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Smokeyblood
Posted - 2009.03.03 01:04:00 - [1]
 

Not asking for secrets as obviously no one wants to give theirs away.

But in general how do you afford this? normal day i am assuming can be pretty expensive if say i was flying a phobos t2 fitted and with +5's in my head.

Most people seem fine losing all this in one day, this would ruin me and leave me a month behind. Currently my ONLY source of income is l4 missions on a empire alt

Mistress Frome
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.03.03 01:37:00 - [2]
 

Leave a jump clone in wherever you run missions and don't die with expensive implants in your head.

Lancer Maelstorm
Amarr
Ministry of War
Posted - 2009.03.03 02:59:00 - [3]
 

+3 implants (Cheaper then +5)
Various 3% implants (some are less then 5m to buy)
T2 fit BC work well.

The biggest thing is knowing your battles and making sure you have scouts.
The blob WILL come, so be aware of where they are and get ready to gtfo.


Santiago Fahahrri
Gallente
Galactic Geographic
Posted - 2009.03.03 03:12:00 - [4]
 

Pick your fights; don't let them pick you.

Use 0.0 to make ISK between fights - there are rats and salvage and anamolies and signatures all around.

Zitts
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.03.03 04:12:00 - [5]
 

Don't forget that 0.0 space is significantly more profitable than empire, as it should be but probably isn't proportionately more profitable but that's a different thread.

You don't die every time you use a ship and in 0.0 space intel is a valuable commodity. All fleets are scouted and have a pretty good idea of what they can and cannot engage. Because of this a lot of effort in 0 space is made to surprise the enemy and trick them into fighting you. Baiting and using other tactics to trick enemies to fight you are pretty common. That said people usually trickle into using bigger more expensive ships and rarely use implants for pvping, although depending on the situation there isn't a high chance of getting podded.

If you start out flying cheap cruisers and frigates you can afford to get a few battleships lined up so that when the time comes you aren't broken by the loss of one ship.. and so on. This is how it typically works but 0 space wouldn't be 0 space and eve eve if losing assets didn't hurt. That's the point really. If you don't live in 0 space though I highly recommend it as I think you are missing out on a lot of what this game was meant to be. I'm actually pretty surprised that so many people live solely in Empire.

Chssmius
legio immortalorum
United Front Alliance
Posted - 2009.03.03 05:24:00 - [6]
 

Some useful advice so far.

Mere grams of preparation and prevention are worth kilos of cure.

It is really very simple, manage your risk well and you will do well.

Don't take that rigged BS out ratting when the un-rigged BC will do just as well.

Don't fit expensive implants, +3's are good enough if you are going to be risking your neck on a day to day basis.

Make multiple safe spots in every system you frequent, make bookmarks near gates so you have the option of checking the gate without committing if you find you are trapped in a system. Make insta-warps on all stations and gates you might frequent.

Fly fast and agile ships whenever possible, it may very well save you.

Pay attention to intel channels on info for possible enemy gangs and gate camps.

Pay attention to local, it WILL save you heartache frequently.

Keep your scanner up if you know there are enemies in local. At the very least it can give you a few seconds of warning and an idea of what is incoming before it land on your head(ships that warp while cloaked aside).

If you are not planing on engaging someone then fit appropriately. For example if you are ratting in a Drake, use that spare high slot for a cloak. The hit to scan res may suck, but losing your ship will suck even more.

Lastly, stay pre-aligned to something whenever possible.

When you fly in a gang or fleet know who you are flying with, this allows you to better fill a role in a gang or fleet. HOWEVER, some unscrupulous individuals are not above backstabbing the unwary and this is another reason to know who you are flying with.

Lastly, be aware of all that is going on in all parts of a fight, if at all possible(some fleet battles can be just crazy). Don't get tunnel vision just because you have a juicy target in structure, or because you just alphaed his "tank."


That is unless you are a billionaire many times over and just drowning in spare parts, rigs, ships, and implants(can I have some? pretty please?).

crockett EXE
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2009.03.03 07:57:00 - [7]
 

Those of you that suggest ratting in 0.0, are there any places that are neutral friendly for guys in small corps?

