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Nebu Leah
Posted - 2009.03.17 20:10:00 - [1]
 

It has become common practice in 0.0 space for a few red grievers to come into a system, engage a ratter or miner, then go to a SS and cloak up. I have no problem with this tactic except they do this in the AM and I believe go to work for 8 hrs not allowing the system to "go about it's day". There needs to be a high slot fitting or a drone option to emit a (suggestion:)light particle or 0 damage spread to uncloak an AFK griever. One other method would be a 15 min cylce time on the cloak to make them uncloak, even for a few minutes, and give the system time to scan them down. Without a tactic available against a SS cloaking grievers, the rest of the pilots in the system are held at bay by a low level combat shipMad.

Your thoughts plz.

Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2009.03.17 20:21:00 - [2]
 

This is a non-issue.

You are the griefing yourself. Accept it, in 0.0 you might be attacked at any minute. Don't be stupid and let yourself be scared by players that aren't even playing. Don't look at local and you won't be bothered.

This is just a side-effect of local being an infallible intel tool, it has nothing to do with cloaking, and the solution should lie in altering local, and not altering cloaks

Robert0288
Caldari
R E D E M P T I O N
Black Star Alliance
Posted - 2009.03.17 20:25:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Robert0288 on 17/03/2009 20:25:44
First in yet another nerf cloaks thread.

Ok real answer, even though it would be very usefull from the defence standpoint. Who says those cloakers arn't actually at their computer watching you? Who says they arn't scanning your POSs or gathering intell.

If your having problems with a cloaked ship bring a friend with you for defence or set a trap, or have a cloaked falcon and a battle hulk for a comedy kill.

They arn't greifers they're playing the game, play back Twisted Evil

edit: crap ninja'd Evil or Very Mad

Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
Posted - 2009.03.17 20:35:00 - [4]
 

0.0 is not supposed to be safe. Stop whining and crying about how 0.0 is not highsec, and bring something to shoot back.

Xavier Sunder
Posted - 2009.03.17 21:19:00 - [5]
 

If you get within 2000m of a cloaked ship, it uncloaks. If they are afk, you can kill them and chew on their bones.

THX420
Posted - 2009.03.17 22:00:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Merdaneth
This is a non-issue.

You are the griefing yourself. Accept it, in 0.0 you might be attacked at any minute. Don't be stupid and let yourself be scared by players that aren't even playing. Don't look at local and you won't be bothered.

This is just a side-effect of local being an infallible intel tool, it has nothing to do with cloaking, and the solution should lie in altering local, and not altering cloaks
QFT.

I have often felt exactly the same as the OP but, in the end, there is no arguing with the cold hard logic of Merdaneth's statements and others like it.

Like everyone with more than a dozen functioning neurons and a couple of early-career noobdeaths to learn from, I use local for intel too, but it is kind of bogus to have such an omniscient intel tool available like that and, if it weren't there, then the (possibly) afk cloakers wouldn't freak you out - you would simply have to always be alert and prepared for the worst.

Local as it is currently implemented seems very un-Eve-like (ie; lame and unrealistic) to me and when it is finally removed (well, changed, at least) then New Eden will become a much scarier, much more realistic and much more exciting place.

Omara Otawan
Posted - 2009.03.17 22:02:00 - [7]
 

Its not griefing, its called economic warfare,

Jauqs
Caldari
Posted - 2009.03.18 12:53:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Robert0288
Edited by: Robert0288 on 17/03/2009 20:25:44
First in yet another nerf cloaks thread.


I don't think this is "yet another", the OP is the same poster on the other "nerf cloak" thread.

Whomever is the 'reds' they certainly know how to push her buttons, I suppose Razz

Traidor Disloyal
Private Nuisance
Segregati0n
Posted - 2009.03.18 14:20:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Nebu Leah
Your thoughts plz.

I have always been told when we "redistribute" the wealth of mission runners in High Sec that we should go out to 0.0 were the "real PvPers live". I think the OP is in the wrong part of space. I think he belongs in High Sec with the rest of us "no skill high sec hugging carebears".

Your thoughts?

Bklyn 1
Posted - 2009.03.18 14:21:00 - [10]
 

This has a simple solution I wish they would implement. Just tie cap consumption of the cloak into signature radius of the cloaked ship. That way a cloaked battleship could not stay cloaked indefinitely, yet a cloaked covops could stay cloaked forever. That way if the ship is a threat and the player isn't really playing, but at work or whatever, there is a way to take him down. If it's just a covops, it's no real threat anyway so let it stay cloaked. This would also make sense in rp terms since it would take much more cap to keep a huge ship totally invisible than a small stealthy one.

But no, nobody ever listens to me.

