| Author |
Topic |
Pithecanthropus |
Posted - 2008.04.11 11:27:00 - [ 1]
The following are some main issues that need fixing and it's beyond me why their changes have yet to be implemented.
1. afk cloakers
- easy fix: have cloaks use fuel
- why it hasn't been implemented: CCP is lazy
2. nano weenies
- easy fix: have mods on bigger ships not as effective as on small ships.
- why it hasn't been implemented: CCP is lazy
3. suicide ganks in empire
- easy fix: no insurance paid out to concorded losses
- why it hasn't been implemented: CCP is lazy
|
Riho
Gallente
Drop of Blood
|
Posted - 2008.04.11 11:37:00 - [ 2]
afk cloakers.... are afk :) (or are they ??!?!?!?!??!?!?? mind games)
nanos dont need to be fixed
suicide ganks are fine... risk vs reward
CCP needs to work on better things |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
|
Posted - 2008.04.11 12:04:00 - [ 3]
1. AFK cloakers are not a problem.
They're AFK for god's sake. The problem is "local" is an intel gathering tool when it shouldn't, and people who have a "problem" with AFK cloakers are simply having a problem with their intel gathering tool not working as they expect it to work.
2. Nano stuff
They have been nerfed significantly, and they will keep being nerfed in the future if needed.
However, that "nerf" needs to be balanced in such a way that speed-tanking fits are STILL viable alternatives every now and then for the regular fits.
The problem is there's too many modifiers in places you can't really nerf (snake implants, other speed-related implants, etc) without a pretty damned heavy backlash.
3. Old, old, old argument.
I can't really find the strength to have the argument again, not with somebody who's obviously a nitwit, given the previous two points of yours.
|
BiggestT
Caldari
Amarrian Retribution
|
Posted - 2008.04.11 12:05:00 - [ 4]
 Originally by: Pithecanthropus
3. suicide ganks in empire
- easy fix: no insurance paid out to concorded losses
- why it hasn't been implemented: CCP is lazy
[/quote
WTF are u smoking?! how do you want suicide ganking to be nerfed, that is true carebear, u realise how un-fun EVE would be in high sec? ILL JUST SIT AT A BELT FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE
if ud pay attention ud notice that CCP actually like suicide ganking, other wise they wouldnt have talked about Jihad-swarm in the news etc
Why ppl want carebear EVE is beyong me....
-trolling ftw-
|
Ellaine TashMurkon
CBC Interstellar
Tactical Narcotics Team |
Posted - 2008.04.11 12:19:00 - [ 5]
Theese problems have not been slved because they are not problems :)
Other examples:
Problem: people asking to nerf AFK cloakers on forums.
Easy FIX: ban them :)
Why not implemented: no idea ;) |
Dotard
Minmatar
Kernel of War
Goonswarm Federation |
Posted - 2008.04.11 12:28:00 - [ 6]
LOL?
|
Pithecanthropus |
Posted - 2008.04.11 12:59:00 - [ 7]
Edited by: Pithecanthropus on 11/04/2008 13:01:38
ROFL... if you don't think these are issues, then you obviously haven't been playing the same game I have.
1. afk cloakers do more trouble than good. They are not serving a game purpose. They are not involved. They should log off... OR get punished by soaking up fuel. Yes, afk cloakers can't cause harm, but they cause panic. And since when can you be afk and shut down a main aspect of ANY game? For those that can't see this, you're an idiot. This in no way nerfs anyone wishing to cloak and play a role in this game. It nerfs those that watch America Idol and sit cloaked still having an impact. That's not a gaming experience. Get real.
2. Nano is a problem. Small ships are used and needed for speed. Big ships in this game were never intended to go uber fast. When was the last time your shield or armor tank was as effective as a speed tank? They are overpowered. Simple... warp core stabs were nefered when whining pirates couldn't lock... speed is the same thing. Its now their fancy warp core stab... you get hit, you run. Warp away. Eve is not speed, and the bulk of players are tired of seeing this game lean toward game mechanics that explit overpowered techniques wathcing muppet after muppet do the same thing. There is so much to Eve, and speed is not what people signed up for. This isn't a racing game... speed is not anything we all intended as a defense or offense to a game this big
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you sucide gank, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to suicide gank... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
I swear, I play this game with ******s. |
Eleana Tomelac
Gallente
Eclats de verre
|
Posted - 2008.04.11 13:23:00 - [ 8]
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you sucide gank, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to suicide gank... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
Let me fix this : 3. no need to argue here, common sense... you fly a warship, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to fight... why get rewarded for losing your ship? => Look, now, insurance should be removed. Common sense tells insurances not to insure planes of the world's armies, they're not insuring anyone on a warzone... |
Pithecanthropus |
Posted - 2008.04.11 13:41:00 - [ 9]
Originally by: Eleana Tomelac
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you sucide gank, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to suicide gank... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
Let me fix this :
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you fly a warship, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to fight... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
=> Look, now, insurance should be removed.
