Posted - 2007.05.27 13:01:00 - [3391]

 

Edited by: Junkie Beverage on 27/05/2007 13:00:40
Edited by: Junkie Beverage on 27/05/2007 13:00:02

Originally by: kioraa

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high trees catch a lot of wind.

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I think the phrase you were looking for was actually "don't let the fox guard the henhouse."

:page114snypa:

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:05:00 - [3393]

 

Edited by: Nostic on 27/05/2007 13:09:04

Originally by: kioraa

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First off, CCP personel will not need to join a corp in order to see what they're building in a POS to relay that info to "their corp mates". They will have first hand access to the game databases no doubt so those allegations are big big bull****.

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I don't know what position sharkbait holds, so I'm just throwing this out there, but it's possible that he DOESN'T have access to the database and didn't ask a coworker for the information because he knows it's unethical. This will likeley be easy for CCP to clear up for us, either he has a legitimate reason or he's fired. However, it's the other allegations that are most disturbing as it seems systematic from years of recruiting from the playerbase, and there are no valid excuses for such conduct, only promises that they'll gain some professionalism.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:08:00 - [3395]

 

Originally by: Avon

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My failure is clearly indcated by the number of people trying to shut me up / derail me.

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There's a difference between derailing and rerailing.

On that note I'm curious as to what possible reason you could have for wanting to keep allegations of developer misconduct hidden from the general populace.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:08:00 - [3397]

 

Quote:

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How about as a way forward and peace of mind that there is a channel ingame created were a representative of each alliance can sit and be feriendly and civil and CCP can sit and WHEN there is an issue. It can be discussed and THEN relevent petitions raised as and when needed.

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I'd like to ++ this (ironically, posted by a BoB member). It's a possible solution - maybe not the best, but it's constructive.

-Alpha

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:11:00 - [3399]

 

CCP employees should'nt be playing the game - period

Let's get it out in the open. Who are devs, and close their accounts.

Let the paying players play the game and the rest focus on developing the game.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:12:00 - [3401]

 

Originally by: Sigmorhair

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Originally by: Crux Australis

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I stopped reading at page 90-something.

The highlights that I have worked out are:

- bob cheats (ingame and out of game)
- bob has preferential treatment (ingame and out of game)
- ccp condones/supports bob cheating (ingame and out of game)
- ccp is aligned in first person with bob (ingame and out of game)
- the game is rigged
- non bob aligned entities cannot win since the deck is stacked against them
- at this point nothing that ccp does can restore the trust of a part of the player base whish is feeling betrayed/cheated/etc

I am not going to debate anything here, but just to add my 0,02 isk:

- If you feel that you are victims of a/many wrongdoing/s
- If you think that ccp doesn't care and hence will try to cover up/unjustly ban/silence and then continue in its behaviour

Then you have only one option left (I don't know if lawsuits are an option in this case and I'm not an e-lawyer (or rl lawyer)).

This option is: hurt them where it matters, deny them income, cancel subscription.

There is no point in paying who is making hell of your free, chill out time.
Right?

I for one would/will do it if/when the time comes.

Am I biased because I am a bobbit?
Probably, but hey.

Have a nice day.

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Another Bob admits to cheating - I guess this is sort of refreshing really.

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Hehe, not so clever attemp at trolling.

I bolded the part that should interest you more.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:14:00 - [3403]

 

Originally by: Prall Grosserbauch

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Originally by: Avon

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My failure is clearly indcated by the number of people trying to shut me up / derail me.

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There's a difference between derailing and rerailing.

On that note I'm curious as to what possible reason you could have for wanting to keep allegations of developer misconduct hidden from the general populace.

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I'm curious as to what possible reason GoonSwarm could have for wanting to make allegations look like facts.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:16:00 - [3405]

 

Originally by: Carl Bowmore

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Goon T2 Dramabomb hitts forum wrecking for OMGWTFBBQ dmg. Get a life and some perspective ppl.

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So its Goons fault that CCP is corrupt....odd logic. Shoot the messenger and hope the problem goes away. It worked last time around, just ban all those that dare to expose the cheating and bias that goes on.
All GM and DEV's should stop playing on TQ. If if makes so little difference to alliances like BOB, then they wont complain will they There is absolutely no need for GM to play on TQ. It is ironic that one reason they claim is "to improve the playing experience" No wonder the Lag is never addressed with all the DEVs playing the game instead of working on it

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:17:00 - [3407]

 

Originally by: Alice Cholmondeley

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I'm curious as to what possible reason GoonSwarm could have for wanting to make allegations look like facts.