Santiago Fahahrri
Gallente
Galactic Geographic
Posted - 2009.03.18 14:21:00 - [11]
 

Please, please, please bring delayed local to 0.0 so these nerf-cloak whine threads stop.

Tara Wilde
Posted - 2009.03.18 14:37:00 - [12]
 

Maybe you should fit guns so you can fend off the hidden ships Very Happy

Mia Summersdaughter
Gallente
l Black Thorns l
Event Horizon.
Posted - 2009.03.18 15:43:00 - [13]
 

That might come as a bit of a surprise to you, but, nevertheless:
You know, thereīs those things in every system, tend to be called stargates i think, supposedly they bring you to OTHER solar systems!

So, if you are really that bothered by a red cloaker thats afk for hours, just change system and do your business anywhere else, itīs not like theres only one 0.0 system around Shocked

Dyre
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.03.18 21:03:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Nebu Leah
Without a tactic available against a SS cloaking grievers, the rest of the pilots in the system are held at bay by a low level combat shipMad.

Your thoughts plz.


I agree totally.

Nerf Local, that way the cloaking afker cannot scare you.

Omara Otawan
Posted - 2009.03.18 21:48:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Dyre

I agree totally.

Nerf Local, that way the cloaking afker cannot scare you.


Nooooooo, how do we know when there are ebil pvpers in system then, we have to log out immediately if that happens.

/sarcasm

Agreed, makes no sense that nullsec is more secure than empire anyways.

Novemb3r
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.03.18 23:29:00 - [16]
 

protip: if they are AFK they can't shoot you.

Nexus Kinnon
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.03.19 00:15:00 - [17]
 

Fit some heavy neuts to your raven and **** on them?

Guer
Posted - 2009.03.19 06:31:00 - [18]
 

cloaks are fine. stop whining.

Nebu Leah
Posted - 2009.03.19 16:40:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Bklyn 1
This has a simple solution I wish they would implement. Just tie cap consumption of the cloak into signature radius of the cloaked ship. That way a cloaked battleship could not stay cloaked indefinitely, yet a cloaked covops could stay cloaked forever. That way if the ship is a threat and the player isn't really playing, but at work or whatever, there is a way to take him down. If it's just a covops, it's no real threat anyway so let it stay cloaked. This would also make sense in rp terms since it would take much more cap to keep a huge ship totally invisible than a small stealthy one.

But no, nobody ever listens to me.

Nebu Leah
Posted - 2009.03.19 16:49:00 - [20]
 

Thank you all for your posts!! It is great to see so may different ideas. However I very much appreicate the above post. I cycle time penalty for larger military craft would make sence. It would allow for smaller covert ships to gather intel (great) and then make assault ships have a greater risk of useing AFK cloaking in a non-friendly system. I like that line of thinking. I do feel that the risk reward thinking should still be in affect. If you risk cloaking in enemy territory for a length of time, there should be a way to find you (even if it is hard and lengthy). The comments about fitting guns on your ships was a bit noobish, and the thoughts about having the reds in local scare me, is also a little questionable as I am looking for a way to hunt them down, not avoid them....Cool! Please keep the comments comming. I still would like a way to emmit a long range emmiter that shakes a cloak out (about 75 km), that way we can hunt cloakers...when they come back from their AFK grieving.....they awake in a nice clean medical facility.....LOL !Twisted Evil

Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2009.03.19 17:58:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Nebu Leah
The comments about fitting guns on your ships was a bit noobish, and the thoughts about having the reds in local scare me, is also a little questionable as I am looking for a way to hunt them down, not avoid them....Cool! Please keep the comments comming.


If you want to hunt them, don't start your comments with things like 'griefing'. Either you changed your mind.

I tried to explain you where, considering your first post, where your real problem lies, and that you are looking for a solution in the wrong place. Now please explain to me, what would you think about local being put into delayed mode?

Kavu
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.03.19 18:30:00 - [22]
 

but but i liek cloaks it lets me go to providence
and grief ratters and then hide from blobs :(


Amanda Mor
Gallente
Posted - 2009.03.19 18:50:00 - [23]
 

Can someone please explain to me how a thread that started as a (legitimate) complaint against carebear AFK cloakers got so quickly turned into a whine about nerfing local? How does this do anything to solve the issue of people being able to spend prolonged periods in 0.0 or lowsec without any risk to them at all by hiding like a ***** in a safe spot cloaked while at work or watching TV? The answer is that it doesn't, it just covers up the problem by creating 10 more of them. Idiots.

BTW, I don't have a problem with cloaking or the mechanics of it. If you want to sit in a system cloaked all day, that's fine, as long as you are actually within shouting distance of the screen and not at work or masturbating.