Common sense tells insurances not to insure planes of the world's armies, they're not insuring anyone on a warzone...
What are you, a Republican? LOL... nice attempt at trying to spin the topic. War is war, and besides... tax payers pay for those ships, as well as corporate big business being paid and outsourced by Congressional pen pals. So what you are saying is... well... dumb. Thus you are the village idiot. Besides that, can we insure or items? NO. Stop being part of the problem and be part of the solution. P.S. FU to whoever moved this thread, cuz every other thread in GENERAL DISCUSSION refers to these topics and should be move here too... why this one? Is it cuz it points the finger at CCP as being lazy? Probably. |
Timaios
Cruoris Seraphim
Exalted. |
Posted - 2008.04.11 13:57:00 - [ 10]
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
Edited by: Pithecanthropus on 11/04/2008 13:01:38
ROFL... if you don't think these are issues, then you obviously haven't been playing the same game I have.
1. afk cloakers do more trouble than good. They are not serving a game purpose. They are not involved. They should log off... OR get punished by soaking up fuel. Yes, afk cloakers can't cause harm, but they cause panic. And since when can you be afk and shut down a main aspect of ANY game? For those that can't see this, you're an idiot. This in no way nerfs anyone wishing to cloak and play a role in this game. It nerfs those that watch America Idol and sit cloaked still having an impact. That's not a gaming experience. Get real.
2. Nano is a problem. Small ships are used and needed for speed. Big ships in this game were never intended to go uber fast. When was the last time your shield or armor tank was as effective as a speed tank? They are overpowered. Simple... warp core stabs were nefered when whining pirates couldn't lock... speed is the same thing. Its now their fancy warp core stab... you get hit, you run. Warp away. Eve is not speed, and the bulk of players are tired of seeing this game lean toward game mechanics that explit overpowered techniques wathcing muppet after muppet do the same thing. There is so much to Eve, and speed is not what people signed up for. This isn't a racing game... speed is not anything we all intended as a defense or offense to a game this big
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you sucide gank, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to suicide gank... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
I swear, I play this game with ******s.
Hello. Insulting others when they don't agree with you really won't swing them to your side. That said, 1. AFK cloaker cannot move, cannot warp, cannot attack, cannot report you... but it is still capable of shutting your operations down? You're doing it wrong. Camping jump bridges for hours is great fun, in my book. Sometimes that means having to take a break and be afk. My goal is to cause panic, demoralize anyone I'm camping and in general, ruin their day. Try to counter that: keep friends in system, have a scout, fly in a ship that can take on a cloaker. The problem is not in the game, it's in your head (the panic an AFK cloaker is causing). 2. Nanoships are good. They can also be caught. Perhaps there are too few available counters (often huginn/rapier, both minmatar, also target painting, which is minmatar as well), but in general, the concept is fine. Nanoships, EWAR and other more complex fits make the PVP different from PVE, which is mainly matching your tank against the rats' DPS output. Forming balanced gangs and fleets is not easy but we've come a long way from 2003 combats with no focused fire and very little tactics. Combat in EVE is evolving, improve your tactics. 3. Insurance is paid out regardless of the reason your ship was destroyed. Changing that won't stop people from flying on autopilot with hundred millions inside untanked T1 haulers. Awareness must increase and to be honest, we haven't got any kind of data on how prevalent suicide ganking actually is. I'd conclude that it's not very common on basis of the fact that we still have plenty of pilots flying around with cargo too valuable for a flimsy T1 hauler to carry. I'm not completely against removing the insurance from ships destroyed by concord, however - but it will never stop suicide ganks, simply limit them by a miniscule amount. And that is good, it's a mechanic that is needed to target NPC corp alts and make targeting enemy logistics possible. |
Eleana Tomelac
Gallente
Eclats de verre
|
Posted - 2008.04.11 14:16:00 - [ 11]
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
What are you, a Republican? LOL... nice attempt at trying to spin the topic. War is war, and besides... tax payers pay for those ships, as well as corporate big business being paid and outsourced by Congressional pen pals.
Republican? Can you even guess what country I am from? I guess not, so you should just stop saying stupid things like that. Originally by: Pithecanthropus
So what you are saying is... well... dumb. Thus you are the village idiot.