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Allegations like these you mean?

Originally by: Dianabolic

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You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?

And you're now complaining that we speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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We have a "special" line (if you want to call msn that) to our FRIENDS.

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Now we look at the method of contact GS member has to petition it BoB member can MSN it.

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Posted - 2007.05.27 13:18:00 - [3409]

 

Originally by: Effei Gloom

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Edited by: Effei Gloom on 27/05/2007 12:38:23

Originally by: Toffles

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Edited by: Toffles on 27/05/2007 12:18:32

Originally by: D'Artagnan

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I am interested to know what would have happened if the situation had been reversed.

Now lets see what would have happened if a ISD frigate had bumped a GS dread.

GS pilot: leave local
ISD pilot: No

GS pilot writes a petition.

GM reads the petition checks the logs the ISD pilot gets fired.

The end result is a CCP employee gets fired for misconduct, as they are not meant to influence the game (bumping is influencing it) and if requested they are meant to leave local.

Now GS pilot post thread on the forums stating how ISD were helping BoB and the community goes in to anti BoB overdrive.

Now we look at the method of contact GS member has to petition it BoB member can MSN it.

Does this effect the end result? Nope
Does this effect the in game balance? Nope believe it or not the firing of the ISD member had zero effect on the outcome of the fight/war

Maybe if CCP had spawned 100 titans to BoB you would have a case, but as it stands there is no case here just a load of what ifs.

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This looks fun, let me try:

Coalition puts a bunch of pos's into reinforced. The next day they show up to finish them as they exit reinforced. However, a bug has struck and all the towers are exiting reinforced with full shields. The coalition files petitions frantically as the towers slowly do this same behavior one after the other. Finally a GM shows up and says he can't help you because his logs don't show anything. Tough luck.

Now, BoB does the exact same thing. Sees the same bug happening, gets GM buddy to show up right away and the issue is fixed before every tower has exited reinforced.

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POS towers that are back to full shield instead of leaving reinforced mode, i remember this was petitioned during the ASCN <-> BOB war.

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Did anybody find out what happened to all the EDF poses which mysteriously went off line in that war?I mean,BoB suggested it was a spy/disgruntled EDF member but with all the stuff thats been going on I'm starting to wonder if it could have been done by some other means.

Let us suppose a Dev in BoB says to Molle "I have a spy in EDF.He can offline POSes for us" but instead he abuses his powers to offline them.

Would BoBs MSN contacts within CCP allow them to know about system caps for example?

Do paying customers think it's right for other players to have a hotline to CCP and be able to instantly contact a GM/ISD and get immediate action while the rest of the paying customers have to use a petition system which,at best,is inconsistent and slow?

Does any normal paying customer have the ability to have ISD members dismissed at the drop of a hat?

I'm sure that many members of BoB are ignorant to most of the stuff that happens but someone in BoB knows.Maybe only a few know exactly how far this goes but they themselves and CCP employees MUST be held accontable for the grief and bad publicity they have brought to this game.

CCP and BoB have a 'special' relationship-I accept that.
But how 'special' is it?

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:20:00 - [3411]

 

Edited by: Alice Cholmondeley on 27/05/2007 13:19:40

Originally by: Prall Grosserbauch

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Originally by: Alice Cholmondeley

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I'm curious as to what possible reason GoonSwarm could have for wanting to make allegations look like facts.

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Allegations like these you mean?

Originally by: Dianabolic

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You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?

And you're now complaining that we speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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We have a "special" line (if you want to call msn that) to our FRIENDS.

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Originally by: D'Artagnan

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Now we look at the method of contact GS member has to petition it BoB member can MSN it.

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No, allegations of wrongdoing. Talking to someone on msn is not wrongdoing. But please, answer the question.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:26:00 - [3413]

 

Originally by: Xooja

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Every turn was not taken. CCP internal affairs, which CCP set up after the t20 incident specifically to address the type of issue Darkstar 1 has but they were not contacted. Darkstar never gave IA a chance.

I am not Pro BOB, i am Pro EVE. Sections of Goonfleet's actions risk damaging EVE, regardless of perceived good intention.

There are multiple posts by Goon members in this thread that agree that this should have been restricted to just the Darkstar incident and that should have probably contacted IA. I would urge you to change the advisors that advised against contacting IA as there are better ways to achieve what you are trying to do, i.e. help CCP actively prevent any kind of cheating involving CCP staff.

