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Axeil
Posted - 2009.02.21 17:17:00 - [1]
 

For me its:
Gallente: America/UK....both countries value liberty and ect..i guess :P

Minmatar: The black race...blacks were enslaved and still are in some places and are very tribal like the mini..

Amarr: Muslims/ Mideastern(im not being stereotypical) in modern times Muslims take their religion very seriously and have strict rules like the ammar. Hey lol even the word amarr is Arabic! HAHA

LAST but not least! Caldari: I don't know about this one. Maybe Russia or even Iran due to their militaristic state nature...

Whats your opinion....im really sure i got the Gallente and Amarr race good with modern times..i mean they have almost exact matches X)

Nikita Alterana
Kumiho's Smile
Posted - 2009.02.21 17:34:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Nikita Alterana on 21/02/2009 17:34:40
I'm pretty sure the Caldari is a better example of 'our culture, right now, in space'


and the Gallente are obviously the french

Edouard Creeslar
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2009.02.21 17:43:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Edouard Creeslar on 21/02/2009 17:44:05
I love these discussions..

Gallente: French, socialist culture

Minmatar: Native Americans/African: The tribal nature of the Minnies based on descriptions is closer to that of the Native American of the past.

Amarr: Old Testiment Jews / Crusade era Catholic and Muslim. Combine these together and you get a solid feel for the Amarr culture.

Caldari: This one is the broadest with the work ethic and corporate loyalty coming from Japanese culture, the economic model close to the US and the militant mindset very similiar to current Israel in the almost parinoid need to defned itself.

While not really modern examples, I feel they offer the best representation.

Just noticed this is in the way wrong forum, can a moderater move this?

Stitcher
Caldari
Posted - 2009.02.21 18:11:00 - [4]
 

I hate to be a rules (1930s German government) over this, but this section of the boards is 100% in-character interaction only. These discussions are better suited to EVE Fiction.

CCP Mitnal


C C P
Posted - 2009.02.21 19:40:00 - [5]
 

Moved to EVE Fiction.

Aria Jenneth
Caldari
Kumiho's Smile
Posted - 2009.02.21 20:13:00 - [6]
 

Gallente: French democracy and culture + present-day American presumption. The arrogant streak can really come from either / both.

Amarr: Christian crusaders + the Roman Empire. The dynamic can also be found in a good deal of Imperial Europe (empire after empire after). Conquest for the victims' own good and the conqueror's personal enrichment.

Minmatar: Pick a tribal society. Any tribal society. Actually, pick several, then mix. Toss in a generous handful of the culture of grievance that gives rise to jihadi sentiments, mixed with the sort of governmental / infrastructure problems typical of "developing" nations. Simmer.

Caldari: One part Russian, one part Japanese, one part Chinese. The kind of government they have has, to my knowledge, never been tried: it's laissez faire economics on steroids, corporate feudalism. The corporate power structure is only really restrained by cultural norms (and the dangers of upsetting a people deeply dedicated to its culture that is apt to lose all respect for any ruler that doesn't share said preoccupation). The kind of culture they have, on the other hand, is quintessentially East Asian (collectivist, family-oriented, deeply concerned with its own internal harmony) with maybe a dose of Russian fatalism.

Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift
Posted - 2009.02.22 01:48:00 - [7]
 

For Minmatar, don't forget all the connections to the Nordic tribes, Vikings, etc.

Arnulf Ogunkoya
Minmatar
The Causality
Electus Matari
Posted - 2009.02.22 03:12:00 - [8]
 

Non-Achuran Caldari seem to have more than a little Finnish influences judging by the names.

The Amarr are said to be descended from a heretical Catholic sect that sought a new home in New Eden.


Vikarion
Caldari
State Trade Consortium
Posted - 2009.02.22 04:06:00 - [9]
 

I've always felt that the Caldari were/are an American/Japanese fusion. Remember that they tend to be the most "meddlesome" empire, and the economic system is closest to the U.S.

In addition, add the fact that they had a war for independence from a larger empire over economic reasons (!), have the highest technological level, and are very patriotic/violent, and there is far more to suggest the Japanese/American fusion than the Russian/Chinese/Japanese one.

Aria Jenneth
Caldari
Kumiho's Smile
Posted - 2009.02.22 04:48:00 - [10]
 

Hrm.

Well, actually, I don't think I can agree, Vikarion. The U.S. has had a love affair with deregulation, but it's still a long, long way from the sort of (pretty much literal) corporate feudalism the Caldari practice. And meddlesomeness is not a title to which Americans alone can lay claim (particularly considering CCP's penchant for borrowing cultural traits from multiple eras).