It has as much sense as what you said. I'm not against removal of insurance for suicide gankers, but calling on common sense is just crap. That's just throwing some "it's logic" and leaving it. If you want to demonstrate that insurance should not be received on suicide ganks, then, this is not the right way. Other people made posts about the economics of suicide ganking, which made valid points against insurance when shot by concord. They proved it was so cheap that it was never safe to fill a freighter while there are no ways to protect one properly. So, next time, talk economics, it's what runs this game. Common sense is just arbitrary. Common sense for some are to help others and some others would just help them die, common sense is just a pile of more or less common opinions... PS : be polite, it annoys less people and help them answer constructively. |
Abrazzar |
Posted - 2008.04.11 14:28:00 - [ 12]
OP is obviously a Troll, who correctly posted his diaherra in the general discussions forum but was erroneously moved to the features and ideas discussion forum. Any attempt at discussion with this troll has been and will be met with insults from his side. Continuing the conversation would be a waste of effort. Thanks you for your patience. |
Pithecanthropus |
Posted - 2008.04.11 17:56:00 - [ 13]
Originally by: Timaios
Insulting others when they don't agree with you really won't swing them to your side.
I insult them cuz they are idiots. If they had a clue, they wouldn't post dull comments biased remarks to this game when I have the whole community in mind... they have themselves in mind. They are hypocritical idiots. Quote:
1. AFK cloaker cannot move, cannot warp, cannot attack, cannot report you... but it is still capable of shutting your operations down? You're doing it wrong.
When it takes OUR assets, OUR ships, OUR players time to track... try and bait... and camp... it takes OUR time and shuts down effective operations. And after all that, you never know if they guy is afk or not... THATS A FLAW. The afk cloaker needs SOME cause to disencourage it. I don't care about cloakers, as long as there is an effect person on the other side of the computer. YOU ARE WRONG. Quote:
2. Nanoships are good. They can also be caught. Perhaps there are too few available counters (often huginn/rapier, both minmatar, also target painting, which is minmatar as well), but in general, the concept is fine. Nanoships, EWAR and other more complex fits make the PVP different from PVE, which is mainly matching your tank against the rats' DPS output. Forming balanced gangs and fleets is not easy but we've come a long way from 2003 combats with no focused fire and very little tactics. Combat in EVE is evolving, improve your tactics.
nanos are good... big nanos are flawed... YOU ARE WRONG. Quote:
3. Insurance is paid out regardless of the reason your ship was destroyed. Changing that won't stop people from flying on autopilot with hundred millions inside untanked T1 haulers..
changing it WILL make the gankers think of their consequences. thus they got more risk. It's not about the victim here... LOL. YOU ARE WRONG. |
TimMc
Brutal Deliverance
Gypsy Band |
Posted - 2008.04.11 18:01:00 - [ 14]
This post has been cleared of inappropriate content.
Regards,
The EVE Online Moderation team |
Pithecanthropus |
Posted - 2008.04.12 18:15:00 - [ 15]
This post has been cleared of inappropriate content.
Regards,
The EVE Online Moderation team |
Fofalus
Agony Unleashed |
Posted - 2008.04.12 19:33:00 - [ 16]
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
Originally by: TimMc
gtfo Pithecanthropus. You are barking at things which have good reasons for not being implemented.
stfu, you're clueless. don't waste my time when you have not a single idea as to what goes in this this game. Go mine some veldspar in Empire and get back to me when you actually play EVE.
bark back all you want little doggy, but we all know you don't have any bite.
And you come back when you have actually played the game and know how to see both sides of an arguement. |
NightKhaos
Gallente
Relative Quantum Limited
|
Posted - 2008.04.12 21:12:00 - [ 17]
Request this thread be locked/moderated to prevent the continued personal attacks of above. |
Alski
Ministers Of Destruction. |
Posted - 2008.04.12 21:36:00 - [ 18]
|
XD Andy
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance |
Posted - 2008.04.13 01:43:00 - [ 19]
TBH, I've always found it amusing that you can get an insurance payout after an illegal act.
I'd go with not getting insurance after a being Concorded, purely on the basis that it invalidates your insurance. But then, that to me is more realistic in terms of the role play side of things.
However, don't think that will stop suicide ganking, as there are plenty of people out there who will still ship billions of isk worth, so there will still be a market.
As for AFK cloakers ..... huh? The only reason you know there is someone there is because they appear in local. I'm slowly coming to the side of getting rid of local. I think that will make Eve a lot more fun and realistic, and the tools are there to effectively scan systems properly.
And, Nano's can be caught, as someone has already pointed out.
Andy |
Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
|
Posted - 2008.04.13 01:55:00 - [ 20]
Originally by: BiggestT
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
3. suicide ganks in empire
- easy fix: no insurance paid out to concorded losses
- why it hasn't been implemented: CCP is lazy
[/quote
WTF are u smoking?! how do you want suicide ganking to be nerfed, that is true carebear, u realise how un-fun EVE would be in high sec? ILL JUST SIT AT A BELT FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE
if ud pay attention ud notice that CCP actually like suicide ganking, other wise they wouldnt have talked about Jihad-swarm in the news etc
Why ppl want carebear EVE is beyong me....
