase because not everyone has tons of isk to spend for the latest and greatest stuff, that's just a waste.

and also i'm pretty sure those über-setups with BS-like dps, hic-like EHP, RECON-like stealth will get nerfed in the future.

Xequecal
Posted - 2009.05.01 07:14:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Real Poison
they need to stay at that high level?

i don't think so. if the prices don't come down in the next month it would be just fail from CCP.

spending that amount of effort to bring new toys in apocrypha and then locking out 99% of the playerbase because not everyone has tons of isk to spend for the latest and greatest stuff, that's just a waste.

and also i'm pretty sure those über-setups with BS-like dps, hic-like EHP, RECON-like stealth will get nerfed in the future.


Well, I'm not sure about future nerfs, but right now the ship is virtually impossible to stop in gatecamps, (just fit an Improved Cloak and use the MWD + Cloak trick) and is pretty much ungankable. It even gets an agility bonus, which combined with the huge web/scram range means you can't even effectively bait it. No BS or BC will ever scram it and it then easily warps out in a few seconds if any backup arrives.

Washell Olivaw
Posted - 2009.05.01 09:31:00 - [23]
 

It's only been 2 months. CCP is likely to give it another 4 to see where the price stabilizes.

Qual
Gallente
Cornexant Research
Posted - 2009.05.01 10:06:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Washell Olivaw
It's only been 2 months. CCP is likely to give it another 4 to see where the price stabilizes.


They will wait until prices are stable to do anything (whenever that happends). As it is right now, they are still dropping, though not in free fall anymore.

Daedricbob
Posted - 2009.05.01 11:12:00 - [25]
 

On a slightly off-topic note, a corpmate of mine has a tengu, and he describes it as 'The ****** magnet'

Amongst other things he's had a few people getting concorded in hi-sec as they try to suicide kill his ship, we assume so they can have a t3 on their killboard. At the price they are atm, it makes him not want to fly it much.ugh

Rivqua
Caldari
Omega Wing
Snatch Victory
Posted - 2009.05.01 14:13:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: EFT Warrior
The reason things are cheap is because T1 and T2 components can be mined, manufactured and assembled in empire, where the risk is low, the input you have to give it and the resulted output are predictable, and everyone feels "safe" making it. On the flip side you have W-Space, consisting of several thousand unknown uncharted systems that required an elite team to go in and make a profit from it, where the supply line is just as unstable and moving supplies can be difficult. Of course prices will be high because the results aren't predicable, aren't "safe" and can't be done with ease.


O really. Please point me to the safe and available cache of highsec Dyspro & Ferrogel moons, so I can have a few of them, and also show me in what highsec system I can anchor my reactors so I can react the moon minerals!

The T3 and T2 production chains are basically the same, with the only difference being, you can get all T3 by yourself, but you can only get all of T2 by yourself if you live in a 0.0 alliance that is controlling a few coveted regions.

Elora Danzik
Caldari
Idiots In Spaceships
Dead Terrorists
Posted - 2009.05.01 14:49:00 - [27]
 

Prices are market driven. Established.

Basics put out about why T1, and T2 so cheap.

Prices on T3 will never be competive unless CCP creates a way for pilots to "stablize" wormholes. Its difficult and dangerous to jump a wormhole. It could collapse on you at anytime and then you have to scan your way out, with the strong possibility of appearing in Delve with entered in Lonetrek.

If we could realibly get back to our base of operations, then W-space would be more of drawn. Some of the risk of production would be removed. And prices would fall.

Till that happens prices will floor at high level. There will be dips but over 100 million is probably going to be normal.

Shad Wrack
Posted - 2009.05.01 15:33:00 - [28]
 

Our corp has colonized a WH since the first weeks of Apoc. The logistical cost for running this WH operation is staggering. For the first month out there this game was much more like a job, and I got burned out. Since the patch, things have changed and I would bet that prices will start to come down a little. However, the base cost of production is high and that will keep final product price high.

And like another poster stated, WH is alot more risky than AFK empire mining. The players willing to take that risk should get paid.

James Hetfeild
Posted - 2009.05.01 18:22:00 - [29]
 

Market price will fall. Be patient

Tau Cabalander
Posted - 2009.05.01 18:44:00 - [30]
 

I see T3 as battleship class tank, with cruiser class DPS, at marauder class prices. They are very strange ships; I really don't know where they are supposed to fit in.


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