The ethnic Caldari also had an empire and an ethnic identity (well, two) before they signed up with the Federation. The United States has no such "separate identity" to associate itself with; the U.S. hasn't exactly been getting back to its Native American roots.

And then there's the collectivism, which seems utterly central.

We Americans, as a people, have some serious rebellion nostalgia that the Caldari show very little of. We're individualistic and tend to idealize self-reliance (and idealism itself), the virtues of rebels and pioneers.

The Chinese, by contrast, historically have viewed their nation as the "Middle Kingdom," the center of the world, and have taken relatively little interest in what happened outside (the Opium War's outcome came as something of a shock, a humiliation they apparently still haven't culturally "gotten over"). They're relatively insular and self-concerned, and, while respectful of authority among their own, resent any pressure from outsiders.

The Japanese do echo some of this, but the resemblance is not quite so intense (except among the most conservative, maybe-- "Land of the Gods" and all that).

Anyhow, I think you've got a couple interesting similarities there between Caldari and Americans, but it also seems to me that they're traits that are more common throughout the world and throughout history than you seem to think.

Omicron 110
Posted - 2009.02.22 08:35:00 - [11]
 

where are the aussies!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nur AlHuda
Amarr
Callide Vulpis
Posted - 2009.02.23 11:55:00 - [12]
 

Amarr - Catholic/Muslim/Mongolian (names and the faith)
Caldari - American/German/Japan/
Gallente - France/Italy/ North European Countries
Minmatar - Cubans, Africans, Native Americans

Carcosa Hali
True Slave Foundations
Posted - 2009.02.23 16:00:00 - [13]
 


Sansha's Nation = Israel (from Hali's point of view)

Ofcourse allegories can be read into just about anything. But I rather like that MMO's, as a growing form of mass entertainment, don't seem to be given to making statements quite so much as other forms are.

I wonder how that's going to change over time...

Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift
Posted - 2009.02.23 16:32:00 - [14]
 

Remember in all of this that none of the factions are direct lifts from RL, but (at best) fusion of several bits together, as in the Caldari Finnish-Japanese traits and the Minmatar Nordic-African-Maori (?) traits.

Jasuur Ibn'alnil
Posted - 2009.02.23 20:58:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Casiella Truza
For Minmatar, don't forget all the connections to the Nordic tribes, Vikings, etc.


Never seen this backed-up in anything but the ship names really.

This discussion has been repeated over and over but i'll throw in my opinions on the subject.

Gallente - French social values with an Anglo/American approach to foreign policy. The desire to spread democracy, forcefully if need be, is very reminiscent of Neo-Conservative America.

Amarr - Linguistically and culturally, Byzantine Empire in the medieval period. Foreign policy wise, take your pick of an expansive fundamentalist Theocracy, Persia/Iran would be the closest approximation. The slave aspect is highly medieval-Middle east.

Caldari - China without the centralised government. Highly spiritual and determined population, hyper anarcho-capitalism. Agree with Aria essentially.

Minmatar - There are no obvious real world equivalent as the Sebiestor and Brutor are about as far apart as you can get. The Brutor are obviously based on the militaristic african tribes such as the Zulu. Sebiestor could possibly be the Scandinavian link, seeing as they are meant to be the Engineers of the tribe and as such would build and name the ships. Vherokior seem to be an obvious lift of Hindu Indians, the point that most of them are highly spiritual shopkeepers would seem to indicate that.

As for me, Thukker have always seemed to owe a lot to the Bedouin. Use of the word 'Caravan' is an obvious reference and the penchant for smuggling and mercenary work is just bedouin all over.



Faraelle Brightman
Gallente
Eleutherian Guard
Posted - 2009.02.24 09:20:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Jasuur Ibn'alnil
[Vherokior seem to be an obvious lift of Hindu Indians, the point that most of them are highly spiritual shopkeepers would seem to indicate that.




This distinction has allready been assigned to the Intaki by players a long while ago and it's stuck. Jin-Mei are the closest direct lifting of the militiristic and hierarchy aspects of Chinese culture where Achura embodies the spiritulist and isolationist side. Vherokior's backstory has them wandering a long time in a (presumably desert) wasteland and they are the main shamans of the Minmater, take that as you will.

If someone runs eve-search on some expression of this topic combined with "chinese server" you'll find the topic talking about the descriptions there, which are much more explicit about ancient nationalities (though can not be taken completely as cannon for the English storyline.)