Unfortunately, it seems that cloaking causes computers to emit high energy particle streams directly into the brain of the user, resulting in a significant loss of reading comprehension, such that people who often use the cloaking technique will read a thread like this regardingONLY AFK CLOAKERS, and think that they're calling for an overall nerf of cloaking, when it is quite obvious that they are not. Either that or they think that having to press a button on their keyboard every 15 minutes (which is the most obvious solution to AFK CLOAKERS) is so beyond their capability that they wouldn't be able to handle it.

Whatever, the chances of CCP doing anything about it is slim to none, which is 100 times better than the chance they're ever going to get rid of local.

Nebu Leah
Posted - 2009.03.19 19:18:00 - [24]
 

Mandoreth, the comment about Cloak grievers was in reference to what they are called in-game, I for my part look to hunt them down, now hide. Howerver many indy pilots do need to stay safe from this tactic as the AFK cloakers do every 4-6 hrs come back to the comp to search the belts for prey, and then SS and cloak. The comment above is EXACTLY what I am talking about. A cycle time on the cloak would prevent the AFK cloakers from holding a space hostage but still allow the gaming cloakers the freedom to use that tactic (which I like and use often, but not AFK for hours). I feel that the local issue is not an issue at all. Intel about the system you are in is only partial anyway as you can't warp to or locate a person in local. If local was not available, the indy side would be crippled and the economy of many systems would be reduced, leading to less revenue and therefore less ships to PVP in....Sad. I want the killmails so the economy must flurish!!ugh

Great comments, post any other solutions to AFK players!!! Thanks all!

Imertu Solientai
Gallente
Posted - 2009.03.19 19:32:00 - [25]
 

Edited by: Imertu Solientai on 19/03/2009 21:38:29
MAKE THE VOICES GO AWAY!!! I can hear these grievers grieving me in my sleep in my mind oh my god make them go away. They talk to me... tell me to do things... kill people... burn stuff... I can't help it. They are making my life miserable. PLEASE CCP STOP THEM. I know they are all from BOB Kenzoku because they are the only ones with access to mind control technology! Please CCP ban them all before they make me kill any more people!!!!!!!!!!!11111111111111111111111111111111111111

EDIT: Just in case anyone doesn't get it, I'm pointing out that any threat an AFK player poses is entirely imaginary, and you can happily rat as much as you like while the person is AFK. Yes they can come back at any time and attack you, but if you are ratting in 0.0 you are watching your scanner and are ready to defend yourself right?

Grista
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2009.03.19 21:47:00 - [26]
 

The three best ways to deal with semi-afk cloaking hostiles:

1. Don't give them kills, and they will eventually hunt elsewhere
2. Move to another system
3. Don't give them kills, and they will eventually hunt elsewhere

Omara Otawan
Posted - 2009.03.19 22:09:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Omara Otawan on 19/03/2009 22:14:31
Originally by: Amanda Mor
Can someone please explain to me how a thread that started as a (legitimate) complaint against carebear AFK cloakers got so quickly turned into a whine about nerfing local? How does this do anything to solve the issue of people being able to spend prolonged periods in 0.0 or lowsec without any risk to them at all by hiding like a ***** in a safe spot cloaked while at work or watching TV? The answer is that it doesn't, it just covers up the problem by creating 10 more of them. Idiots.



You dont seem to get the point. Its not that its tons of fun sitting around cloaked all day, its just a necessity, that style of play does not work without.

Why? Because most people are cowards that either dont do a thing if a single neutral is in local, log off immediately, or if they do something its calling in a megablob.

Believe it or not, some people (quite a lot I'd guess) actually are on their screen, watching traffic, observing possible targets behavior and planning their next move, or waiting for their opportunity.

Only the target behavior (logoffski, docking, megablob) makes it necessary to have them getting used to your presence by staying permalogged. If it wasnt needed I'd quite sure not do it as I got to pay for the electricity and wearing my hardware down, but sadly it is.

Its so much different with delayed local though, if you ever go to pvp in wormhole systems with a cloaky ship, you'll see how ridiculous the local instaintel is.


Edit: if not delayed local, then give cov ops bonused ships an extra module to supress the subspace communication beacon or whatever its called and stay invisible in local.

Atraxerxes
Caldari
22nd Black Rise Defensive Unit
OWN Alliance
Posted - 2009.03.19 23:08:00 - [28]
 

I can't believe I wasted time reading this post.

sigh...


Dracoknight
Posted - 2009.03.20 08:15:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Atraxerxes
I can't believe I wasted time reading this post.

sigh...




Thats makes two of us...

Critta
Black Omega Security
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.03.20 10:20:00 - [30]
 

There's plenty of systems in eve dude. Why do you have to stay in the system with the cloaker?


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