| Author |
Topic |
Tomahawk Bliss
Minmatar
Fates Assembly
The Final Stand. |
Posted - 2004.01.23 21:43:00 - [ 1]
You know I don't mine, I do occationally haul for an opp but I'm not a Miner so I don't claim to udnerstand how you can sit in one spot all day long and bore into roids, that is boring.
How ever a concern I wanted to bounce out here before I post it in another forum at the Devs and such.
Battleship strip mining. Since NPCS are really dangerous now for cruiser pilots you don't see many low skilled or solo cruiser mining in low sec empire sapce any more. And yet the high sec is being stripped away.
Before the NPC spinach boost (does it make up for bad AI?) Newbies would be stuck in like 0.6 and up while cruiser could mine in any empire space and really only large groupd of cruiser or BS could mine in 0.0 (mainly PC problems)
Now every cruiser and frigate miners seems crammed in 1.0-0.6 and no one but a lone BS can mine any thing else with out major problems. Doesn't this just lead to high sec being stripped bare? Wasn't high sec for people who were in tiny ships that couldn't mine vs. NPCs?
And I don't udnerstand how NPC altering would push people into 0.0, the number one "problem" (fun) is the Players. THe ones that rove around all day every day looking for miners to shoot.
My concern is that this game will be back to hwat it was pre-castor and the refresh of belts, dead and empty for my mining friends, who then have to become fighters ande ven then with a mining set up they can't go toe to toe with a PvP set up.
Most big groups and skilled players don't seemt o have a problem mining in 0.0, I know I spend about 70% of my time out there shooting at NPCs and the like. But what of the new players, I would hate to just now start playing and try to make isk off of mining :/
Maybe I'm off here, maybe there isn't a mining problem, but once the rocks get mined out the regrowth isn't much so...we will be back to pre-castor right?
Tomahawk Bliss,
Concerned |
RagnarH
Minmatar
MASS |
Posted - 2004.01.23 21:54:00 - [ 2]
Edited by: RagnarH on 23/01/2004 21:54:38only 2day I've mined from 12-9 (with 1 hour of break to go and buy myself new chair  ) so that's make 8 hours just 2day, but it's worth it |
Angst
Viziam
|
Posted - 2004.01.23 23:44:00 - [ 3]
 Quote:
only 2day I've mined from 12-9 (with 1 hour of break to go and buy myself new chair)
omg,you poor guy  |
WhiteDwarf
Caldari
Battlestars |
Posted - 2004.01.23 23:52:00 - [ 4]
Yeah, it's sad to see the roid belts in high sec space bare.
I mine solo in a Thorax, I try to strike a good balance between NPC rats & ore. I go to the lowest sec system where I can handle the rats with 8 heavy drones... Mainly because I like to collect loot as well as ore, and the higher bounty pirates drop some better stuff.
I think if everyone did this, it would balance this issue out. But some people just can't play by the rules, they must break them, and take the easiest way out as possible (noob space BS afk mining), even if it makes the game more boring for them, and harder to play for those who need 1.0 space for mining to get started... |
Sorrento
Caldari |
Posted - 2004.01.24 00:00:00 - [ 5]
I have several close friends who all strip mine roid belts in 1.0-0.5 systems....
while i feel this is wrong, i can understand why they do it, as more often than not, you'll be mining away in 0.4 or below and some ******* will start shooting at you, and more often than not pod kill you.....
i myself am getting a bs soon and following their advice, sticking to safe space to mine and npc hunt, although i'd prefer to go to low sec space,the risk outweighs the benefits. |
Crias Taylor
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation |
Posted - 2004.01.24 00:02:00 - [ 6]
Edited by: Crias Taylor on 24/01/2004 00:03:52
I was trying to find a belt to mind when i was just starting for a week. Every damn field I hit in 1.0 and down to .8 was striped till I got on a .8 that bordered a .7 and even then I got lucky to find any roids and had to run from the pirates that would have spanked my n00b ship. |
Blade Durrant |
Posted - 2004.01.24 01:57:00 - [ 7]
As i keep saying the worst (or only) griefer is the 1.0-.9 battleship miner. All he does is screw the n00b. |
F4ze
Gallente
D00M.