Rachel Silverside
Caldari
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2009.02.25 05:40:00 - [17]
 

sleepers= aussies all im gonna say

Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift
Posted - 2009.02.26 03:12:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Jasuur Ibn'alnil
Originally by: Casiella Truza
For Minmatar, don't forget all the connections to the Nordic tribes, Vikings, etc.


Never seen this backed-up in anything but the ship names really.



Also the names of many of the star systems in Minmatar space...

Zan Maruke
1st Khanid Rifles
Posted - 2009.02.26 21:27:00 - [19]
 

Khanid - Mongolians but not just the warrior aspect but the innovators as well. Mongolians, because they controlled the Silk Road (the trade route between Amarr and the other Empires in our setting, China and the Near East historically), encountered many cultures and adopted all sorts of practices that revolutionized trade and banking among other things. Culturally they were fairly flexible when religion came into the picture as well.

SadisticSavior
Caldari
Posted - 2009.02.27 16:43:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: SadisticSavior on 28/02/2009 03:45:14


Amarr - Naz:s meet Catholicism. People like to say the Caldari are fascist, but I think it applies more to the Amarr. (Why is Naz: a censored word??)

Minmatar - Any oppressed race would be an analog to the Minmatar. While black slaves might come immediately to mind, I can also see parallels with the Jews and American Indians.

Caldari - I originally envisioned them as American (High technology, very greedy, very violent, very ambitious). But on a thread like this one a long time ago someone said they are more like the Japanese (Loyalty to the corporation over everything else...including democracy). Especially since they used to be a part of Gallente but rebelled (as America rebelled from the Old world of Europe). But given that American ideology is hyper-democratic, I have to agree with the Lore now. I'd say Japan. The Zaibatsu parallel seems pretty obvious.

Gallente - I would say the EU...and maybe America given the Caldari stuff above. But the Fruity liberalism of the Gallente suggests EU to me more than America.


SadisticSavior
Caldari
Posted - 2009.02.27 16:49:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: SadisticSavior on 27/02/2009 16:52:34
Quote:
Gallente - French social values with an Anglo/American approach to foreign policy. The desire to spread democracy, forcefully if need be, is very reminiscent of Neo-Conservative America.

I haven't gotten that impression from what I've read, but as a real life neocon, I'd love to see the Gallente go in that direction...


Quote:
I've always felt that the Caldari were/are an American/Japanese fusion. Remember that they tend to be the most "meddlesome" empire, and the economic system is closest to the U.S.

Yeah, but the Gallente are described as meddlesome too.


Stitcher
Caldari
Posted - 2009.02.28 02:23:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Stitcher on 28/02/2009 02:24:12
The thing is that America as a nation tends to glorify the individual - the American celebrity culture is insanely entrenched and powerful.

Honestly, I reckon that the USA is most closely reflected in the Gallente - "Fierce defenders of democracy and liberty" and all that, plus a powerful social leaning towards individual liberty, celebrity culture, cultural spread and consumerism. Borrow a healthy dollop of French Revolution extremism and a twist of Indian work ethic and you're almost there.

The Caldari are more a combination of Chinese social values, Japanese corporate culture and European military philosophy, IMO.

Dex Nederland
Caldari
Lai Dai Infinity Systems
Posted - 2009.02.28 06:01:00 - [23]
 

The Gallente/Caldari culture is an interesting one.

Gallente most definitely draws from liberal western culture.

Caldari culture draws heavily on stylized cyberpunk East-meets-West culture of Japan and urban China. Taking a look at the big picture of Eve, the Caldari, like China, Korea, & Japan, have been heavily influenced in their recent past by their interactions with liberal western culture. That influence is likely what many players are seeing when they look at the Caldari and see the western influence; they are seeing the Gallente influence.

Tra' Shaz
Gallente
manic-recession
Posted - 2009.02.28 19:35:00 - [24]
 

Ancient times*

Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift
Posted - 2009.03.02 01:29:00 - [25]
 

Is it just me, or do Jin-Mei have a distinct East Asian flavor? Somewhere between Chinese and Japanese, I think.

Casiella Truza
Ecliptic Rift
Posted - 2009.03.02 01:35:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Casiella Truza on 02/03/2009 01:35:40

Ravin Talmash
Posted - 2009.03.02 09:26:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Casiella Truza
Is it just me, or do Jin-Mei have a distinct East Asian flavor? Somewhere between Chinese and Japanese, I think.