I've ventured into 0.0 once just to see what all the hoopla was about. I saw the rats have nice bounties, but what do you do with the loot? It seems there aren't many stations out there, at least not like in hi/low sec. Do you just rat for the bounties?

Saaya Illirie
Caldari
Absinthe Brothers
Posted - 2009.03.03 08:40:00 - [8]
 

Tips I'd give:

1. Always know who the FC is on any op, and ensure he knows his stuff. If he doesn't then bring something crappy like an ewar caracal. If he's good, bring your awesome ship. You might want to exchange your +5's for a +3's or +4's clone for combat, while its a slight hit, if you get a massive all-hands defense op you will probably want a clone you don't mind losing. (though blobs tend to be safer for pods because everyone should be too busy following FC commands to shoot you before you warp)

2. Never fly your 0.0 money maker ship in PVP, NEVER I DON'T CARE HOW DESPERATE THEY ARE FOR X's. Your ratter ship should always be safe, if you're decent and have some good chains you can earn 30 mil in 2 hours of ratting provided you're not ratting somewhere crappy like Providence. You lose your ship able to give you this steady source of income, you will encounter a major setback especially if the 0.0 market is crap. It's also a good idea to log out in space, and not in a Station, as you won't end up being station camped.

3. Don't underestimate T1 cruisers or assault frigates for pvp. HACs are pricy, and BS are stupid if you aren't blobbing. A glass cannon T1 cruiser can put out a surprising amount of dps or ewar support (don't try to buffer tank though, you won't get higher than 25k EHP most likely), and an Assault Frigate is a nice way to pew pew while remaining a relatively low priority target for enemy FC's.

4. Take advantage of radar sites if you know how to scan. My corpers tell me these are often lucrative.

5. Multiple L4 R&D Agents are quite good for money making alts. It doesn't take hardly any real time investment beyond a second client to train a character, and produces materials which sell quite well. Conversely, you can create a trade alt and turn a profit with buy/sell orders. Neither of these require an intense investment in time, though they do require some initial investment.

6. Sell faction mods you receive from faction rats in empire. You might also decide to scan for cosmic anomalies with the ship scanner and hope for an easy one. There's a chance for a faction rat at the end. If you're in NPC Space (Curse, Venal, Stain, select areas of Fountain......... Delve) you will be in ratting heaven.

7. Don't underestimate your fellow residents wallets. Don't be afraid to be the stingy bastard hawking goods on the market for 25% higher than empire. If everyone else is losing ships like you think they are, they'll buy your stuff.

Smokeyblood
Posted - 2009.03.03 08:50:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Smokeyblood on 03/03/2009 08:52:15
So Ratting is the way to make the money? thats my big issue currently, i can't figure out the proper way to make money.

My L4 Raven alt takes probably a day to make 30m

I want to get into production on my alt but can't get my head around economics really.

Lugalzagezi666
Posted - 2009.03.03 10:15:00 - [10]
 

How to afford 0.0 pvp:

Minimise your loses
- use jumpclones
- use cheaper implants /+3,+4/ and use only 2 of them for yor current training plan /per+will.../
- use cheaper hardwirings /+3% are cheap and good/
- try to minimalise the chance of being podded Very Happy /fly long range or very fast ships, if you know you are going to die, try to get out of bubble.../
- use insurable /battlecruisers are fine/ or cheap /inty, af.../ ships
- use intel channel, local, scanner, safespots

Increase your income /im not counting in making various trade, science, missioning... alts - but it can be very good way to earn money/
- ratting - easiest way of making money in 0.0, depending on your ship, truesec, number of belts and safety of the system you can earn much more money just from bounties /40m+ per hour isnt problem in pirate sovereignity system/ than from lvl4s /bounties,loot and lp/, the biggest problem is, that you are often disrupted by roaming gangs
Originally by: Chssmius
Don't take that rigged BS out ratting when the un-rigged BC will do just as well.