RED.OverLord |
Posted - 2004.01.24 02:05:00 - [ 8]
Not alot of people mine in 0.0 in a battleship, it's just too risky. |
pooti
Sebiestor Tribe |
Posted - 2004.01.24 04:07:00 - [ 9]
bs empire strip mining, grid mining outside of empire...miners are the dirtiest money-*****s on eve.
They probably sell the ISK on ebay too. Yet another reason to pirate. |
Archemedes
Gallente
Omnitrend |
Posted - 2004.01.24 09:12:00 - [ 10]
I can't imagine mining in a 1.0 system in a battleship unless you just need a quick load of ore and happen to be there at the time (agent mission, building some ammo, etc...) The ore is lousy and there are a ton of ore thieves (if you use unsecured cans). A 0.5 or 0.6 system has better ore, no PC rats, and no NPCs that can bother a battleship (you don't even have to kill them, you just turn on a large shield booster and ignore them!) The only reason to mine in 0.9+ space is if you have Harvester drones (NPCs like shooting drones and they cost a LOT to replace) or a frigate. Cruisers can easily mine in 0.7 or 0.8 and ignore the rats, or mine in 0.5 and kill them. Personally, I mine in 0.5 systems in my Apocalypse (I don't equip guns so I avoid 0.4 or under) when I need a bunch of low-end ore for my agent, and I go to a 0.1 or 0.2 system for Jaspet (also for the agent) and bring 4 guns. As for 0.0 space, I only go there alone if I'm in a frigate, because the NPCs can eat a lone Apoc for lunch if you happen to warp in on top of a big group, and a solo cruiser can't collect any loot even if you DO make kills. As for solo mining (without using exploits)... no way. Maybe if CCP changes NPC rat AIs to ignore mining drones, people will leave 0.9+ space to mine... or else put Harvester BPs in the game so people can replace them cheap!  |
Kunming
Amarr
T.H.U.G L.I.F.E
Xenon-Empire |
Posted - 2004.01.24 09:16:00 - [ 11]
Quote:
bs empire strip mining, grid mining outside of empire...miners are the dirtiest money-*****s on eve.
They probably sell the ISK on ebay too. Yet another reason to pirate.
This is the most childish comment I ever read! I mine long hours and earn my ISKs honestly, AND NOT TO SELL ON E-BAY!! I know a couple of ppl that have bought ISKs from e-bay and I heavily criticised that action! Think before u act... |
Sally
Caldari |
Posted - 2004.01.24 09:25:00 - [ 12]
Sorry, I don't see a problem here. U can mine in 0.2 in a Thorax with 8 heavy drones easily. |
MSDborris
Gallente
The Scope |
Posted - 2004.01.24 10:11:00 - [ 13]
i dont understand why ccp never made the npc spawn to match whats in the belt ie 3 battleships mining npc spawn's 2 bs 4 cruisers to match those battle ship's...
so then if u got a fleet of 6 battle ships all tanked for fighting and npc spawn you get 4 bs 8 cruiser's spawn to attack.. it would make npc hunting harder / more rewarding ! and yet make bs strip mining even harder.
but i dont think npc battle ship spawning in empire space would be abit erm too much. |
Xtreem
Gallente
The Collective
White Noise. |
Posted - 2004.01.24 11:19:00 - [ 14]
i mine 0.5 0.4 and 0.3 in my cruiser, and it can be annying when a PC warps in and starts to shed my sheilds, but its given me the chnace to get some good setups on my ships, so i can mine, yet still escape, so if u never leave 1.0 u will never gain the best setup.
|
Skillshot
Free Minmatar Science and Industry Conglomerate |
Posted - 2004.01.24 11:20:00 - [ 15]
hehe cleaning out roid fields in the right locations help stimulate the market for the day.. the less ore thier is the more its worth.
