| Author |
Topic |
z0de
The Bastards
The Bastards. |
Posted - 2010.04.12 01:01:00 - [ 31]
I think self destruct should kill pods too unless they are ejected. For extra malice self destruct could have a smart bomb effect to it. |
DONJUAN v
Dashavatara
Clownz'R'Us |
Posted - 2010.04.12 20:44:00 - [ 32]
 Originally by: Emperor Cheney
How is any of this whinefest any different than a bunch of haulers complaining about lowsec ganks, or missionrunners complaining about pirates? Not everyone wants to play your game, deal. Just like that hauler you ganked on a gate probably wanted to reach his destination. Killmail posting is optional for a reason.
you are correct it shouldnt be different from haulers getting ganked you should get a mail listen you have a carrier and you f -ucked it up by getting tackled live with it i had a pos siege and carrier came to rep pos took us for ever , he tanked over 3.5m in damage and he died and i got a killmail if you want to ctrl+q when you see your losing thats cool with me but for a merc corp being paid by isk damage , i think km posting aint optional anyway fixing this wont change game play at all the guy sd and you get a kill with what ever little damage you did on him i rly don't see why anyone would have a problem with this |
stevenjackson007
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
|
Posted - 2010.04.12 21:21:00 - [ 33]
IMO, self-destructing is just as valid as podding, in fact they are quite the same in their own unique ways: the intent in both actions is (at least most often) to gain some personal satisfaction by insulting the other party in the final phase of battle. The aggressor who pods someone enjoys that final act of rubbing it in the target's face (and the squishy sound). The target who self-destructs enjoys depriving the aggressor of whatever satisfaction the aggressor might get from the killmail as well as any loot they might get from the kill by leaving behind little more than a cloud of smoke and hull fragments.
No one who pods people has a right to whine about other people self-destructing, and vice versa. They each have some more empirically valid points for their actions, as well, oftentimes.
Podding can remove a potential scout reporting back to his buddies, or deprive the goobound podboy of his implants thus costing him ISK and thus (to varying levels, of course) hurting his ability to wage war, mine, whatever.
Self-destructing can deny an enemy valuable loot that they could otherwise use to further their warfighting efforts (especially important in prolonged conflicts between corps/alliances, personal vendettas, etc).
So, it's really still a matter of personal choice opinion as to what you choose to do and your opinion as to why you think what you did is valid... do you want to be cold-blooded and brutal (podding/self-destruction), or honorable and kind-hearted (letting the pod go/leaving the loot intact through not self-destructing)? And, of course, one's idea of honor may not necessarily be shared by others and is ultimately a matter of opinon.
Personally, I am glad both options are on the table. |
Seriously Bored
Minmatar |
Posted - 2010.04.12 22:04:00 - [ 34]
Originally by: DONJUAN v
if i tackle your dread with my stabber and you cant hit me
i deserve to keep you tackled for how long i wish
if my gang is 42 jumps away
they deserve time to get there
your the one that does not deserve a quick death with your sd
your the one not having support for you capital
deal with it
The game currently favors his point of view. There is nothing for him to deal with. (Pirate tears are tastiest of all.) |
Demolishar |
Posted - 2010.04.13 03:39:00 - [ 35]
Because people who have the skill to take out much larger and tougher ships in smaller ships with little DPS through skillful piloting, should not get killmails. |
Ka choop |
Posted - 2010.04.13 04:15:00 - [ 36]
Originally by: DONJUAN v
Originally by: Marko Riva
SD is part of the game and if that pilot had enough time to complete the SD then the attacking party did something wrong. Whining about someone self destructing is no different from whining about someone using stabs who got away with it or whining about someone blowing you up.
Deal with it.
you sir make no sense at all.
if i tackle your dread with my stabber and you cant hit me (and I can't kill you)
i deserve to keep you tackled for how long i wish (or for as long the timer on the self destruct is)
if my gang is 42 jumps away (which is like on the other side of the galaxy)
they deserve time to get there (they deserve the time to come here before the self destruct timer ends)
your the one that does not deserve a quick death with your sd(I'm the one that doesn't deserve to keep someone here indefinately)
your the one not having support for you capital(And I'm the one not having a fleet close enough to kill the target quick enough to prevent him from selfdestructing)
deal with it(deal with it)
Seems like more people aren't making sense, btw I corrected your post. |
DONJUAN v
Dashavatara
Clownz'R'Us |
Posted - 2010.04.13 16:18:00 - [ 37]
Originally by: stevenjackson007
No one who pods people has a right to whine about other people self-destructing, and vice versa. They each have some more empirically valid points for their actions, as well, oftentimes.
Podding can remove a potential scout reporting back to his buddies, or deprive the goobound podboy of his implants thus costing him ISK and thus (to varying levels, of course) hurting his ability to wage war, mine, whatever.
