| Author |
Topic |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:00:00 - [ 1]
Well this issue has been battered to death i know... Why this post then? well afterall the solution to make life into lowsec is quite easy... First top 3 comments that players usually come up with as a solution. 1. Move lvl 3-4 mission agents to lowsec 2. Up the reward in lowsec better rats, mining etc... 3. Change lowsec to highsec or more 0.0 sec *1. Is just plain dumb idea... Why ? Because "Pirates" and the missioners just dont play on the same ground. PvE ships vs PvP doesnt work... *2. Well the idea with 0.0 space is the reward we dont want / need lowsec based 0.0 space. Probably would only end up with alliances spreading their wings to include all lowsec as well. *3. Same as in above post its a bad idea to turn lowsec into more highsec or to more 0.0. So what should lowsec be then ? First remove all PoSes in lowsec... After that how about setting up pirate complexes sites in 0.4-0.1 with specialised AI rats that force mission runners to have a pvp setup. That means ECM and EW to take down the rats and that give average bounties but LP for a specialised item shop. Also add then alot of missions that require a roaming fleet of 5-10 ships to accomplish. Mission example: 1 hauler plus his guardians transporting something from a lowsec pirate complex to highsec. Rewards a good amount of LP and ISK to balance the risk of loosing the hauler. NPC Corp Example: Caldari Navy Pirate Taskforce LP gained on killing pirate players based on their bounty. Same add Concord complexes in 0.5-0.7 space for pirates to raid that will add LP in same way also they will earn a good amount of LP killing a Taskforce player  based on his corp standing. Sure some of my suggestions here might need some modification but really it would give incitament for mission runners to start out with pvp through missions... Solution in short terms "build up lowsec to be the number one roaming ground..."small scale battle ftw!" Well give your critisims or flames I will be ready for them... *I am but a newb that went nOOb just you wait 15 ligthyears and I might just actually learn something...* |
Xar Zhun |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:10:00 - [ 2]
End result to all of the above - low sec pirates ream out missioners
the status quo
POS removal - why has no affect on low sec usability
More aggressive PVE mission rats - would need a rewrite of all the missions as current system doesnt give out lowsec high sec missions but from a single pool and again why? solo missions are normally 10-20 rats to one make them PVP quality and it becomes pointless
Rat LP gain - sorry but pointless and i would imagine unimplimentable - and would drive players into the high sec complexes as it would be easier to do them than low sec
Low sec will never be solved, its just not worth it
|
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:19:00 - [ 3]
Edited by: Zenofix Draco on 21/02/2008 13:19:54
Edited by: Zenofix Draco on 21/02/2008 13:18:56
Well think you missed my point...
The whole idea to make special lowsec complexes
with rats that give LP is to encourage the highsec mission runners to actually got there.
Why dont you as a mission runner do lvl 5s normally ?
Well simply because you cant fight a pirate PVP ship with ur own PvE fitted ship.
For pirates and missioners to meet on same ground you would need missions based on EW and EMC.
Simply the non pirate cant make LP on rats other than in
low sec complexes. Same pirates wont be able to make LP other than in highsec concord complexes.
Well one more thing they could get it by is through killing players of the other faction = pirate vs Pirate Taskforce
|
Luh Windan
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
|
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:20:00 - [ 4]
Surely if the pirates can't find enough people to shoot *they* should change their behaviour and adapt rather than having the whole game changed so they can have more targets (targets I might add who have currently opted to stay out of the pirates way) |
Shaemell Buttleson |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:21:00 - [ 5]
 Originally by: Xar Zhun
End result to all of the above - low sec pirates ream out missioners
the status quo
POS removal - why has no affect on low sec usability
More aggressive PVE mission rats - would need a rewrite of all the missions as current system doesnt give out lowsec high sec missions but from a single pool and again why? solo missions are normally 10-20 rats to one make them PVP quality and it becomes pointless
Rat LP gain - sorry but pointless and i would imagine unimplimentable - and would drive players into the high sec complexes as it would be easier to do them than low sec
Low sec will never be solved, its just not worth it
Low sec may never be solved but it could be very easily. All they need to do is put something there the whole of the eve economy relies on and nowhere else in the EvE universe. Resources that spring to mind are certain types of ore for example remove isogen/nocxium/mexalon producing roids in hi-sec or even icefields alltogether. At first it would be a pirate heaven but once the larger corps and alliances discover they cannot succeed in what they are doing without utilising lowsec then more and more pilots will start using it. Another advantage we might see is there would be less whines on the forums about can flipping etc etc as well. Low yield gas clouds was a start in the right direction but let's face it ppl want the better boosters since ISK seems to be no object with the ppl that use them and the economy hardly relies on that trade either! |
Lil'Red Ridin'Hood
Evolution
IT Alliance |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:22:00 - [ 6]
How to fix low-sec:
1) If you don't like it, don't live/go there.