Plus its fun :P ( but i dont mine i hunt rats )
|
Saldara |
Posted - 2004.01.24 11:23:00 - [ 16]
What I find so funny is that people are so unwilling to risk themselves for just a little while. Yes, the universe can be a dangerous place but there usually isn't a pirate waiting to PK you in .3 or .4 space. I have only been attacked once while mining in .3 space and that was because the other guy decided to become a pirate right there and then. Other than that I have found that empire space is full of asteroids that are growing and growing without anyone being brave enough to go mine them. My last mining foray into .3 space found Jaspet rocks around 5K in size. It's nto as difficult as you may think. |
slothe
Caldari
Jian Products Engineering Group
Atlas. |
Posted - 2004.01.24 11:33:00 - [ 17]
my corp have recently been strip mining safe belts en masse
why?
because we need low grade minerals for production.
i dont see wht people should have a problem with that..why go into 0.0 or 0.3 to strip-mine veldspar lol |
Karol Kei
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction |
Posted - 2004.01.24 11:34:00 - [ 18]
Ooh, the need to rant surfaces...
BS mining in Empire is not a problem. Problem are the pricks that actually go into newbie systems and strip those. Whoever stripped Amsen the other day - nice one.
I am a BS miner. I spend most of my time in not only Empire space, but also in a newbie corp channel. Instructing newbies about how to target an asteroid, what is the best frigate to buy for the first one, and what is the market. And how to undock. And how exactly does one train a skill, and that it is clever to leave a bigger one to train over night and do lvl 1s while he plays. Etc, etc, etc. Night after night.
I celebrate with a newbie buying his first bantam, being very careful not to diminish his accomplishment by badly placed word. Or cheer the killing of the first NPC, or avoiding whoever is in turn to camp Aurohunen etc. Or comfort them when they didn't avoid being killed, and try to make sure that they don't grow up as pirate haters, but understand the necessity for pirates and pkers in a game. And I am not the only one there. We have a very nice bunch of people that help newbies, and - the horror - a few others of them are BS miners as well, like I am.
If that makes us the problem as far as newbies are concerned and a griefer in the eyes of some others, I have only one thing to say: Have a whole bloody cake. We stay well out of newbie systems with battleships for several reasons, and only one of them is the problem with the stripped belts. Can you guess some of the others?
On the actual problem: Is there a list of starter systems somewhere? Linking that would make it easy for every one who cares about the game not to strip those particular systems "by accident".
As far as BS mining in empire in general is concerned, I can only speak for myself. I will only consider stopping when it is more profitable to do something else. That is the nature of the beast, and especially so in this game. Indep has only so many possibilities, and if he doesn't wish to exploit grid, there is one less.
When risk/reward of something else is more lucrative for me, in my situation, skills and resources, I might switch. I guess missions already might be, but I am not sure. Notice however, that mining is pretty perfect for me, considering that it is so mind numblingly boring that I have a lot of time to A) type on the newbie channel and B) read the forums about things I can try out and then teach the newbies.
I am an indep because I want to stay on the newbie channel for now. I have been close to moving on twice, and right now I am in the third such phase for me. Helping newbies out makes me happy, saving them from clueless CEOs of worthless corps wanting newbies for mining slaves - or just to "do whatever they want" is also necessary.
Do you people calling me a griefer have any idea how hard it is to convince a day old player to not take a "free cruiser" without compromising the joy of the next achievement in game by the same newbie? It is not like I can say that a cruiser is worth about an hour or two, when I want to make sure he enjoys every step he advances in the game to the fullest. Even and especially the first ones. It is not like I can give them money either to compensate for the "lost" cruiser. If I give a newbie money, what exactly are his first goals in game that he can hope to achieve in short enough timeframe to keep the feeling of advancement? Right, there aren't any, and I would have just ruined days worth of gaming for him - number of the days depending on amount of money I gave him. More the worse.
