open All Channels
seplocked EVE Information Portal
blankseplocked New Dev Blog by Explorer - StacklessIO and lag reduction
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6

Author Topic

Danjira Ryuujin
Caldari
Posted - 2008.09.26 20:00:00 - [31]
 

Exciting stuff, Thanks for the update!

Easy Tiger
Caldari
Whirling Dervishes
Posted - 2008.09.26 20:03:00 - [32]
 

OK that is damn impressive Shocked

Have to say I've noticed a difference around Jita. Mad props to all involved Very Happy

Idara
Caldari
Queens of the Stone Age
Posted - 2008.09.26 20:04:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: Idara on 26/09/2008 20:03:44
That's hot.

Solomon XI
Hidden Souls
Posted - 2008.09.26 20:05:00 - [34]
 

I've noticed an improvement lately but have yet to put it to a true test. I <3 Tech dev-blogs, though.

Syekuda
Hell's Revenge
Posted - 2008.09.26 20:18:00 - [35]
 

Questions for the devs here: I've been thinking after I read your wonderful blog. Is the improvement only in the node or cluster where Jita is ? Also, if not which means its everywhere, will the effects (the final stats) be the same in a system which is empty and then all of a sudden, you see 300 ships using the jump gate ?

I was wondering since I don't know much about the network infrastructure that Eve uses, but is the "limitations" the same with an 0.0 system. In case you don't understand or its really not clear lets say the cluster in Jita as 32gig of ram because its always busy. Would there be the same in a 0.0 system or a system thats not normaly busy ?

CCP Atlas

Posted - 2008.09.26 20:53:00 - [36]
 

Edited by: CCP Atlas on 26/09/2008 20:54:46
Originally by: Syekuda
Questions for the devs here: I've been thinking after I read your wonderful blog. Is the improvement only in the node or cluster where Jita is ? Also, if not which means its everywhere, will the effects (the final stats) be the same in a system which is empty and then all of a sudden, you see 300 ships using the jump gate ?

I was wondering since I don't know much about the network infrastructure that Eve uses, but is the "limitations" the same with an 0.0 system. In case you don't understand or its really not clear lets say the cluster in Jita as 32gig of ram because its always busy. Would there be the same in a 0.0 system or a system thats not normaly busy ?


This is a performance boost to all solar systems in that requests you make will reach the server more quickly. The effect is mostly noticeable where the node is heavily loaded and thus Jita has been used as an example.

This will not allow the node to process your requests more quickly though once it reaches the application layer, but you shouldn't have to wait 5 minutes for a module to activate. ugh

Jakus Cemendur
Caldari
Invicta.
Advocated Destruction
Posted - 2008.09.26 20:56:00 - [37]
 

Edited by: Jakus Cemendur on 26/09/2008 20:56:26
*Gives all the core team devs a big hug for the sheer awesomeness of the blog*


*and buys beers for those strange people who won't want hugs*

CCP porkbelly

Posted - 2008.09.26 20:58:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane
The results certainly look promising, but I would like to know what StacklessIO actually does...

Ah, yes.
As the dev primarily responsible I should probably write a technical blog about it. Meanwhile IŽll offer that StacklessIO is a framework that allows us to make things such as asynchronous IO and work that is spawned off to worker threads appear as regular, blocking operations for tasklets in Stackless Python. We then use this to perform asynchronous Winsock operations using IO completion ports. The semantics are not new, but the scheduling framework and the lightweight winsock layer we use are.

Komen
Gallente
Capital Enrichment Services
Posted - 2008.09.26 21:42:00 - [39]
 

And this is why I continue to play this game. In the space of a week, multiple improvements and changes all directed towards reducing lag - some towards Jita specifically, and then this one which ought to significantly reduce lag everywhere in Eve.

Kudos, dev team.

You've secured another year-long subscription from me. (okay, it's not actually due for renewal 'til February or so, but still). Cool

Reptzo
Channel 4 News Team
Veritas Immortalis
Posted - 2008.09.26 21:43:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: porkbelly
Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane
The results certainly look promising, but I would like to know what StacklessIO actually does...

Ah, yes.
Crazy Server VooDoo magic.


Fixed it for you.

Shadoo
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2008.09.26 21:47:00 - [41]
 

Wow -- a teched up devblog that isn't watered down with too much marketing talk.

Well done (on both the blog and the significant advancements deployed).

Jumfat Kohlah
Posted - 2008.09.26 21:52:00 - [42]
 

Fantastic stuff

Would be intensely interested to see if you have affected or changed the network/transport layers (ISO 7 layer model)... and how did you arrive at this... MOAR detail pls :)

Alek Row
Minmatar
Silent Step
Posted - 2008.09.26 22:13:00 - [43]
 

Impressive.
Congratulations!!!

Hyren
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
Posted - 2008.09.26 22:15:00 - [44]
 

A.W.E.S.O.M.E.

Barwinius
Ars ex Discordia
Posted - 2008.09.26 22:35:00 - [45]
 

Congratulations on the victory. Very Happy

Schneiderr
AMT.
Ev0ke
Posted - 2008.09.26 22:44:00 - [46]
 

interesting, i like those little tech blogs. keep up the good work!

Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2008.09.26 22:58:00 - [47]
 

Edited by: Vaal Erit on 26/09/2008 23:02:31
Originally by: Dev Blog
This new network layer reduces network latency and improves performance in high-volume situations, e.g., in fleet-fights


MOAR MOAR MOAR.

*edit* When you click on dev blogs in the left hand control panel, it seems to think it is Oct and you have to go to archive to find the current blog. *edit*

Taedrin
Gallente
Kushan Industrial
Posted - 2008.09.26 23:19:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: porkbelly
Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane
The results certainly look promising, but I would like to know what StacklessIO actually does...

