| Author |
Topic |
Moranti Patron |
Posted - 2008.09.30 12:57:00 - [ 151]
Just a quick comment.
Thank you.
Every step you take makes our fun that much more.
Now sell some of the tech, and make some extra money, and lower our fees... Love ya Devs!
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Tashia Rizti
KIITH S0BAN
|
Posted - 2008.09.30 13:37:00 - [ 152]
I don't normally post on dev blogs, but it was nice to see some information on what is being done on the tech side. I Find it very interesting (and so does many others it seems!) keep them coming please!  |
Bartholomeus Crane
Gallente
The Crane Family
|
Posted - 2008.09.30 14:39:00 - [ 153]
 Originally by: Rashmika Clavain
So have CCP created a new network protocol here or have I misunderstood how StacklessIO works?
Define network protocol? Seriously though, I think CCP developed a new and better way of using the existing network protocols they use. Your client is still talking to the server though TCP/IP. |
Haniblecter Teg
F.R.E.E. Explorer
The Initiative. |
Posted - 2008.09.30 16:53:00 - [ 154]
I think its CCP's transperancy that really turns me on to them. Some claim otherwise, but they've just been spoiled by CCP, and gruff when it appears they're not being as forthwith.
Hats off no matter. Love to see how these future improvements will translate to fleet battles. |
Washu
Caldari
Standards and Practices
|
Posted - 2008.10.01 16:59:00 - [ 155]
Originally by: porkbelly
Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane
The results certainly look promising, but I would like to know what StacklessIO actually does...
Ah, yes.
As the dev primarily responsible I should probably write a technical blog about it. Meanwhile IŽll offer that StacklessIO is a framework that allows us to make things such as asynchronous IO and work that is spawned off to worker threads appear as regular, blocking operations for tasklets in Stackless Python. We then use this to perform asynchronous Winsock operations using IO completion ports. The semantics are not new, but the scheduling framework and the lightweight winsock layer we use are.
Out of curiosity, were you using IOCP previously, but the method in which it interacted with stackless python was inefficient for greater loads, or did you use an older method, such as polling/asynchronous sockets? |
Lady Gwynneth |
Posted - 2008.10.02 02:22:00 - [ 156]
Originally by: CCP Explorer
Edited by: CCP Explorer on 27/09/2008 17:48:01
Originally by: Levitikon
If you have time to answer silly questions on the forums, could you please be so kind and reassign a bit faster node (hint; Jita; hint) to MSHD solarsystem? We already had three node crashes in last 30 minutes, fourth won't make much difference.
The system administrators have been monitoring this fight closely. MSHD-4 has now been remapped to one of the dedicated machines (native 64 bit code and Jita-style hardware).
Hi CCP Explorer, nice to hear about the improvements and thanks for this great dev blog. I see that you are using windows servers. Did you ever make some tests how your code performs using another operating system or even server architecture ? If your application is multi threaded you might also have a look at some server/cpu designs that support this very good and which also have advantages regarding low energy consumption which might also serve you well in the hosting center to save energy costs (Sun T5220, ...) ? Or did you try Open Source Unix systems that scale very good under load and also offer a very well network stack ? FreeBSD at the moment seem to scale very well regarding multi CPU/core systems (8 / 16 CPUs). Linux of course might also serve you well. I simply wonder if you might get some additional performance gain by this as Windows server in the past very often were limited regarding top notch performance and not always make best use of server hardware. |
Andreis
Caldari |
Posted - 2008.10.02 02:41:00 - [ 157]
After reading the blog on it I call this complete Epic Win. Faster smarter better and nothing was broken in the process. Total victory \o/ |
XMM1 |
Posted - 2008.10.02 03:44:00 - [ 158]
Epic victory or a sad end of the long story? On October 23, 2006 one of your developers wrote: "I currently maintain Stackless for what its worth and I also use it in my day to day work at CCP." See hereAnd they start using anisochronous sockets!! Brilliant!  |
adriaans
Amarr
Ankaa.
Nair Al-Zaurak |
Posted - 2008.10.02 09:21:00 - [ 159]
yay love these kind of blogs :D seems to be working rather well according to you're data :D although some other systems with merely hundred players in have been 'lagging' worse than old jita did sometimes  (half of local kept commenting on it, so doubt it is/was a local issue) ohh and looking forward to full 64 bit :D |
Jolliejoe
Caldari
Stellar Implosions
|
Posted - 2008.10.02 12:01:00 - [ 160]
So your stackless IO thing didn't improve anything... Anything more you can pull out of your sleeves? |
SFShootme
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone |
Posted - 2008.10.02 14:51:00 - [ 161]
Yah! Blogs 4tw..
In m-o the other day the node was handeling the 1000+ in local quite nicely, untill the node itself crashed. Now the crashing really wasen't a problem. But logging in took a VERY long time. (4 hours in some cases)
If you could somehow give more priority to people logging into said node (after a crash) it would make nodecrashes alot less of a pain. |
CCP Explorer
 |
Posted - 2008.10.03 18:18:00 - [ 162]
Edited by: CCP Explorer on 04/10/2008 16:19:13 Originally by: Lady Gwynneth
I see that you are using windows servers. Did you ever make some tests how your code performs using another operating system or even server architecture?