2) See 1)
Fixed. |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:24:00 - [ 7]
Originally by: Luh Windan
Surely if the pirates can't find enough people to shoot *they* should change their behaviour and adapt rather than having the whole game changed so they can have more targets (targets I might add who have currently opted to stay out of the pirates way)
I agree (I am no pirate) in some sence thats why I say moving lvl 3-4 missions to lowsec is just plain stupid. Still wouldnt it be nice to have a way to get into pvp through missions as an option to joining a corp and fight for 0.0. |
Luh Windan
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
|
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:26:00 - [ 8]
Originally by: Zenofix Draco
Still wouldnt it be nice to have a way to
get into pvp through missions as an option to joining a corp and fight for 0.0.
My plan is to go and join in Red v. Blue to ease me into this |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:26:00 - [ 9]
Low sec may never be solved but it could be very easily.
All they need to do is put something there the whole of the eve economy relies on and nowhere else in the EvE universe. Resources that spring to mind are certain types of ore for example remove isogen/nocxium/mexalon producing roids in hi-sec or even icefields alltogether.
At first it would be a pirate heaven but once the larger corps and alliances discover they cannot succeed in what they are doing without utilising lowsec then more and more pilots will start using it. Another advantage we might see is there would be less whines on the forums about can flipping etc etc as well.
Low yield gas clouds was a start in the right direction but let's face it ppl want the better boosters since ISK seems to be no object with the ppl that use them and the economy hardly relies on that trade either!
Thats the same as making it 0.0 and well I for once want the border to be open dangerous with pirates in it... |
Lil'Red Ridin'Hood
Evolution
IT Alliance |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:36:00 - [ 10]
Originally by: Luh Windan
Surely if the pirates can't find enough people to shoot *they* should change their behaviour and adapt rather than having the whole game changed so they can have more targets (targets I might add who have currently opted to stay out of the pirates way)
Always the same pile of sht. Spouting some catchy phrase you've heard in the noob help channel again? Show me the pirate that complains about too few targets. And no, I don't mean JoeNobody24 who decided his 1337 e-peen skills make him a pirate, but isn't able to find a fight. The "fix low-sec" complaints almost exclusively come from people not living there. Go fix your own part of space and leave low-sec alone. We like it as it is. |
Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:37:00 - [ 11]
I think the question that really needs to be asked is: does low sec need to be 'solved' - is it really that broken?? I like the ideas posted here about more pirate faction content, that looks good. My view is that low sec space simply needs to be more 'flavoursome' - not necessarily better than 0.0, or High Sec but simply a really interesting place to hang out. Ive already posted a number of ideas on this (see my sig or here for a more detailed explanation of the same. But as a quick example, lets say that 'Gambling Dens' are illegal in high sec space, but not in Low Sec: then we can see our fat empire hauler pilot, leap into a frigate and fly into low sec to indulge in his particular vice - gambling. Thats more interesting in 'game' terms to me than 'boost low sec rats', which seems a bit of a cop out. C. |
Lo3d3R
Mos Eisley Social Club |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:43:00 - [ 12]
Edited by: Lo3d3R on 21/02/2008 13:44:54low-sec isnt broken, stop making these threats  , uhh i mean threads. hint:low-sec is more exciting and fun then 0.0. |
Luh Windan
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
|
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:43:00 - [ 13]
Edited by: Luh Windan on 21/02/2008 13:43:44 Originally by: Lil'Red Ridin'Hood
[
Always the same pile of sht. Spouting some catchy phrase you've heard in the noob help channel again?
Show me the pirate that complains about too few targets.
The "fix low-sec" complaints almost exclusively come from people not living there. Go fix your own part of space and leave low-sec alone. We like it as it is.