Ha.

Mandi'boboo Zapelne
Posted - 2009.03.02 09:56:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Casiella Truza
Remember in all of this that none of the factions are direct lifts from RL, but (at best) fusion of several bits together, as in the Caldari Finnish-Japanese traits and the Minmatar Nordic-African-Maori (?) traits.


You are soo right there about the Caldari a funny combination of Finnish and Japanese traits, but I have to leave some support to those that see some other traits as well. The megacorp structures is something you can find in many places though so we should not put too much emphasis on that it is so.

And cudos that you noted the somewhat funny combination of Scandinavian and Maori in the Minmatar.
Many Scandinavians see familiar things in in Minnies, as mentioned in Ships and Starnames.


Originally by: Casiella Truza
Is it just me, or do Jin-Mei have a distinct East Asian flavor? Somewhere between Chinese and Japanese, I think.


You are absolutely right, the new races for all 4 sides are generic asians, and they were introduced when CCP added a Chinese server for the game. Sp that chinese players would feel familiar.



Daphne Mezereum
Caldari
Posted - 2009.03.02 13:47:00 - [29]
 

Edited by: Daphne Mezereum on 02/03/2009 13:48:11
I am a noob, but my hobbies include social/cultural antrophology and history, so I'll add thoughts.

For a through analysis, we need to examine the names, the religion, the social structure, the economic structure, and the electoral structure.

My observations are based on some chronicles and ingame info, and are not to be taken as a true and only analysis.

I'll start with the Amarr Empire and its offshots.

A/1, Amarr Empire

Names: Their names have a Middle Eastern/Middle Eastern fiction vibe, with a bit of early christian and semitic thrown into the mix.


Religion
: This leads many to assume that their religion is something like Islam, but this assumption is false. The fact that they have a large religious institution with a titular, appointed-by-god figurehead, the equality of church are much more akin to early (8-12th century) western European church than even Calpihate-era muslims. The lack of sects and such further underlines this. I am going to add slavekeeping to this section, as the universal slaveholding was more a thing for early christian societies, than muslim ones, particularly as the Minmatar slaves are not military servicemen.

Social order
: A rather rigid, "backwards" social order with very clear-cut lines reinforced by holy edicts and such, a society that is almost alien to the concept of "development", and one that has been in stagnation of centuries. On the other hand, it also evokes a feeling of a sleeping giant, a people ready to be whipped into frenzy once again and to claim the stars that are their right by god. (Think Centautri of B5 here).
All in all, the aforementioned "byzantine" adjective applies very well, but in both meanings. Amarr right now is a large, and unwieldy piece of mess, but in the right hands (the new empress seems to be a copy of a Komenid), it could make New Eden tremble.

Economic structure
: A strongly interventionist, protectionist economy, probably. Not much information on this one.

Electoral process
: Again, a medievalesque electorate of five "Great Houses", a semi-hereditary position on and around the throne, and an etched-into-stone system of checks against imperial authority. A version of the Holy Roman Empire.

A/2


Ammatar Mandate
: Not much to add, really, the former salves who have become loyal to their owners and not their kin, rewarded with semi-autonomy. Probably trying to out-amarr the amarr on one hand, and opening up a bit on the other. Think the berber/slav slave warrior cities of Al-Andalus for a historical parallel.

A/3

Khanid Kingdom: Despite being an offshot of the Amarr Empire, they are quite un-amarr even in name. Some agents have distinctly caldariesque names, suggesting (as their info states) a mixing of cluture and genepool between the two factions.

I do not know much about them, tbh, but all in all they seem like a "westernized" version of the Empire, and, as someone has mentioned, they have the traits of a typical "trade route people", being a rather bizarre cultural mix.

The rest are to follow, got to study.

Kazlith
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2009.03.02 18:09:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Kazlith on 02/03/2009 18:18:02
Originally by: Jasuur Ibn'alnil

As for me, Thukker have always seemed to owe a lot to the Bedouin. Use of the word 'Caravan' is an obvious reference and the penchant for smuggling and mercenary work is just bedouin all over.



Thukker tribe strike me as simply space pikeys tbh. I can't imagine any Brit reading that in-game description and not picturing pikeys.

Edit: For amarrian religion - reading the time line clearly points to a new branch of catholicism. Middle eastern flavoured names do not imediatley point to islam - the old testiment remember, is riddled with them, many amarr agents have names seemingly taken from this like Eraz and so forth.

They strike me as very much along the same lines as the fire and brimstone era of christianity.


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