-trolling ftw-
Then go to 0.0 or low sec if your bored of sitting in a high sec belt.
Funny how some people try to convice you that you are not having fun when you are.
|
Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
|
Posted - 2008.04.13 01:58:00 - [ 21]
Edited by: Marlona Sky on 13/04/2008 01:58:14 Originally by: Pithecanthropus
Originally by: Eleana Tomelac
Originally by: Pithecanthropus
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you sucide gank, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to suicide gank... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
Let me fix this :
3. no need to argue here, common sense... you fly a warship, no insurance pay out. Those that argue why it should... again, you're an idiot. You're only here to grief. If you want to fight... why get rewarded for losing your ship?
=> Look, now, insurance should be removed.
Common sense tells insurances not to insure planes of the world's armies, they're not insuring anyone on a warzone...
What are you, a Republican? LOL... nice attempt at trying to spin the topic. War is war, and besides... tax payers pay for those ships, as well as corporate big business being paid and outsourced by Congressional pen pals.
So what you are saying is... well... dumb. Thus you are the village idiot.
Besides that, can we insure or items? NO. Stop being part of the problem and be part of the solution.
P.S. FU to whoever moved this thread, cuz every other thread in GENERAL DISCUSSION refers to these topics and should be move here too... why this one? Is it cuz it points the finger at CCP as being lazy? Probably.
Are you upset because your thread just got "Forum Ganked" when you thought it was safe in the "General Discussion" thread. You can totally cash in that kill right you have on the moderator and now he took a sec hit for moving your thread. Balanced right??  |
Kil'Roy
Minmatar
The Rat Patrol |
Posted - 2008.04.13 08:12:00 - [ 22]
This is a reason no one likes to be the target of "Psy Ops", the are very effective.
Cloakers, afk or not, can be very effective in psychological warfare.
The magnitude of whines are a testament to this.
|
Astria Tiphareth
Caldari
24th Imperial Crusade
|
Posted - 2008.04.15 11:15:00 - [ 23]
Originally by: Kil'Roy
This is a reason no one likes to be the target of "Psy Ops", the are very effective.
Cloakers, afk or not, can be very effective in psychological warfare.
The magnitude of whines are a testament to this.
I agree, but psychological warfare also has counters; one is training. (tongue-in-cheek) Whilst we're busy ignoring the original troll, perhaps it's worth asking the question as to whether the psy op is targeting a flawed component in the game(play), namely relying on local as an intelligence tool. Remove that intel tool and the problem of afk cloaking goes away. Of course you now have the much bigger problem of having to actually patrol/probe/defend your space instead of one person watching local and going nuts when it changes  |
Deadeye Devie
Minmatar |
Posted - 2008.04.15 13:11:00 - [ 24]
Edited by: Deadeye Devie on 15/04/2008 13:11:451/ AFK cloakers i have quite high covert ops and scanning/probing skills and Local, at the moment, is a valuable tool to prevent convoys and squads being ganked when passing through or working in that system...i happily sit afk cloaked, uncloaking now n then to drop probes and then go afk cloaked to await the scan results....pop in on someone in a mission or a safe spot, and sit cloaked to keep an eye out on them. A LOT of covert ops and stealth games in ANY MMORPG involves a lot of sitting, reading, and waiting out of sight, and so the current system is fine, no need to fix what isnt broke. Psycologincal mi8ndgames are part of the whole task of covert ops and nerfing them coz it makes you uneasy just goes to show that they are doing it well and the tool works! 2/ nano fitting yes, i can see what you mean, but at the same time, if a ship of some size is going fast, and it uses turrets, then chances are it cant fire for most of the time its moving....thus will at some point be within webbing/damaging distance. Its not nanoing thats the problem, its the lack of skill and tactics applied to the situation that are making them so annoying....keep them running and they cant shoot, force them to slow to shoot and they risk death...just work out where and at which point they are at risk, work in a group, and they pose no problem, just a minor annoyance. 3/ suicide ganking this i can agree with....no insurance for being concorded....tho this will not stop them since, as stated, if your in an afk hauler with minimal to no tank and carrying a lot of good mods/bpos/etc... risk vs reward is higher....so, u loose a 1 mil ship? some of the mods will remain and if you gank them, chances are the payout will be higher than the loss. So all in all, no payout for concordation would be good, but it aint gonna stop it at all. You have to, as i had to a few months ago, deal with the fact that if you dont fit a tank on your hauler with 60 mil+ of ship and mods, your gonna loose it. a final note....a bit of politeness will make peoples reactions to you a bit more favourable, and name calling and general unsociable behaviour towards others with a differant point of view will only mark yourself out as a future target to gank...manners get you a lot further.  |
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