Self-destructing can deny an enemy valuable loot that they could otherwise use to further their warfighting efforts (especially important in prolonged conflicts between corps/alliances, personal vendettas, etc). AND THE FREAKIN' KILLMAIL
you die and are left in a escape pod , theres no choice of killing it or not you kill it or it runs away . nobody will leave pod go , unless there in low sec not wanting sec penalty on the other hand , for sd . I GOT YOU , YOU KNOW YOUR GOING TO DIE , I WON , YOU CAN'T KILL ME . plz explain me why , in this situation , i don't deserve a killmail . i dont mind you sd and saving me time , i even dont mind not having loot (some ppl jetcan there stuff and shoot it befor they die anyway) . but the fact that it can stay secret from the records and be like it never happens , that only favors one kind of ppl . the losers that love theres kb stats btw comparing pod killing to sd stinks  and telling that you sd to prevent me from having your super loot that would finance my alliance for years to come |
Raymie |
Posted - 2010.04.13 16:36:00 - [ 38]
notify: you fail to self-destruct because you are being targeted by someone.
FIXED. |
Dmoney3788
Black Aces
Against ALL Authorities |
Posted - 2010.04.13 17:42:00 - [ 39]
Originally by: stevenjackson007
IMO, self-destructing is just as valid as podding, in fact they are quite the same in their own unique ways: the intent in both actions is (at least most often) to gain some personal satisfaction by insulting the other party in the final phase of battle. The aggressor who pods someone enjoys that final act of rubbing it in the target's face (and the squishy sound). The target who self-destructs enjoys depriving the aggressor of whatever satisfaction the aggressor might get from the killmail as well as any loot they might get from the kill by leaving behind little more than a cloud of smoke and hull fragments.
No one who pods people has a right to whine about other people self-destructing, and vice versa. They each have some more empirically valid points for their actions, as well, oftentimes.
Podding can remove a potential scout reporting back to his buddies, or deprive the goobound podboy of his implants thus costing him ISK and thus (to varying levels, of course) hurting his ability to wage war, mine, whatever.
Self-destructing can deny an enemy valuable loot that they could otherwise use to further their warfighting efforts (especially important in prolonged conflicts between corps/alliances, personal vendettas, etc).
So, it's really still a matter of personal choice opinion as to what you choose to do and your opinion as to why you think what you did is valid... do you want to be cold-blooded and brutal (podding/self-destruction), or honorable and kind-hearted (letting the pod go/leaving the loot intact through not self-destructing)? And, of course, one's idea of honor may not necessarily be shared by others and is ultimately a matter of opinon.
Personally, I am glad both options are on the table.
Ejecting from ships just before they pop is fun as well  |
Dett K5 |
Posted - 2010.04.13 17:57:00 - [ 40]
Edited by: Dett K5 on 13/04/2010 18:02:00 Originally by: Dmoney3788
Ejecting from ships just before they pop is fun as well
Too bad ejecting cancels a self-destruct sequence. The only actual concern with "self destructing" is the lack for generating a killmail, no? If a killmail were to be made, all the "QQ my target self destructed" whines would cease... but it wouldn't stop the act of self destructing. Also, the very purpose of a self destruction is to erase (protect) a record (or conceal something). In this case, by self destructing many can protect their fits, deny a km, produce some km-wh** tears, and deny a reliable record of the engagement ever happening. Self destructing is an honorable last stand anyway (seppuku!), or a time saver, and it works as intended. edit: as it has been previously suggested, what self destructing is missing is a damage-dealing explosion affecting those within a certain radius. (including the destruction of the pod inside the vessel, unless the pod ejects and escapes! Sadly, though, leaving the ship before it has self destructed cancels the self destruction). |
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
|
Posted - 2010.04.13 18:12:00 - [ 41]
Originally by: Haramir Haleths
Maybe he wont get killed by you. And sorry .... a Enyo WTF ? You didnt kill a Enyo in 2 Minutes and posting it in the forum. Man, shame on you. 
Didn't think I would ever have the urge to use this lazy-mans acronym, but: QFT. An Enyo? Really? You must have been in a noobship or something .. sweet mother of ..  |
Dmoney3788
Black Aces
Against ALL Authorities |
Posted - 2010.04.13 18:25:00 - [ 42]
|
Seriously Bored
Minmatar |
Posted - 2010.04.13 18:32:00 - [ 43]
Originally by: Dett K5
Too bad ejecting cancels a self-destruct sequence.