We have a bloody nice newbie channel, even if I say so myself. There are plenty of experienced veterans there to teach the newbies the ropes, and quite a few of us not-veterans, but a few-month-olds. If I could hope for one thing, it would be a capable PvP tutor for the channel, as we lost the last one before christmas as he quit the game. Any one needing help gets it, even with PvP, though quality of that instruction is not necessarily the best at all times. Obviously we are lucky to have some alts in the channel every now and then. :)
A couple of weeks spent in the channel, and the newbie is quite ready to ashame most of the CEOs coming into the channel recruiting them as far as the knowledge and understanding of the game is concerned. Even more so they can actually help themselves to information they need, including how to find a corporation to suit their needs should they feel like moving on.
And yet, here is this dude saying I am a griefer and that I screw up the newbies. Pfff. |
Chepe Nolon
Gallente
Inquest |
Posted - 2004.01.24 12:09:00 - [ 19]
I posted a rant like this at once I saw my favourite 0.5 system became a 0.4, and I heard that it was impossible to mine like before in 0.0.
And I'm still a member of Angry Nerfed Miners. I mine in 1.0, 0.9, 0.8 and all the way to 0.3. If I stripmine out the newbs? So what? It isn't me that loses new players and money on a bad reputation? I've paid for this game, I believe in this game, and it's my right to mine wherever there is roids left. It doesn't have any rules that says "no bs mining in 1.0". And don't tell me it isn't profitable to mine veldspar and plagioclase with a full set of miner2ers and harvester drones close to a station where I have 0% tribute, compared to Ninja mining in 0.0?
CCP has made the game nearly as it should be. Less ore around, so the prices on everything but the common loot would rise. Too bad newbs have to join a corp to be able to play the game...
I've stripmined some belts in Duripant, systems around alentene (cistuvaert and alenia was gone before I got there), I've never touched lumi or yulai, but I've made some roids dissapear in Mies, Adreland and Pettinck and other systems around there. And our corp is making one belt dissapear every 4 hours in other parts of the galaxy. (Though 0.5 and up)
But don't call me an afk miner. I see almost every roid I mine crumble. It's my kind of reward for gettin my corp on it's feet again. I've never used macros.
(Btw, we tried to establish ourselves in 0.0 as a part of FA, but thanks to the recent dev-supported attack on FA, we lost so many vessels, that we have to reside in empire space a few months more. Kudos to everybody part of that attack! You are supporting the stripmining in 1.0.) |
DREAMWORKS
Gallente
Gangbang-Gang
GUARDS 0F AVALON |
Posted - 2004.01.24 13:05:00 - [ 20]
Edited by: DREAMWORKS on 24/01/2004 13:05:47
All these people whining? Ok, strip mining maybe a bliss but more mined is further development in Eve/dropping prices for buying customers...
However i wish that battleships couldn't mine at all, atleast not in 0.1 and higher. |
WhiteDwarf
Caldari
Battlestars |
Posted - 2004.01.24 16:08:00 - [ 21]
"However I wish that battleships couldn't mine at all, atleast not in 0.1 and higher"
Well, if that's the case, then I don't want pirates to be allowed in BS's in systems 0.1 and higher. Seems only fair, right? |
Ezekiel Nailo
Minmatar
COBRA INC |
Posted - 2004.01.24 16:24:00 - [ 22]
If i mine i mine in my thorax in 0.0 (ninja mining ark) as that is more profitable then mining veldspar for a day. exspecially if you can find a spot as pirates leave the belt and then mine for 45 minuites while no pirates are in the belt. |
Funky Monkey
Minmatar |
Posted - 2004.01.24 16:58:00 - [ 23]
Quote:
As i keep saying the worst (or only) griefer is the 1.0-.9 battleship miner. All he does is screw the n00b.