Well ignoring your charming manner - I am prepared to accept your argument that it isn't low-sec'ers complaining about it being broken. And in either case I fully agree with your conclusion. I find myself wondering how the 'fix XYZ' people get on in RL - do they write to the government asking them to fix the country for them? |
RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
Black Viper Nomads
|
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:44:00 - [ 14]
Make all EvE 0.0. Make POS's blow-uppable by small fleets instead of blobs. Let chaos rule |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:48:00 - [ 15]
Shaemell Buttleson To take it in other words you want to place cheese in the snake(pirates)hole to make the the fat rat(mission runners) show up but in the end it will be the eagle(0.0 alliances) that gets them both... If so its just easier to turn lowsec to 0.0  |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 13:53:00 - [ 16]
Cailais The idea is to get more ppl to pew pew in lowsec and give an incitament for it  I like the idea of red blue faction war but still its better if those so called leet pirates who sits gatecamping day out and day in actually had to work for their food. No more fat "player rats" to feed them but instead it will be more like the hyena and the lion... |
Cipher7 |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:00:00 - [ 17]
How to fix lowsec.
Put 3-4 ore types in lowsec THAT CANNOT BE FOUND ANYWHERE ELSE.
Put lucrative (matching 0.0) plexes in lowsec.
There is absolute NO reason why lowsec should not provide AS MUCH resources and cash as 0.0, since it is harder to secure than 0.0 and often more dangerous than 0.0
Put 0.0 resources in lowsec and I would join any corp that wants to go down there to plex, rat and generally kill people.
I was living in lowsec since day 3 as a newbie, I love the danger but its not good for making money.
I need more money than lowsec can provide me.
Every time I have to warp out when someone jumps me, I lose money.
Quite frankly I stopped living in lowsec because I can't afford to spend 5 hours to make 10 million, when I can spend 2 hours and make 10 million in highsec.
Highsec doesn't need to be nerfed, lowsec needs to be BUFFED, by a factor of 3.
It should provide the same cash-making opportunities as 0.0 because it is as dangerous or moreso than 0.0
|
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:04:00 - [ 18]
Cipher7 what would you do against the alliances that would claim lowsec ? because it would take a matter of weeks before all lowsec would be filled with roaming alliance groups defending their space... |
Cipher7 |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:09:00 - [ 19]
Originally by: Zenofix Draco
Cipher7 what would you do against the alliances that would claim lowsec ? because it would take a matter of weeks before all lowsec would be filled with roaming alliance groups defending their space...
And how would they "defend" their space without station access control, sovereignty or bubbles? Will they camp every gate 24x7 They can't even do that in 0.0 I'd be thrilled if a big alliance tried to claim lowsec, because they'd look like a bunch of chumps. |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:18:00 - [ 20]
Well there is alot more 0.0 space than lowsec so
if lowsec ended up with better rewards than 0.0 we would se
alliances securing their 0.0 poses closest to lowsec with roaming parties on almost constant patrol.
Since why defending 0.0 space wide space when its the second best area ?
|
Cipher7 |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:18:00 - [ 21]
Originally by: Zenofix Draco
Well there is alot more 0.0 space than lowsec so
if lowsec ended up with better rewards than 0.0 we would se
alliances securing their 0.0 poses closest to lowsec with roaming parties on almost constant patrol.
Since why defending 0.0 space wide space when its the second best area ?
And why would 0.0 suddenly become the second best area? |
Serathii
The Nietzian Way
Hydra Alliance |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:21:00 - [ 22]
how to fix lowsec: make it so its actually lowsec, gateguns are not security, so this is basicly npc 0.0 closer to empire, for tanked ships.
the gateguns are only at gates and stations,gates are camped alot, so basicly, theres no security in lowsec, exept against frigates, basicly making lowsec a bad version of 0.0 with only tanked ships, and nobody able to claim sov.
now if there would actually be some (low) security in there, it might actually be worth going for noobs, because as it is now, lowsec is just a fast way to get your insurance payout(at least for going there first time) |
Shaemell Buttleson |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:21:00 - [ 23]
Originally by: Cipher7
Originally by: Zenofix Draco
Cipher7 what would you do against the alliances that would claim lowsec ? because it would take a matter of weeks before all lowsec would be filled with roaming alliance groups defending their space...
And how would they "defend" their space without station access control, sovereignty or bubbles?
Will they camp every gate 24x7
They can't even do that in 0.0
I'd be thrilled if a big alliance tried to claim lowsec, because they'd look like a bunch of chumps.
Agreed, no bubbles/sovreignty/jump portals/HIC bubbles will make it different with sentry guns protecting everyone even though anything bigger than a cruiser can tank them easily. Don't forget alot of the alliance members do not want negative security so they can come and go in hi-sec as and when they feel like it and the bounties from rats and lack of faction/officer spawns will not apeal to them either Now lets see if the prat quotes me with a crappy poem to make him look cool again!  |
Cipher7 |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:23:00 - [ 24]
Highsec : Low risk/Medium reward
Nullsec : Medium risk/High reward
Lowsec : High risk/Low reward
That's what we have now.