- if you really want to earn isk fast, you want as much dps as possible = battleship - its almost impossible to catch aligned bs, just make bookmarks between the belts so you can be aligned to your safespot and next belt
- faction hunting - probably even more lucrative than ratting, most profitable right after downtime /use fast aligning and fast warping ship/ - if you dont have carrier/jf for logistics it can be pain to bring all those faction/officer items to empire Very Happy
- plexing - dont have much experience here, but i heard it can be very profitable - and if you can fly gallente hacs, you got very good ship for it

Fastbikkel
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E
Posted - 2009.03.03 11:46:00 - [11]
 

I make my money doing :

- level 4 missions in empire
- selling loot/salvage/drugs/ anything i can get from missions
- speculating (buying things and then reselling them for a higher price)

Try to prevent losing money by :

- not flying too expensive ships if a cheaper model can do the same job. (you can decide which ships apply, for me ishtar and hyperion are excellent examples of overpriced ships)
- thinking straight in 0.0, if something looks like a trap, it usually is. I've saved myself and ship many times with simple logic, as written before, decide the battle, don't let them decide for you.

These are just a few examples.

Xennith
Imperial Logistics and Supply
Posted - 2009.03.03 13:15:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: crockett EXE
Those of you that suggest ratting in 0.0, are there any places that are neutral friendly for guys in small corps?

I've ventured into 0.0 once just to see what all the hoopla was about. I saw the rats have nice bounties, but what do you do with the loot? It seems there aren't many stations out there, at least not like in hi/low sec. Do you just rat for the bounties?


providence is a NRDS area, so the major entities in that region will let you rat in peace, dock at their stations to sell your loot (and there are a lot of stations in providence) and you might even get to participate in a little pvp every now and then.

but yes, general rule of thumb is that you chain spawns to get decent bounties and then just farm them.

Kavu
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.03.03 17:22:00 - [13]
 

i like providence
its fuuuny

Saaya Illirie
Caldari
Absinthe Brothers
Posted - 2009.03.03 17:54:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Xennith
Originally by: crockett EXE
Those of you that suggest ratting in 0.0, are there any places that are neutral friendly for guys in small corps?

I've ventured into 0.0 once just to see what all the hoopla was about. I saw the rats have nice bounties, but what do you do with the loot? It seems there aren't many stations out there, at least not like in hi/low sec. Do you just rat for the bounties?


providence is a NRDS area, so the major entities in that region will let you rat in peace, dock at their stations to sell your loot (and there are a lot of stations in providence) and you might even get to participate in a little pvp every now and then.

but yes, general rule of thumb is that you chain spawns to get decent bounties and then just farm them.


lol Says the Ushra'Khan!! Oh man that's rich! Yes, Providence is the best baby step you will ever make into 0.0, but don't be deluded. The rest of 0.0 is entirely different than Providence. And watch out for the guy above, him and his kind like to pew pew in Providence!

Other than going to Providence, you could look into joining Stain/Venal/Curse/Syndicate alliances. The Stain-based alliances are a bit bigger and more powerful and stretch out to Esoteria as well, but don't let that fool you they fight in big wars too. Most Curse-based alliances are rookies getting their feet wet in the baby pool, same with Syndicate (though some are good like Rote Kapelle and Cry Havoc). And I don't know much about Venal.

When in doubt, hang out in the recruitment channel. If they advertise 0.0; ask them where. If they say Providence, ask yourself if you're willing to experience a bit of a crappy life for a while. If they say somewhere else, ask where, use the star map to check sovereignty there...

As for ratting, don't use a Raven. Use a HAC or something cruiser-sized, they're more mobile and able to leave, deal enough dps, and it's not like 0.0 rats require you to be able to tank 800 dps anyways.

Kazlith
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2009.03.03 18:16:00 - [15]
 

Trading tbh, best way to gen isk in this game. Well scamming too but lots of people get arsey about scammers so that can bite you in the arse when it comes to moving corps or whatever.