Really?? Not the Lame Gate Gankers. they are not to blame... the NPC spawn that makes it near impossible to mine in SECURE EMPIRE SPACE!! of below .5 ... certainly the constant CTD's lag problems are not at fault.. oh and of course the insane insurance rates to keep your ship are in no way responsible for people being unwilling to venture below .5 security.. I'll not risk a ship that I cannot replace relatively easily.... if you want someone to point fingers at.. why not at game mechanics that promote Lag Ganking... and insane NPC spawns FORCING these "lame Miners" to stay in relative safety. Jumping Jayzus... get a grip CCP please.. this game has so many great points, but is being ruined by ill concieved mechanics and implementations. |
Aurora
Caldari |
Posted - 2004.01.24 18:27:00 - [ 24]
Quote:
I mine solo in a Thorax, I try to strike a good balance between NPC rats & ore. I go to the lowest sec system where I can handle the rats with 8 heavy drones... Mainly because I like to collect loot as well as ore, and the higher bounty pirates drop some better stuff.
I think if everyone did this, it would balance this issue out
I do the same as you, I'm currently mining in an 0.3 system, sometimes 0.2 with just my Thorax and some heavy drones my only protection. I don't mine all the time either, it's good to go npc hunting too...I'm certainly not having any real trouble mining out there anyway,it's a challenge but more fun |
Dudle
Imperial Shipment |
Posted - 2004.01.24 23:06:00 - [ 25]
I mine in a BS but it's only in 0.4 or under. Whilst I agree that mining out the starter systems should be avoided I see no reason for anyone in any ship to mine where they like.
There is plenty of ore to go round! I flew through a 0.9 today with an alt and there were loads of decent roids and no NPC's. |
Tenacha Khan
TunDraGon |
Posted - 2004.01.25 01:07:00 - [ 26]
Edited by: Tenacha Khan on 25/01/2004 01:14:59 Quote:
Not alot of people mine in 0.0 in a battleship, it's just too risky.
Risky??? your having a laugh right, lots of people mine in 0.0, its just the people who never go there sya that it is really risky. And as for the npcs..lmfao, any bs can take on most of the spawns, gurustas being the most difficult and will need to bs. Its extremely easy to mine in 0.0, I would even go as far to say that it is easier than 1.0, cause you can use jettied cans and not run the risk of an ore theif, all it takes is a bit of cunning and to be alert. Here is a pic, sry for all the editing, but some things must be kept a secret, look inside the can and what it says for the can capacity too  Be nice to them and they will be nice to you |
pooti
Sebiestor Tribe |
Posted - 2004.01.25 01:27:00 - [ 27]
Quote:
Quote:
As i keep saying the worst (or only) griefer is the 1.0-.9 battleship miner. All he does is screw the n00b.
Really?? Not the Lame Gate Gankers. they are not to blame... the NPC spawn that makes it near impossible to mine in SECURE EMPIRE SPACE!! of below .5 ... certainly the constant CTD's lag problems are not at fault.. oh and of course the insane insurance rates to keep your ship are in no way responsible for people being unwilling to venture below .5 security..
I'll not risk a ship that I cannot replace relatively easily.... if you want someone to point fingers at.. why not at game mechanics that promote Lag Ganking... and insane NPC spawns FORCING these "lame Miners" to stay in relative safety.
Jumping Jayzus... get a grip CCP please.. this game has so many great points, but is being ruined by ill concieved mechanics and implementations.
Please, the spawns in .1+ space are NOTHING. I've been popping around belts (.1-.3) in Aridia and Khanid testing my agent mission ship and the toughest pirate I've found was a 12.5k frigate (and I've only seen one of them). Average has been 4-8, and I've never seen more than 5 in one belt. I mean if you have a battleship you should have figure out how to mine in low-sec empire space by now. You guys whine too much. |
Cael |
Posted - 2004.01.25 02:54:00 - [ 28]
Yawn this is old. The real issue is NOT the harder NPC's, it's simply that from 0.4 to a few 0.0 systems the best ore to be found is jaspet. In the "higher sec" 0.0 system rats get too tough for solo mining, and even there the ores pretty much s-uck. The ores only get interesting in those 0.0 systems where loads of cruiser NPC's will spawn on top of you  |
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