Highsec and Nullsec scale properly.
Lowsec does not.
|
baltec1 |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:29:00 - [ 25]
I have a rather easy way to get more people into low sec. Pirates stop blasting everything that moves  |
Riddick Valer |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:29:00 - [ 26]
Make sentry guns only attack some targets based on security of the system.
.4 Does not attack t1 frigs
.3 Does not attack t1 frigs+cruisers and t2 frigs
.2 Only attacks T2 BC, BS, and caps
.1 Attacks BS+Caps only.
Then, change the sentry guns. Have them shoot torps instead of being turrets. The missiles should be slightly faster and have a higher explosive velocity then regular player missiles. This means that the damage would be tiered according to the size of the targets. Not every gatecamp would be Hacs, BCs, BS, and caps. In fact, there would be an incentive to use interceptors or other smaller ships, as their small size would mitigate the gate guns damage. Every ship would have the possibility of tanking the damage, either through pure tanking ability (BS) or smaller size (Cruisers and frigs). In fact, large ships would be a bit of liability as they would take a lot of damage in some systems.
This would tier entry into low-sec and allow increasing
levels of fights as you progress from hi-sec to low-sec. People might be more interested in entry if they didn't have the huge fear of a BS/Command/Cap gatecamp in the first .4. |
Zenofix Draco |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:31:00 - [ 27]
True with low reward/high risk but instead for changing it into something similar to nullsec why not encourage its current athmospeare ?
Lowsec atm is kinda like the pirate hideouts so why not
then appeal to a faction war between highsec "policeforce" and the pirates like the one I suggested ?
Would also show many mission runners how fun pvp can be
whithout they need to put the time and effort often needed in an nullsec alliance.
|
Cipher7 |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:42:00 - [ 28]
Originally by: Zenofix Draco
Would also show many mission runners how fun pvp can be
Mission ship <> PvP ship Go take a t2 fitted CNR to lowsec for a demonstration of why. Also most people who run missions do so to support their PvP activities, they do not need to be "shown" how much fun it is to PvP, they already know, that's why they're running missions. What do you think, people just run missions all day long in highsec? And they just do that every day and they don't do anything else? IT'S A BUSINESS SON. I run missions to make MONEY, I don't give a crap about the damsel, I'm there to make benjamins. Also I dont think we need any more NPC bullschit. Quite frankly the NPC storyline sucks and %99.9999 of people don't care. They just want to kill something and get paid. Decent mods, decent bounties, decent roids. Let the reward match the risk. Lowsec is high risk, it should have high reward. |
Falkrich Swifthand
Caldari
eNinjas Incorporated
|
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:42:00 - [ 29]
Edited by: Falkrich Swifthand on 21/02/2008 14:42:42 Originally by: Cipher7
Highsec : Low risk/Medium reward
Nullsec : Medium risk/High reward
Lowsec : High risk/Low reward
More like: For PvE: Highsec : Low risk/Medium-High reward Lowsec : High risk/High reward Nullsec : Medium risk/High reward For Pirates: Highsec : V.High risk/V.High reward Lowsec : Medium risk/High reward Nullsec : V.High risk/??? reward For PvE players, there isn't much more reward for going to Lowsec or Nullsec compared to Level 4 High-sec missions. For Pirates it's quite dangerous to be anywhere except Lowsec. |
SoftRevolution |
Posted - 2008.02.21 14:49:00 - [ 30]
Edited by: SoftRevolution on 21/02/2008 14:53:57This Quote:
After that how about setting up pirate complexes sites in 0.4-0.1 with specialised AI rats that force mission runners to have a pvp setup. That means ECM and EW to take down the rats and that give average bounties but LP for a specialised item shop.
is actually interesting but it's hard to see who'd go do them in preference to the existing missions. It also doesn't really address the basic complaint which is I believe "It's possible for people to play EVE in a fashion which means I can't kill them easily." I remain totally unconvinced by the "economist" approach to this. I sincerely doubt the guys just doing PvE are going to suddenly want to PvP (if undocking is consenting to PvP going into low sec is actively seeking it). How's about some incentive / reward scheme (beyond the other guy's stuff) for PVPing in low sec? Is that what factional warfare is supposed to be? Make the PvP content more worthwhile rather than the PvE content less worthwhile? |
All Channels
EVE General Discussion