We haven't made comparisons on using Windows vs. other operating systems. The decision to use Windows was in part based on convenience. Since the entire application suite runs on Windows then developers can run a server, proxy and clients on their local workstation, which simplifies and eases development. In part the decision was also based on the technical support we get from IBM, our hardware vendor and Microsoft. In addition to Windows then we also use Microsoft SQL Server so if we encounter any database issues then there is no vendor finger pointing. There are pros and cons to different operating systems but the homogeneous operating environment helps in keeping EVE development agile. |
CCP Explorer
|
Posted - 2008.10.03 18:34:00 - [ 163]
Originally by: XMM1
Epic victory or a sad end of the long story? On October 23, 2006 one of your developers wrote: "I currently maintain Stackless for what its worth and I also use it in my day to day work at CCP." See hereAnd they start using anisochronous sockets!! Brilliant!
I'm not sure if I understand your post, but the developer posting there, CCP lickspittle (Richard M. Tew), is referring to the fact that he is one of the maintainers of Stackless Python. |
Eraggan Sadarr
Comply Or Die |
Posted - 2008.10.04 11:09:00 - [ 164]
Edited by: Eraggan Sadarr on 04/10/2008 11:36:28 Originally by: CCP Explorer
Originally by: Reptzo
Are you guys switching all coding over to native 64 bit? Is it already switched?
We did a lot of work this week on 64 bit code and Tranquility is currently running a few nodes with all native 64 bit code.
Cool, Now we are talking  Congratulations on a milestone upgrade. I must say, that the constant development of Eve by CCP is one of the primary factors contributing to me still hanging around after 2,5 years. Peasants rejoice... |
BillyBong2
Amarr
3OO
WE FORM VOLTRON |
Posted - 2008.10.06 14:59:00 - [ 165]
So since the stackless has been introduced how many node crashes have their been? I know of two obviously, just wondering if there are any others. |
Ydyp Ieva
Caldari
Amarrian Retribution
|
Posted - 2008.10.08 17:25:00 - [ 166]
If stacklessIO is already deployed then I have to say that it caused me to get a 3-4 second response on the warp command. Weird thing is that everything else is pretty responsive. FPS stays high up, modules react on the moment I activate them, but oh dear if try to warp, then it can be that I have to wait 3-4 seconds before I even hear the sound notification of warping and see my ship turn to align. |
Slistine Death
Sons of Angelus Mortis
|
Posted - 2008.10.11 00:45:00 - [ 167]
Good job CCP. Thank you for finally taking a step to reduce "lag" and "features". |
davcin
Caldari
davcin Corp
|
Posted - 2008.10.11 18:54:00 - [ 168]
Edited by: davcin on 11/10/2008 18:59:53
StacklessIO was deployed.
Did it helped? Yes it did.
But it did bring problems. Problems like:
- missiles launchers sometimes don't reload
- a part of the ammo sometimes disappears from missile launchers bays
- drones sometimes are taking ages to deploy
- drones sometimes are not launched correctly (you have 7 in drone bay, can only control 5, sometimes 6 are launched leaving one drone inactive in space)
- warp 3-7 sec initiation delay (as said by some before)
- drones take some time to follow a attack order (in system with lag)
- moving modules between hangars (ship/station/etc) takes ages, more then was taking before in heavy lagging systems
- some systems still lag all over the place (like Ruvas)
- open cargo of wrecks is still taking ages (in system with lag)
- the activation/deactivation of a module still takes ages to happen (in system with lag)
StacklessIO may have improved allot of things but problems remain and it isn't the 'miracle' you keep advertising.
|
GLEV |
Posted - 2008.10.13 14:23:00 - [ 169]
Great work Guys.I have a question to ask.isn't windows server 2003 and sql server awe enable applications to use more ram than 4Gb.If so why we need 64bit code?when you could just upgrate ram on the 32bit win server and just enable awe. Thanks in advance. Keep up the good work:) |
Captain Nuf
Seppuku Warriors
Vertigo Coalition |
Posted - 2008.10.15 17:13:00 - [ 170]
I would like to nominate the persons responsible for this for a nice beer bonus.
The Jita/fleet combat lag issue has been one of my longest standing and biggest Eve frustrations that has several times tempted me to sadly consider checking out other MMOs.
Nice save - keep up the good work in this regard. I've noticed. |
Galmar Grief
Caldari
New Eden Research Organisation
|
Posted - 2008.10.17 11:32:00 - [ 171]
The pictures of the original post.. dead links.
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Tina OPPENHEIIMER |
Posted - 2009.01.10 15:43:00 - [ 172]
Too many lagggg !! It's impossible to play !!
The system Pator and others are out of control !
I will leave Eve and say byebye !!
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Stonecold Tyrannosaurus |
Posted - 2009.02.14 11:37:00 - [ 173]
I'm curious about how to read the graphs. Are they displaying felt lag? In the second lag graph, for example, were some players experiencing a round-trip time of ten seconds at 20:34? Were players experiencing a round-trip time of half a second or so during the rest of the day? |
Ipooprai Nbows |
Posted - 2009.04.08 18:25:00 - [ 174]
Edited by: Ipooprai Nbows on 08/04/2009 18:28:34
I read the presentation you guys did at pycon this year, and was pretty impressed with StacklessIO. It mentioned that you were open sourcing StacklessIO; is it publicly available yet?
EDIT: Just realized that presentation was a few days ago and it says it'll be OSS'd in a few weeks. Can't wait to take a look at it. |
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