Oh and I don't know if you are pvp'ing with full implant sets? That's pretty stupid if you are, get jump clones sorted and setup various clones with the two implants that match skills primary and secondary. Should be able to afford to use +4's without much trouble unless your flying a dictor or soemthing else suicidal.

Helldrek Demonstar
The Fallen Angels Unit
Posted - 2009.03.03 18:19:00 - [16]
 

+4s not +5s in 0.0

YARRRR!!

FistCanBeAVerb
Recycling and Recovery
Posted - 2009.03.03 19:35:00 - [17]
 

Don't fly what you can't afford to lose. You should do this in empire as well due to the chances of being suicide ganked, but never in PVP in 0.0 should you ever fly anything you can't afford to lose. That ship could be dead the second you undock/logon. If you are flying some special snowflake ship, you WILL be called primary. There is nothing people want on their killboard more than a Navy Raven or faction battleship, except for a Titan. Just yesterday goons blew up an officer fit Machariel worth 2 billion easy. I bet he's still crying.

Intel is important. Pay attention to local. If hostiles enter, safespot and cloak.

Mining is pretty good in NPC 0.0, I know syndicate had plenty of crokite and arkonor. Same rules - watch locale, stay aligned, safespot and cloak if hostiles enter local.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2009.03.03 23:45:00 - [18]
 

1 day ratting in 0.0 is 100 mil easy
If you are good or lucky - 200+ mil easy

Once you become comfortable with operating in 0.0, you'll never have money problems.

Saaya Illirie
Caldari
Absinthe Brothers
Posted - 2009.03.03 23:57:00 - [19]
 

Really depends on time commitment... ratting makes the game boring if you do it too much... good idea is to binge rat twice a week and earn half a bil, spend the rest of the week turning it into pretty fireworks.

Arpad Elo
Posted - 2009.03.04 15:58:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Chssmius
Make insta-warps on all gates you might frequent.


Hey, just curious here... do you come out of a gate with a given orientation every time? Like, I thought that everyone gets placed around a gate randomly, so how would an insta-warp from a gate help? Is it just a reduction in align time, rather than a "true" insta-warp out of a station?

Arpad Elo
Posted - 2009.03.04 16:31:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Lugalzagezi666
just make bookmarks between the belts so you can be aligned to your safespot and next belt


I don't understand the purpose of this... is it to misdirect opponent to warping to the belt instead of dropping a probe?

Is it just so that you will be aligned properly to the safe spot? (because, can't you just approach a safe spot and/or warp to 0, then stop warp, in order to align?)

thatboydc
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.03.04 16:48:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: thatboydc on 04/03/2009 16:48:59
You can't align to a safespot, but you can align to a celestial object. If the object is past the safespot, it lets you align to that safespot.

Xennith
Imperial Logistics and Supply
Posted - 2009.03.04 19:05:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Arpad Elo
Originally by: Lugalzagezi666
just make bookmarks between the belts so you can be aligned to your safespot and next belt


I don't understand the purpose of this... is it to misdirect opponent to warping to the belt instead of dropping a probe?

Is it just so that you will be aligned properly to the safe spot? (because, can't you just approach a safe spot and/or warp to 0, then stop warp, in order to align?)


if i enter a belt and see a ratter warp off in the direction of the next belt, ill warp to the next belt and hope to catch him at 0 there. if you actually drop out of warp in the middle of nowhere, ive just lost you and you have time to hide or get out of system (jumping into my support hopefully).

Dethuss
Gallente
The Littlest Pwny
Posted - 2009.03.05 07:59:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Kazlith
Trading tbh, best way to gen isk in this game. Well scamming too but lots of people get arsey about scammers so that can bite you in the arse when it comes to moving corps or whatever.

Oh and I don't know if you are pvp'ing with full implant sets? That's pretty stupid if you are, get jump clones sorted and setup various clones with the two implants that match skills primary and secondary. Should be able to afford to use +4's without much trouble unless your flying a dictor or soemthing else suicidal.



Ive always wanted to get into trading but no clue how.


 

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