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Are you kidding? they did this themselves. I could not bring myself to tell people how great eve is anymore.

Pro eve or not, this **** has to stop.

I dont care if goon destroy eve in game. So be it. It will be sad but thats how things are.
I do care if bob destroy eve and their constant cheating is rewarded.. if goon cheat, CCP will be there to ban, declare exploits, make public addresses, release hot fixes... but if bob cheat.... well...

Arkonor may be one of the most experienced GMs and very good at his job, but he is still part of the old crew... and with that come s the same misstrust that most of CCP can expect from those who havent been here since beta... and those who have, but not with bob.

And yet this venting is pointless. Because in another 20 or so pages one of the ISD heads will close this thread saying it is a flame fest and has no relevance anymore... then they will release tiny chunks of "information" and a press release trying to cover the asses of everyone still working for them (though im sure, they will shovel plenty of **** at those who have left, those with contracts that do not permit them to reply.) and then they will go back into turtle mode and wait it out.

Maybe they will get some work on rev 2.0 done finally... then again bob is sieging systems so im sure they'll be far to busy for work.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:27:00 - [3415]

 

Originally by: Alice Cholmondeley

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Talking to someone on msn is not wrongdoing.

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Yes it is, in that case. It is called "using insider".


Back on topic.
It almost looks like CCP managing staff is getting paid by SOE or some other competitor, as it they are doing their best to kill the good game lately.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:28:00 - [3417]

 

Edited by: Redora on 27/05/2007 13:28:16

Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Nyphur

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Originally by: Orange Species

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The community is a disgrace to itself.

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Considering your name is on the chatlogs in part of this story, could you perhaps comment on that rather than simply voicing your discontentment with every single other eve player?

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You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?

And you're now complaining that we speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?

Do you lot REALLY think that the "top" people, Hillmar and Oveur etc, are party to all of this? Of course they're not, this is their cash cow.

Get over yourselves.

Ya'll complain when something doesn't go your way, but I don't hear any of you complaining when the conversations any of us have with the very same people lead to bugs being fixed, oh no, because that's a benefit RIGHT?

(not directed at you, nyphur, jsut the general idiocy that is prevalent in this thread).

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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Originally by: Azerrad InExile

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Originally by: Dianabolic

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You do realise that, in a previous witch hunt, the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?

And you're now complaining that we speak to these people, who are also our friends, about stuff in-game?

Do you lot REALLY think that the "top" people, Hillmar and Oveur etc, are party to all of this? Of course they're not, this is their cash cow.

Get over yourselves.

Ya'll complain when something doesn't go your way, but I don't hear any of you complaining when the conversations any of us have with the very same people lead to bugs being fixed, oh no, because that's a benefit RIGHT?

(not directed at you, nyphur, jsut the general idiocy that is prevalent in this thread).

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So basically you do have a special line straight to the devs and presumably get special favors because of that? Thanks for confirming.

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We have a "special" line (if you want to call msn that) to our FRIENDS.

Even devs need friends, you know, they're not robots.

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So does that mean because a close friend of mine is a police officer, I should get away with Murder? Capitalizing on your 'friendship' with CCP Devs is equivilant to this, like it or not. If the relationship you admittedly have with Devs held true outside EVE, society as we know it would self-destruct. And unless CCP gets their ****ing act together and fixes this damn problem, EVE will self destruct as well. And then guess what? BoB, Goons, and NOBODY ELSE can "win" Eve. Having a special conduit doesn't mean you should make use of it, and even if you tried, I would expect the person in power to have the common sense, decency, and respect for the playerbase to say "You know, I really can't do that for you." Because it's not only good for HIM (he gets to keep his job) but good for US (non-Bobbitts) because we don't get a hot metal poker up the ass. This is ridiculous, and needs to be fixed ASAP.
I, personally, am calling for Dev Heads to roll and for the ISD Reporter to get his post back. Anything less is bull****. "Justice delayed is justice denied." So get it sorted CCP.

Posted - 2007.05.27 13:32:00 - [3419]

 

People here can really be pathetic... ban bob? lol yeah like thats a good idea. If you start down that road it just allows for any significant amount of whining to ban anyone and everyone. Yup using that logic we may as well all stop playing. I really think people need to understand that there are things in this game that aren't fair simply because of human impact and as long as humans are the ones playing it, it'll never be honest, fair or decent. Get used to it I say.