It doesn't. Unless it's something they allow for noob ships and not other ones, the ship still goes pop whether you're in it or not. I did it two days ago.  It also leaves behind loot as if it were destroyed normally, last I checked. The only difference is the lack of a KM, and it's on the pilot's terms, not the aggressor's. Beside that I completely agree with you. KM *****s can QQ some more, the ship is still floating dust in space. If you want more evidence for bragging rights, take a pic with Fraps. |
Ugly Bank |
Posted - 2010.04.14 10:09:00 - [ 44]
I fly A lot of frigs. Jaguar and dramiel for the most. Fights where I get involved often takes a pretty much over 2 minutes. Even with our corp or ally flying, we often have small ships. Try to take out 3 turtle drakes with 5 frigates in less than 2 minutes each? Try to take out a buffer mega with a jaguar in less than 2 minutes? How about a fight where a rapier and my jag got to fight against tengu, legion, drake and a raptor. The raptor was the only one to pop in less than 2 minutes. Drake and the tengu didnt pop, but thank god we got the legion. I lost my jag in my escape from the battlefield and my friend lost his rapier few moments before that. But checked from the logs, that that fight took 37 minutes. We were lucky that the opposing legion pilot was not one of those SD'ers.
And in all of these examples (whitch have happened) I really think, that I deserved the KM.
|
ExhumeToConsume |
Posted - 2010.04.14 10:55:00 - [ 45]
People who care about K/D ratios are terrible and should be forced to cry. Maximum tears means two things.
Self destructing ships generate killmails with the self-destructor as "laid the final blow". Now everyone can troll the moron who lost his expensive T3 pwnmobile to a T1 cruiser whilst drunk at the keyboard.
Self-destructing ships should continue to destroy all loot, thus causing emorage amongst the elite pirates desperate for that expensive loot drop. Moar trolls and forum whining!
That compromise should make everyone equally unhappy. My mission here is complete. Back to CAOD.
|
Daxx Arman
Gallente |
Posted - 2010.04.14 11:30:00 - [ 46]
Originally by: MR Spleen
Edited by: MR Spleen on 10/04/2010 04:29:30
People seem to concerned these days about loosing ships and will do anything to avoid a loss mail including self destructing, I beleive this is a load of bull die with honour if your gonna die.
However I'd like to propose a fix to this issue being something like gate or station agro whereby if your agressed you can't self destruct until your minute timer is up same as if you were at a gate or station this would reduce people self destructing just because they don't want a loss mail.
God dam, Boo Hoo, suck it up fella your giving pvp's a bad name. |
Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention
Middle of Nowhere |
Posted - 2010.04.14 13:00:00 - [ 47]
Originally by: Ugly Bank
But checked from the logs, that that fight took 37 minutes. We were lucky that the opposing legion pilot was not one of those SD'ers.
37 minutes? You were lucky he didn't just log off, went for a smoke and came back 15 minutes later to laugh at your dps. |
Ospie
Ransom and Kill
Core.Impulse |
Posted - 2010.04.14 13:33:00 - [ 48]
Originally by: Smabs
If you can't kill a ship in the two minutes it takes to self destruct, which will probably be well after you get a tackle, then you don't deserve the mail.
Well just sometimes a small gang takes on a cap and is killing it but can't chew through the tank / buffer in that 2 min. So what you're saying is you just think everyone should just bring 50 of their friends and just blob which isn't a great deal of fun and makes a pretty lame km anyway. Oh yeah, and there was this one time myself & another corpie in intys were soloing a myrm, he self destructed too... Honestly, people like you trolls just need to stfu :) I'm sorry if you don't enjoy 'epic against the odds' fights but SDing and removing all loot drops + km is just plain bad sportsmanship, if you don't want to lose **** then don't ****ing undock it. I'm proud when I say that none of my corp have ever SD'd anything when losing it in pvp, and we're the dishonourable ******* type. |
Aerilis
Gallente
Quantum Cats Syndicate
|
Posted - 2010.04.14 19:32:00 - [ 49]
It doesn't even have to take 2 minutes. SD every opportunity you get, and cancel is at the last second if you're not dying :D |
OwMy Bawls |
Posted - 2010.04.14 22:03:00 - [ 50]
Originally by: MR Spleen
Edited by: MR Spleen on 10/04/2010 04:29:30
People seem to concerned these days about loosing ships and will do anything to avoid a loss mail including self destructing, I beleive this is a load of bull die with honour if your gonna die.
However I'd like to propose a fix to this issue being something like gate or station agro whereby if your agressed you can't self destruct until your minute timer is up same as if you were at a gate or station this would reduce people self destructing just because they don't want a loss mail.
Bring on the emo rageing. 
Broken English, whining about lack honor in a video game, post editing . . .uh, looks like you beat everyone to the emo rage. But anyway, I agree with you that it is pretty lame to self-destruct to get out of a KM. However, it is just as pathetic to care enough that you didn't get that KM to whine about it on the forums. |
Omara Otawan |
Posted - 2010.04.14 22:13:00 - [ 51]
Originally by: Ospie
Well just sometimes a small gang takes on a cap and is killing it but can't chew through the tank / buffer in that 2 min. So what you're saying is you just think everyone should just bring 50 of their friends and just blob which isn't a great deal of fun and makes a pretty lame km anyway.