Ah, yes.
As the dev primarily responsible I should probably write a technical blog about it. Meanwhile IŽll offer that StacklessIO is a framework that allows us to make things such as asynchronous IO and work that is spawned off to worker threads appear as regular, blocking operations for tasklets in Stackless Python. We then use this to perform asynchronous Winsock operations using IO completion ports. The semantics are not new, but the scheduling framework and the lightweight winsock layer we use are.


Words in this post that I did not understand:

"tasklets"
"Winsock operations"
"IO completion ports"

I look forward to that devblog of yours, hopefully you'll be able to showcase all this new tech you guys have been working on. I know I love tech blogs the most, and I'm sure that there's plenty more who do too.

mechtech
SRS Industries
SRS.
Posted - 2008.09.26 23:22:00 - [49]
 

Yep, I love the tech blogs as well, the eve server is an amazing thing.

GOOD JORB GUYS!

MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2008.09.26 23:23:00 - [50]
 

CCP FIX THE LAG!

why can we only have 1400 people in one fleet battle!

(with much love wrangler don't kill me but someone had to say it :P)

Blyghme
Gallente
Strohl Munitions
Posted - 2008.09.26 23:27:00 - [51]
 

"It was not uncommon that client requests could take up to 1-2 minutes to reach the service layer on the server, and the requests would be delayed seemingly randomly since for two requests in succession then the first one could be delayed for minutes while the second one would get a response almost immediately. From a player's perspective this would manifest itself in lag and strange client behaviour as requests were delayed and completed by the server much out-of-order."

OK, I know that this was referring to Jita, but doesn't it also sound a lot like the symptopms of desync?

Jordan Musgrat
Convergent
Posted - 2008.09.26 23:31:00 - [52]
 

What you say is true, market requests and general response in Jita has been absolutely beautiful the past few days. If you can keep this up, and it applying in all systems, then you have done something that we have not seen in years-- reduce what noobs like us call "lag" in a big and significant way. Thank you CCP, now if you can only keep going in this direction, and take a look at the mechanics that cause server limitations to become apparent in the first place, eve will be running on happily for years yet.

Kuzya Morozov
Gallente
Capital Construction Research
Posted - 2008.09.26 23:32:00 - [53]
 

Can't really say anything about Jita, only use it a few times a month, and no matter by how much you increase the limit, people will max it out.

However, I am looking forward to see if this effects fleet fights, good work CCP :)

CCP Explorer

Posted - 2008.09.26 23:34:00 - [54]
 

Edited by: CCP Explorer on 26/09/2008 23:39:11
Originally by: Blyghme
OK, I know that this was referring to Jita, but doesn't it also sound a lot like the symptopms of desync?
The symptoms we saw in Jita were quite specific to Jita during peak hour on Sunday evenings.

We did a lot of work last year in improving the client/server communication on the physics simulation. The old network technology could possibly have sometimes caused or contributed to instances of desync. StacklessIO will help in all circumstances in synchronising the physics state.

Kyguard
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2008.09.27 00:10:00 - [55]
 

Excellent work - very pleased Very HappyVery Happy

Blyghme
Gallente
Strohl Munitions
Posted - 2008.09.27 00:39:00 - [56]
 

Thanks for the quick reply.

Excellent work on the new network stack :)

Gun Hog
Caldari
APEX ARDENT COALITION
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2008.09.27 02:21:00 - [57]
 

All in all, these are pure golden improvements!

Enjoy the reduced lag...while it lasts! In about a month of two, people who avoided Jita are going to start going, and you shall have the same problem again. Local is going to exceed 2K, pilots are going to have more fights outside of 4-4, and market scams will plague the local chat at a whole new level.

The problem, sadly, is not that the node cannot handle the load...it is because people keep increasing the load until lag and crashes happen! I suppose it is the same as the theory that says that if you expand a heavily used highway, you could end up making the congestion worse.

Todd Overbeck
Posted - 2008.09.27 02:49:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Taedrin
Originally by: porkbelly
Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane
The results certainly look promising, but I would like to know what StacklessIO actually does...

Ah, yes.
As the dev primarily responsible I should probably write a technical blog about it. Meanwhile IŽll offer that StacklessIO is a framework that allows us to make things such as asynchronous IO and work that is spawned off to worker threads appear as regular, blocking operations for tasklets in Stackless Python. We then use this to perform asynchronous Winsock operations using IO completion ports. The semantics are not new, but the scheduling framework and the lightweight winsock layer we use are.


Words in this post that I did not understand:

"tasklets"
"Winsock operations"
"IO completion ports"

I look forward to that devblog of yours, hopefully you'll be able to showcase all this new tech you guys have been working on. I know I love tech blogs the most, and I'm sure that there's plenty more who do too.


A "tasklet" is a single unit of computation in stackless python.

"Winsock operations" and "IO completion ports" refer to Windows NT TCP/IP programming interface internals. Basically he's talking about a method of having the windows kernel notify the software with a window message when a request is completed, instead of the software having to A) poll periodically to see if it was completed (aka "blocking"), or B) check if it was completed or not before attempting to send another message. (aka "non blocking")

In short, a more efficient way of doing things.

Athanasios Anastasiou
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2008.09.27 02:57:00 - [59]
 

Edited by: Athanasios Anastasiou on 27/09/2008 02:58:53
Asynchronous stuff with threads sounds like a pain to get stable, especially for something this complex. GJ CCP.

Karbowiak
Sniggerdly
Posted - 2008.09.27 03:21:00 - [60]
 

So, this must be why i hardly felt any lag in JU- tonight with ~300 in system doing battle..

epic.. :D

FLEET BATTLES HERE I COME \o/ Laughing


Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only