You are missing the point, the cap dies either way, someone lost his ship, thats what eve is about. If he destroyed it himself, or if it got killed by hostiles, that doesnt make a difference, it is still dead. Tbh, if your dps is that terrible, be glad he didnt just log off and survived. CCP should just remove killmails completely, and we would have a lot less ***gotry in the game. |
UnknownHarem |
Posted - 2010.04.14 23:22:00 - [ 52]
For those that say km is no big deal or that its just an OPTION. Well there are plenty of alliances that look at km's when corp go to join them.
Plus when you get that ship down to structure AND ITS GOING DOWN there should be a km weather or not he sd'ed or not.
My opinion is they should leave the sd alone and just add km's for when people sd when they got fired on and the km given to the top damage to the ship. |
Jamez Graand
101st Space Marine Force
Nulli Secunda |
Posted - 2010.04.15 17:11:00 - [ 53]
If I know I'm going to lose because I got hot dropped. I will gladly self destruct because I know that at least one person will be disappointed of the lack of KM. I wish they made it so all of your mods and cargo got destroyed when SDing. |
Boss Lemming
Gallente
BOUNTY. HUNTER. MINING. EXSPLORATION. CORPORATION.
HYDRA RELOADED |
Posted - 2010.04.15 17:51:00 - [ 54]
Originally by: Jamez Graand
I wish they made it so all of your mods and cargo got destroyed when SDing.
I've got good news for you brosef. |
Raetherana |
Posted - 2010.04.15 19:21:00 - [ 55]
Rough Necks alliance has this technique down to the wire. Whenever we catch their capitals with their panties down, they initiate self destruct.  |
eddie valvetino
Caldari
TunDraGon
Pandemic Legion |
Posted - 2010.04.16 11:21:00 - [ 56]
Edited by: eddie valvetino on 16/04/2010 13:56:52
I have to say I total agree with this...
caps are a real issue, you can often catch them with their pants down. and it does often take longer than 2 mins to kill them.
I don't really care about this dying with honour bull, but I do thing it's a lame tactic.. goes right along side the log in and log off, log in and off "exploit"
Simple answer is to deny insurance pay outs, including basic insurance.
happened to me this very morning, guy in a sleip tried it, got owned anyway, when smacked in local he complained, that he had been there for 1v1 pvp and the fact he had been ganked by 15 guys made it okay. of course, I'm sure he had NEVER ganked anyone... ever, not once, no sir, not him...
Truth is, he was faction fit and wanted to deny us the loots.
Maybe we should all just set the self destruct at the start of a fight and not even bother anymore. |
Deja Thoris
Invicta.
Rooks and Kings |
Posted - 2010.04.16 12:48:00 - [ 57]
What Eddie said.
Remove all insurance on self destruct.
Now choose. Does your wallet get hurt or does your e-peen?
Also, people typing crud like "if you can't kill it in 2 minutes you don't deserve the killmail" are probably the same einsteins complaining about blobbing in other threads. |
Krimishkev
GONE RETARD BACK LATER
|
Posted - 2010.04.16 13:55:00 - [ 58]
OP just think of it like this:
You have someone pointed, you forced them to wet their pants and self-destruct. They are cowards, and you win. Killmail, blah. You still won, and they will forever be known as cowards.
Double win.
|
Dett K5 |
Posted - 2010.04.16 14:47:00 - [ 59]
Originally by: Deja Thoris
Does your wallet get hurt or does your e-peen?
Also, people typing crud like "if you can't kill it in 2 minutes you don't deserve the killmail" are probably the same einsteins complaining about blobbing in other threads.
An obvious distinction between capitals and non-capitals has to be drawn. The OP made the thread based on an Enyo that self destructed, and Eddy mentioned a Sleipnir that tried to self destruct to his 15-man gang. In both cases, the 2 min timer ought to be enough to successfully kill the opponent. The Enyo from the op managed to self destruct, and the Sleipnir from above didn't. The e-peen deal is more to those that gank rather than to those that get ganked. In any case, I quote myself again: Originally by: Dett K5
The only actual concern with "self destructing" is the lack for generating a killmail, no? If a killmail were to be made, all the "QQ my target self destructed" whines would cease... but it wouldn't stop the act of self destructing. Also, the very purpose of a self destruction is to erase (protect) a record (or conceal something). In this case, by self destructing many can protect their fits, deny a km, produce some km-wh** tears, and deny a reliable record of the engagement ever happening.
|
Rocktown |
Posted - 2010.04.16 16:17:00 - [ 60]
Self destructing is gangsta |
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